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Andro
02-01-2011, 12:42 PM
About and from Codex Lugubrum (printed in 1535)
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Note: According to the correction made by Teofrast40, the actual title of the book is:

D. Hilarii Pictauorum episcopi Lucubrationes quotquot extant : olim per Des. Erasmum Roterod. haud mediocribus sudoribus emendateanno 1570
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In this book, a new character appears. A character that is merely mentioned in only few old books. This character is called The Separator.
It is said that when God ordered there to be Light from the Darkness, between the absolute darkness and absolute light there is a border. Like a border between countries. A 'No Man’s Land'.

This Separator is an entity, is a character, that appears only in few works over the globe. Mostly in 11th and 12th century manuscripts.
The people who wrote about him in their works were so haunted that they changed his name from The Separator to Anonymous.

Here is a story of a Knight, actually an Assassin (around the 12th century) who was paid by diverse kings and aristocrats to kill their enemies.
The Knight was known to be one of the best professionals of that epoch, he never failed and he killed anyone, anytime, anywhere - no matter how important the target was.
King if you were, if he got the command - you were already as good as dead. He, however, did not pick his victims - he only picked the sum of money.
He killed princes, duchesses, kings, heavy politicians and also big church figures.

This mercenary has a revelation around the age of 50. At that time there weren’t many who lived up to that age. He realizes that one of the kings he had killed was a good man who was protecting his people and land.
He changes his mentality completely. He starts to take revenge on all those who ordered him murders. One by one he starts to kill them. He wants to start doing ‘good’.

As he kills them, he realizes that a very important character for the killer commanders was an old priest who was kept somewhere in the depths of the earth, in a prison full of water and rats;
A kind of a monk with white beard, long hair, who had some theories which were inconvenient to some sections of the zone of those who ordered the crimes.
Knowing that the monk hasn’t got much time to live and that the next day he will be caught and killed, he doesn’t have time to make a plan how he used to.

He was a great name in that period. He was called Amantes and it was said he was of noble origin.

Anyway... he rescues the priest in the night and takes the old man out of the prison... The old man is hurt, full of diseases, bitten by rats... but he will survive.
But the fact that he will have to carry him on his back and pass the whole stronghold doesn’t assure him that perfection of moving like he was used to.

He was hurt two times but the wounds were not deadly but being forced to carry the old man, he realized that the loss of blood will eventually cause his death. With no village around, he stops in a forest.
The priest blesses him and the Knight responds to him that he doesn’t believe in any god. He says goodbye to the priest and tells him to leave him to die alone in the shadow of a tree. He stays there and waits to die.

It is said that when the priest left, a hole opened in the ground and a very strong demon appeared (some say Lilith). The demon came to take the Knight to Hell.
They even have a discussion, in which the demon tells him she came personally to collect him, being sent by Satan to take him with honors because he committed so much evil.

After that, the Knight tells the demon that he will also kill all the demons in Hell and that he will rule over Hell. During this exchange of words, an angel of light appears (probably Anael).
The angel says that the Knight belongs to God, because he did so much good in the last years that he exceeded the evil he made and that God had forgiven him and wanted him in Heaven.
Then, the demon and the angel pull out their swords to fight over him. In that moment, suddenly there appears a character which the angels knew of, but had never seen him.

According to the book, only two entities saw him: God and Lucifer. They had seen Him only once in their whole existence…
It was The Separator – Anonymous, who is that famous character with a hood.

Behind his eyes there is nothing. He’s got a cloak, bound at the middle with a rope... his arms and feet can’t be seen.

Tolkien was inspired by this character when making The Lord Of The Rings (The Nazgul).
Also in Harry Potter, the Dementors are an illustration of this Separator.

The Separator makes a single gesture and the two angels freeze; then he tells them that they’re both wrong, that the Knight had done something that never happened in the Universe.
He had done good and evil in equal measure. And that because in this case there is a balance, none of them will have him.

The two angels disappear because the power of The Separator is Absolute.

