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solomon levi
10-27-2009, 09:25 PM
A little reading in the old science books gave me some ideas on how to
simply produce beautiful blue copper solutions.

At first I thought I'd found the secret in the volatile alkali, so I mixed
ordinary dollar store ammonia with copper carbonate, and sure enough:

http://i88.servimg.com/u/f88/12/78/17/61/th/stibi_33.jpg (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=202&u=12781761)


Then I thought I'd verify if this was indeed the necessary ingredient,
so I mixed the ammonia again, this time with copper oxide. This did
extract a slight blue, but not nearly as rich and royal. It's the one on the
left in the pic below. Oddly, as I swirled the glass around to mix the oxide
with the ammonia water, the oxide rolled into balls of clay, whereas the
carbonate seems to dissolve, but then mostly precipitates back out as the
green powder.

http://i88.servimg.com/u/f88/12/78/17/61/th/stibi_34.jpg (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=203&u=12781761)


On the right in the above pic is the third experiment, which surprised me
because it was as succesful as the carbonate. This is ammonia and
copper sulfate. It's so beautiful, I made a vase of it:

http://i88.servimg.com/u/f88/12/78/17/61/th/stibi_35.jpg (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=204&u=12781761)



More experimenting is necessary, but perhaps ammonium carbonate (volatile
alkali) and ammonium sulfate (Glauber's Secret Sal Ammoniac) can be
retrieved from these solutions. Supposedly, copper sulfate + ammonia water
produces copper hydroxide and ammonium sulfate. And I suppose the
carbonate produces copper hydroxide and ammonium carbonate.

solomon levi
10-30-2009, 06:38 AM
I now have the best copper medicine I've produced so far.
It's not from the blues, but one of my old green ones.
The green was extracted with alcohol into a tincture and the alcohol
evaporated off. Not only is the green becoming more concentrated,
but it's also producing clear crystals which I didn't expect.

True Initiate
10-30-2009, 06:50 AM
Not only is the green becoming more concentrated,
but it's also producing clear crystals which I didn't expect.

Well you have re-crystalized them by evaporation. :D

solomon levi
01-31-2010, 01:06 AM
I've discovered that by lowering the pH of the copper sulfate solution
with water, a white precipitate falls out.
This could be a simple way to make good copper "m-state", as I've made it
once before but did not get a clean white precip and it made me feel yucky.
Copper ormes should be white before ingestion.

Also, if the copper is attached to ammonia, it will be a greater mercury and
easier to extract a tincture if one wishes.

solomon levi
07-27-2011, 10:20 PM
I've prepared a simple spagyrical tincture with these ammonia extracts.
Since they are already high alkali, I figured they could be extracted with alcohol
just as in the ens process. I'vr taken small ammounts ( about two drops in a glass of water)
and have had lots of visions with my "twin" and the mystic feminine. Pretty simple...
just some ammonia and copper carbonate and alchohol and potassium carbonate to dry
the alcohol and water. Just add potash until they separate like the ens.

http://i48.servimg.com/u/f48/12/78/17/61/th/pict0821.jpg (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=403&u=12781761)

Aleilius
07-28-2011, 12:22 AM
Nice one! I need to get my lab back in order soon. All this work I'm seeing from you guys is giving me that itch that can't be scratched except by lab work. :D

Have you tried the KM with copper yet?

solomon levi
07-28-2011, 03:10 AM
No, I havent made KM.
My next task is to fuse metals (minerals) with sand to extract their tinctures
in the oil of sand and then do this same alcohol extraction off that like the ens process.

Aleilius
07-29-2011, 12:30 AM
No, I havent made KM.
It's pretty cool. I recommend it. If you don't have any sal ammoniac available you can add sea salt to putrefied urine, evaporate to dryness, and then sublimate it until the volatile salt rises. You don't have to add sea salt to urine in order to obtain a volatile salt, but the volatile salt from urine per se is mostly ammonium carbonate/bicarbonate/carbamate. Adding a chlorine source will give you mostly ammonium chloride. You might be able to add muriatic acid instead of sea salt. Should work the same.


My next task is to fuse metals (minerals) with sand
Sounds like a cool experiment. Forgive me for digressing to chemistry related vulgarity, but you should end up with metallic silicates from fusion of a metal with sand. Ever tried the crystal garden experiment? It's pretty neat, and the growth is related to the formation of metallic silicates.

I tried something like this a while back with sodium silicate, and iron (III) chloride. The result was a rust brown glutenous precipitate that yielded a red tincture upon extraction with various agents. I was planning on trying this with copper, silver, and gold, but I didn't have enough time (was right before I had to put my lab up, and to move).


then do this same alcohol extraction off that like the ens process.
Do you have a distillation setup? It would be interesting to see if you could bring the sulphur of the metal over via distillation. Supposedly, each time you do this it raises the vibrational/astral signature of the sulphur. To a degree I'm reminded of the seven flights of the eagle, but it's a bit different.

solomon levi
07-29-2011, 11:50 PM
Sounds like a cool experiment. Forgive me for digressing to chemistry related vulgarity, but you should end up with metallic silicates from fusion of a metal with sand. Ever tried the crystal garden experiment? It's pretty neat, and the growth is related to the formation of metallic silicates..

Yeah. I'm thinking/hoping that in this silicate form they will surrender their tinctures more readily, hopefully to alcohol
so I don't have to distill. I can distill, but that requires more time and attention. :)




I tried something like this a while back with sodium silicate, and iron (III) chloride. The result was a rust brown glutenous precipitate that yielded a red tincture upon extraction with various agents. I was planning on trying this with copper, silver, and gold, but I didn't have enough time (was right before I had to put my lab up, and to move)..

I keep running into iron chloride. Newton's experiment with sodium silicate was done on iron chloride.

theFool
07-30-2011, 06:52 PM
I've prepared a simple spagyrical tincture with these ammonia extracts.
Since they are already high alkali, I figured they could be extracted with alcohol
just as in the ens process. I'vr taken small ammounts ( about two drops in a glass of water)
and have had lots of visions with my "twin" and the mystic feminine. Pretty simple...
just some ammonia and copper carbonate and alchohol and potassium carbonate to dry
the alcohol and water. Just add potash until they separate like the ens.

http://i48.servimg.com/u/f48/12/78/17/61/th/pict0821.jpg (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=403&u=12781761)

I mixed copper carbonate and ammonia carbonate. It fizzed and gave the characteristic blue solution, like in your photos. Then, I tried to extract some of it with 95% alcohol, by pouring it carefully on top of the solution (they do not mix). It doesn't seem to change color to blue.

One other part of the blue solution, was mixed with potassium carbonate and then alcohol was added. I was surprised to observe the precipitation of a white solid and the instant "blueing" of the alcohol. You can see in the following photo, left is the alcohol without adding carbonate, right with carbonate.

http://i47.servimg.com/u/f47/13/27/64/97/cop110.jpg

Not easily seen, but the white precipitate is there. Also I think some ammonia was produced, judging by the smell. All of this is very intriguing to me. I wonder what is this soluble stuff in the alcohol. A quick check showed me that copper carbonate is not soluble in alcohol. If ammonia-copper complex was soluble, it would have dissolved in the first experiment. Also the white precipitant, is it just copper carbonate (does it fizz in HCl) or some kind of ormus.

Thanks for sharing solomon, I think that this experiment is the result of a great intuition and knowledge.

theFool
07-31-2011, 08:39 AM
I tried some of the tincture, about 1/10 of a drop. I slept through the night with my "mind screen" open. I appreciate music and beautiful things around me. This tincture feels gay!