He tells the Knight that he can rise up, because he doesn't have a wound anymore. The Knight rises and The Separator gives him one single message:

“You will live as long as you want. If you do 'evil', it's OK because it will be balanced by the universal power, because others will be born to do good. If you will do 'good', it still doesn’t matter.
There will be others who will do 'evil'. Do 'good', do 'evil', you don’t matter anymore, you no longer exist for this Universe. Live on Earth as much as you want, until humanity will disappear.
You can transmute instantly anywhere you want with the power of your mind: on the Sun, on Stars, on other planets, in other universes, anywhere you want.
When you will get tired of this, call me and I will explain to you what is our purpose.”

The Separator made himself unseen, and according to legend, the Knight still lives today among us.
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Albion
02-01-2011, 03:39 PM
Timely/wyrd for me to read this post as the subject of “balance” has come to the forefront for me the last 4 days or so. It was probably triggered by reading articles on the Eductive Future Group site, such as the two linked below [and a number of others in the “Archives” section]:

http://eductivefuturegroup.com/design-mechanics-the-illusion-and-real-dimensions/

http://eductivefuturegroup.com/what-is-the-illusion-about/

[I’m neither particularly endorsing the site nor inferring that the author’s concepts of “balance” are particularly akin to your own - just including the links because an idea or two therein might be useful to someone.]

Since then, something about the nature of balance has been cycling into my awareness as a current theme of sorts. Just a few hours ago [about an hour before you submitted your post] I was feeling, for lack of a better phrase, a sort of identification with the edge between the two “halves” of the Yin/Yang symbol - which really isn’t anything at all - so it wasn’t a reification of identification with an image or shape as such.

Sorry, this is vague. I’ve only slept 2 hours in the last 53 and so I’m in a “between” state in more ways than one. I just wanted to leave this note while it is fresh in my mind. Later, I’ll attempt to better comprehend your post on its own terms.

Andro
02-01-2011, 04:30 PM
The Great State of In-Between is a Great State to Live In (Between) :)
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In the above commentaries from that rare book, it is worth focusing on the 'Separator' character. The Separator is also mentioned by some Alchemical writers, the 'True Mason' included...

He is wearing a cloak, nothing behind his eyes, no visible body parts.

A cloak which makes him invisible to the Universe itself (like our main hero/assassin also becomes), not to mention invisible to Death as well.

Note that, in a sense, we have a similar 'Cloak' effect during Lunar Eclipses (Spring and Autumn) and also during 'regular' Full Moons, to some extent.

It is also worth focusing on our Hero/Assassin, who is in fact Our Alchemist, having gone to the extremes of Darkness and Light, ending up liberated from all fear, resting under a tree and awaiting his death, while the forces of duality battle with each other for 'ownership' of his Soul - when the Most Powerful Middle Path of the truly Omnipotent Separator is revealed to him in an almost Cyliani-style 'dream sequence'.

And BTW, I could have posted the above book commentary in the Practical Alchemy section just as well...
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teofrast40
02-01-2011, 06:51 PM
hi androgynous,
please believe me when I say I don't want to offend you, but I have the suspect this text to be a false.
a quick scan on worldcat reveals nothing (and if it has been printed it should be there).
the more, the person who wrote it seems to ignore latin: the name of the character is a strange mix of an italian definite article (the) with a wrong latin term (separatio means separation, while separator would be, just like in english, separator).
probably this won't upset you, as I often red from you citations of tv series/hollywood movies as alchemical sources (again, no disrespect in this: everyone is free to find inspiration wherever he wants), but I would not consider it to be part of the alchemical corpus.
with humility
t

Andro
02-01-2011, 08:03 PM
Please believe me when I say I don't want to offend you, but I have the suspect this text to be a false.
A quick scan on worldcat reveals nothing (and if it has been printed it should be there). The more, the person who wrote it seems to ignore latin: the name of the character is a strange mix of an italian definite article (the) with a wrong latin term (separatio means separation, while separator would be, just like in english, separator). Probably this won't upset you, as I often red from you citations of tv series/hollywood movies as alchemical sources (again, no disrespect in this: everyone is free to find inspiration wherever he wants), but I would not consider it to be part of the alchemical corpus.

Please just look at the content. The rest I find completely irrelevant.

Is your every day life experience part of the 'officially' sanctioned 'alchemical corpus'? Or a great song? Or a broken heart?

Who is Death, and who is its approved publisher?
____________________________________________

The claimed owner of the book is a passionate and well connected collector of extremely rare items. He is also not a native English or Latin speaker. The first post is his commentary, by the way.

Is this particular item 'genuine'? I don't know.

Do I care if it's 'genuine'? You know the answer.

And it is (for me) very much in line with the 'alchemical corpus' more than oh-so-many other 'genuine' publications I have read over the years.

It is like someone once said to me (on this forum) that my words mean less to him than the words of some grand master of some known order.

And I am not in the least offended or upset :)

I posted this on a public forum, and it is only natural to receive all sorts of comments.

But - I sincerely suggest to read the text carefully insted on focusing on the surrounding technicalities.

If you can't find the text in your searches, you can simply treat it as "The Text That Appeared On Alchemy Forums Out Of Nowhere", and use your own discerment to see if it rings a bell (or two) inside you.
This has always been my M.O. - and so far, it has served me extremely well :)

All this 'alchemical corpus' and 'source material' dogma will likely keep aspiring alchemists imprisoned in a relatively narrow world view, IMO.

The Whole World, great and small alike, is the 'Alchemical Corpus' in the eyes of the Philosopher.

And there is only ONE 'Source Material'.

And we're ALL made of it :)

teofrast40
02-01-2011, 08:47 PM
I expected a reply of this kind.
I am not interested in starting a disputation with you on that matter. :) so please consider the following for what it is: just a personal opinion.
Of course I red the content. To me it could be a good plot for the next ps3 blockbuster.
I'm afraid no bells ringin' down here :)
Instead I hear bells and whistles when I read cosmopolite, limojon and many others from the alchemical corpus.
you are free to consider this as dogmatism, as I am free to consider the most of contemporary alchemy as deliriousness and ignorance of the sources :)

Andro
02-01-2011, 10:54 PM
Hi Teo,

Of course we are entitled to our own opinions and interpretations. No quarrel at all - it's the way of things!

But if you wish to take the route of the 'alchemical corpus', as you call it - let us not forget that the Separator Archetype goes back to the Emerald Tablet, and is further mentioned by various other authors, like for example the author of 'Compass of the Wise'. And I personally find the original thread-starting text to be highly illuminating regarding the Separator's archetypal qualities. And being a potential blockbuster does not at all need to conflict with the alchemical qualities of the material.

What makes a text 'orthodox'? What makes it Alchemical? The claimed date of publishing? The claimed Author? The cultural or traditional view of what it should be? The fact that it got more publicity than others, more obscure?
Whether it does or does not mention the traditional keywords, such as stone, tincture, mercury, elixir, sun/moon, etc?

Or is it the text's ability to convey to the analogical mind the roots and archetypal qualities of Creation?

Or, taking another angle: Would you consider fairytales such as coming from Grimm (http://www.literaturecollection.com/a/grimm-brothers/561/) and Andersen to be outside the alchemical corpus? What about Caroll and Swift?

I fully agree that a text may resonate with some more than with others. A simple matter of compatibility and diversity :)

On the other hand, I'm sure Constantine was very decisive as to what counts as 'true corpus' (in his own cultural/temporal/political vision) when he edited out/blacklisted the more alchemical gospels.
These are still considered non-corpus for the majority of christians, up to this day.

In the end, I believe it's not really a question of what is in accordance with Source Material or Alchemical Corpus, but rather of what truly, really works for you.

And usually, we tend to post on these forums what works for us - mentally, emotionally, spiritually or physically in the lab.

And this is what I did. I posted what works for me. MY OWN CORPUS. No more, no less.

And by the way, contemporary true Alchemy is very much alive - just not in bookstores or on publicly accessible Internet forums. FYI.

And no quarrel at all :)

vega33
02-02-2011, 03:38 AM
Hi Teo,

Of course we are entitled to our own opinions and interpretations. No quarrel at all - it's the way of things!

But if you wish to take the route of the 'alchemical corpus', as you call it - let us not forget that the Separator Archetype goes back to the Emerald Tablet, and is further mentioned by various other authors, like for example the author of 'Compass of the Wise'. And I personally find the original thread-starting text to be highly illuminating regarding the Separator's archetypal qualities. And being a potential blockbuster does not at all need to conflict with the alchemical qualities of the material.