According to wikipedia, "Almost all metal ions bind ammonia as a ligand" and especially the platinum group metals and transition metals. So, we can use ammonia to open up other metals too.
I already have used it to open gold, it gives also a blue solution (I hope the gold didn't have any copper impurities).
What about iron, what color has the complex of ammonia and iron?

Thanks again sol, great discovery.

theFool
07-31-2011, 09:08 AM
Do you have a distillation setup? It would be interesting to see if you could bring the sulphur of the metal over via distillation.
Great idea Aleilius. Upon evaporation in the air, the tincture leaves back transparent crystals with a blueish hue.
Could it be that ammonium carbonate and some potassium carbonate is made soluble in alcohol ? (normally they are not)
More to test soon..

Weidenfeld
07-31-2011, 10:25 AM
But in its entirety these solutions are just more or less poisonous chemical solutions. Every aspirant in a chemical lab stumbles on these copper sulfate crystals already a his very start. I admit these are nice baubles but nothing more.

theFool
07-31-2011, 12:16 PM
Great idea Aleilius. Upon evaporation in the air, the tincture leaves back transparent crystals with a blueish hue.
Could it be that ammonium carbonate and some potassium carbonate is made soluble in alcohol ? (normally they are not)
More to test soon..
.. I dropped some 95% alcohol upon those crystals and observed that they are not soluble. So the blue tincture we extract is not exactly an alcoholic tincture but probably has water in it. In an attempt to dissolve those crystals, I dropped some water on them, part of them dissolved but also a greenish precipitate formed, obviously copper carbonate (or copper ormus if you like). Now, how was it soluble before in the blue alcoholic tincture, I don't know exactly to explain.

More tests on the crystals, showed that they evaporate upon heating (ammonium carbonate) and on higher temperature, the residue turns black (formation of CuO by copper carbonate decomposition). A test with HCl on the black residue shows fizzing, which I presume can be attributed to the existence of K2CO3 in the blue tincture. Also the black residue dissolved (probably forming copper chloride).

In one other test, copper carbonate was mixed with ammonium carbonate and alcohol (no water). The alcohol didn't turn blue.

The possible existence of copper ions in this tincture makes it unfit for ingestion.

What remains to be checked, is the distillation of the alcohol out of the blue tincture, leaving behind all the solids. But then will the alcohol have the venutian character and produce similar effects upon ingestion?

theFool
07-31-2011, 07:36 PM
A small quantity of the blue tincture was distilled. Almost half of it was distilled at around 80deg. celsius, the rest at 100deg. I presume that half of it was alcohol and half water. The distillate was transparent. It has a ph of around 8.5.
In the flask, a green salt remained which fizzes with HCl.

Other observation: the deep blue water that remains under the tincture (after separation is done with K2CO3) has the property of forming tiny bubbles throughout all its mass when it is diluted with water. They stay for some hours before they dissapear. Obviously the phenomenon is somehow connected with the ammonium carbonate in it.

solomon levi
08-01-2011, 06:35 PM
I mixed copper carbonate and ammonia carbonate. It fizzed and gave the characteristic blue solution, like in your photos. Then, I tried to extract some of it with 95% alcohol, by pouring it carefully on top of the solution (they do not mix). It doesn't seem to change color to blue.


You are mixing them by shaking and letting them separate?
You shouldn't have to pour the alcohol carefully. You want it to mix
and then their "phobic" qualities separate them after a moment.
I shake mine several times a day. It took a good color after three days,
but began showing color on the first day.

solomon levi
08-01-2011, 06:42 PM
I tried some of the tincture, about 1/10 of a drop. I slept through the night with my "mind screen" open. I appreciate music and beautiful things around me. This tincture feels gay!

Thanks again sol, great discovery.

LOL! Well, it's feminine. I've had some more female experiences while taking this tincture.
Pretty interesting. Some very real experiences of being female.
This is really appropriate for where I am initiation-wise, since I've been inbetween the green and white phases.
The green is iron and copper, male and female, sword-bearer and cup-bearer (kupfer).
Lots of androgynous or rebis visions and states.

theFool
08-01-2011, 10:32 PM
You are mixing them by shaking and letting them separate?
You shouldn't have to pour the alcohol carefully.
Yes sol, I did this only as a test, without throwing in K2CO3, to see if the copper-ammonia complex is soluble in alcohol.