Funny you should mention this, I was just rereading this section of Compass today. Boehme, who they were quoting, was a great author and while I don't claim to fully understand him by any stretch of the imagination, his explanation is very much on the mark. Definitely a text I'd recommend others reading.

Andro
02-02-2011, 11:07 AM
Here are some video captures I managed to take of the mentioned book, as it is held and presented by the owner/collector:

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex1.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex2.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex3.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex4.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex5.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex6.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex7.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex8.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex9.jpg

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Codex10.jpg

Andro
02-02-2011, 12:00 PM
I was just rereading this section of Compass today.

Both 'Compass of the Wise' and the book I brought up in this thread, for some reason mention Desiderius Erasmus Roterodamus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desiderius_Erasmus) (October 28, 1466 – July 12, 1536).

Vega, do you by any chance posses a copy of 'Compass of the Wise' in German, but printed with Latin letters (as opposed to the old German Script PDF version which I have) ?

I am a German speaker, but the old 'Deutsche Schrift' is giving me a really hard time...

Andro
02-02-2011, 12:39 PM
I often red from your citations of tv series/hollywood movies as alchemical sourcess, but I would not consider it to be part of the alchemical corpus.

And also songs. Many songs are Hard Alchemical Corpus to me. Like this one for example, who fits quite well in the context of this thread:

Quoth 'Death Cab for Cutie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYF8cUlbs3I)':


If heaven and hell decide
That they both are satisfied
Illuminate the No's on their vacancy signs

Quoth 'The Separator':


When you will get tired of this, call me and I will explain to you what is our purpose.

And back to the song:


You and me have seen everything to see
From Bangkok to Calgary
And the soles of your shoes are all worn down
The time for sleep is now
It's nothing to cry about
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teofrast40
02-02-2011, 04:17 PM
dear androgynous,
I really don't have any problem in recognizing my faults when proven wrong (you should remember my recent apologies for the case of works on urine), but, sadly, the photos you show here just confirm my suspect.
Namely, the book that this person is holding in his hand is a copy of
D. Hilarii Pictauorum episcopi Lucubrationes quotquot extant : olim per Des. Erasmum Roterod. haud mediocribus sudoribus emendateanno 1570
it's a book coming from the christian reformation milieu, nothing to do with alchemy, and certainly not this mysterious liber lugubrum.. :) by the way lucubrationes means elucubrations, a different term alltogether from lugubrium (plural genitive of lugubris=lugubrious)
There's really nothing wrong in finding inspiration everywhere, just one shouldn't swallow anything that's put in front of him without discernement :)
regarding the Compass, I can't help you for the german version, but you should find an english translation by Leo Muller in the most recent RAMS dvd
with humility
t
P.S alchemical corpus is not a religious term, it's just a technicality to express the whole literature pertaining to alchemy. if you tomorrow would write an alchemy book, it would be part of it

Andro
02-02-2011, 05:15 PM
dear androgynous,
I really don't have any problem in recognizing my faults when proven wrong (you should remember my recent apologies for the case of works on urine), but, sadly, the photos you show here just confirm my suspect.
Namely, the book that this person is holding in his hand is a copy of
D. Hilarii Pictauorum episcopi Lucubrationes quotquot extant : olim per Des. Erasmum Roterod. haud mediocribus sudoribus emendateanno 1570
it's a book coming from the christian reformation milieu, nothing to do with alchemy, and certainly not this mysterious liber lugubrum.. :)
There's really nothing wrong in finding inspiration everywhere, just one shouldn't swallow anything that's put in front of him without discernement :)
regarding the Compass, I can't help you for the german version, but you should find an english translation by Leo Muller in the most recent RAMS dvd
with humility
t

Hey T :)

I may well have been wrong about the book title - the collector himself presented it as 'Codex Lugubrum' (which may or not be a sub-chapter, I don't know), and he also said that it had christian reformation content - but my discernment is not based on cover and platform. It was that particular story from the book that completely blew me away, in a purely Alchemical sense, with its philosophical and also PRACTICAL implications. Also, there is certain alchemical symbolism in the book, otherwise what would a Caduceus do on a christian reformation platform? (yes, I know it's a widespread symbol, but still...) I will also repeat that 'Compass of the Wise' mentions Des. Erasmus Roterodamus - so, it may very well be that this reformation was attempted by certain R+C groups, and it is very plausible to assume that it may have come under a variety of guises.