You want it to mix
and then their "phobic" qualities separate them after a moment.
I did this in my second test tube. They separated and the alcohol was colored blue almost instantly. Probably I put too much potassium carbonate. As I write in previous post the alcohol that separates was not 95% (as it "should" be) but it takes some of the water in it.


LOL! Well, it's feminine. I've had some more female experiences while taking this tincture.
Pretty interesting. Some very real experiences of being female.
Yes, I find it interesting too. It works as "advertised" by alchemical tradition.
However, apart from those experiences, I got insomnia/poor sleep quality (as is the case with most of the ormus preparations also). Is there any way to avoid it? Can we purify somehow the tincture and keep only the good effects. This "maintenance of consciousness" throughout the night is annoying. Can someone who knows about tinctures (Salazius?) answer here please? It must be evolved? by digestion? Taken homeopathicaly? In its current form it is harsh with the body.

solomon levi
08-03-2011, 06:58 PM
Yes, I find it interesting too. It works as "advertised" by alchemical tradition.
However, apart from those experiences, I got insomnia/poor sleep quality (as is the case with most of the ormus preparations also). Is there any way to avoid it? Can we purify somehow the tincture and keep only the good effects. This "maintenance of consciousness" throughout the night is annoying. Can someone who knows about tinctures (Salazius?) answer here please? It must be evolved? by digestion? Taken homeopathicaly? In its current form it is harsh with the body.

I was just reading about Reichenbach and Od and how the cold blue Od is conducive to sleep
while the red, hot Od is irritating. Alkalis were found to belong to the irritaing group while halogens were cool and pleasant.
I feel the answer is in there somewhere. Iron and copper and gold are all Od hot.

Salazius
08-04-2011, 07:13 AM
However, apart from those experiences, I got insomnia/poor sleep quality (as is the case with most of the ormus preparations also). Is there any way to avoid it? Can we purify somehow the tincture and keep only the good effects. This "maintenance of consciousness" throughout the night is annoying. Can someone who knows about tinctures (Salazius?) answer here please? It must be evolved? by digestion? Taken homeopathicaly? In its current form it is harsh with the body.

Generally 'sleep - non sleep' occurs when one has some charges of energy in the aura, in order to sleep well one should make some banishing ritual or energetical grounding with roots going deep in earth and releasing the surplus of energy. Taking the tincture only in the morning is also a solution.
I know well this state and it's indeed tiring.

theFool
08-04-2011, 08:10 AM
Generally 'sleep - non sleep' occurs when one has some charges of energy in the aura, in order to sleep well one should make some banishing ritual or energetical grounding with roots going deep in earth and releasing the surplus of energy. Taking the tincture only in the morning is also a solution.
I know well this state and it's indeed tiring.
Thanks for sharing your opinion. Probably it is related to some kind of "energy" overflow in the channels but I don't have the ability to perform a proper grounding and see if it works to aleviate the problem. My spagyric plant tinctures, although very energizing at times (heat/sweating), never gave me this effect, instead they provide a short but deep, refreshing sleep.
I still think that something is missing from the preparation of those metallic and mineral tinctures, needed to balance them.


I was just reading about Reichenbach and Od and how the cold blue Od is conducive to sleep
while the red, hot Od is irritating. Alkalis were found to belong to the irritaing group while halogens were cool and pleasant.
I feel the answer is in there somewhere. Iron and copper and gold are all Od hot.
I am thinking in the same lines, tinctures with yin and yang qualities.

solomon levi
11-09-2011, 07:45 PM
I just found out that they call this "eau celeste". Interesting name.

http://www.google.com/search?q=eau+celeste&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=