Nevertheless, the story I have shared here would IMO be best taken in without any bias based on the platform from which it was written. Fairytales are Alchemy books to me. Art as well.
But thanks for explaining your perception of what Alchemical Corpus is.

I have an older RAMS collection and for some reason they are not updating me about new releases, in spite of their promise to do so, and they also usually don't respond to my emails.

In any case, thanks for the clarification about the book title. I have edited the initial post to incorporate your correction.
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Salazius
02-02-2011, 06:57 PM
Do go back to the point you are stressing here Andro, about the "separator", it is also a principle of equilibrium, between two polarities, Heaven and Hell for example, we will have a kind of "no man's land".
Separator is for me, an equilibrator, borned by the action of the two opposed forces, a dwelling place to keep balance (libra), but in the matter/dualistic world.

For now, this is what come to me.

teofrast40
02-02-2011, 07:16 PM
ok, let's see..
apparently this book should be a collection of works by Hilary of Poitiers (a theologist and doctor of the church, circa 300 A.D.) revised by Erasmus (quite known for his Praise of folly and for having somehow contributed to reformation, despite having remained catholic for the whole of his life). none of them appears in any alchemical bibliography I'm aware of (no mention in Ferguson). Of course alchemy (and rosicrucianism) spreaded quite a lot in reformated areas. still, IMHO here we are in theological domain, so no direct connection to alchemy, but, not having red the book I shout my mouth.
regarding the compass, check your private mail
t

Andro
02-02-2011, 07:32 PM
Do go back to the point you are stressing here.

Good point :)


Separator is for me, an equilibrator, borned by the action of the two opposed forces, a dwelling place to keep balance (libra), but in the matter/dualistic world.

Sometimes it takes a Sword (Mars/Aries) as an Equilibrator to keep the Balance (Venus/Libra) :)


Between two polarities, Heaven and Hell for example, we will have a kind of "no man's land".

This 'No Man's Land' concept is very interesting from the Alchemical perspective. A 'Place' where the dualistic and polaric forces of this World and Universe have diminished powers, or no powers at all.

The Separator wears a Cloak - or a 'cloaking device' - to deflect/deviate/absorb the vulgar/dualistic forces which impede the manifestation of the much great power of the In-Between in our physical dualistic realm.

This cloak/separator creates a Field which is like a 'Bubble' or a 'Womb', where the normal vulgar and dualistic forces apply to a much lesser extent.
A special place is thus created for a much more noble and powerful Apparition/Manifestation.

God and the devil, good and evil, heaven and hell (common polarity archetypes of various belief systems) are powerless, once the Separator enters the scene. We are now literally in 'No Man's Land'.
An escape hatch has been created, a 'Zero/Null Point', from which access to Non-Duality is possible, resulting in Liberation.

Not only access to Non-Duality, but also access to the possibility for the Alchemical/Philosophical Hermaphrodite to gradually manifest in our midst, having a physical appearance. This is the part of Practical Lab Alchemy.

When we understand and properly employ this 'Separator' or this 'Cloak' - it creates Our Field of 'No Man's Land', which is our Philosophical Athanor.

On our way to the Promised Land, we must pass though the Desert/Null Point/No Man's Land. The Separator.

Quoth Morpheus to Neo:


"Welcome to the Desert of the Real"

A Desert so thirsty for Our Water...

Normally, the Separator is an infinitely fine line - but we can inflate this fine thread to actually make a 3D Hole/Womb/Bubble in 'normal' space, for the Great Work to take place 'In There' by itself.

Cabala, Speculum... (http://www.flickr.com/photos/bibliodyssey/3537398049/in/photostream/)

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Speculum.jpg

Like taking an Axis and inflating it into a Planet... Axis Mundi... Or Sleeping Beauty and her Spindle... these are the best metaphors I can come up with right now. More to come, hopefully...

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/Pricking_Spindle.jpg
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Andro
02-02-2011, 07:40 PM
regarding the compass, check your private mail

I will. Thank you very much!

Donna Matrix
02-09-2011, 04:43 AM
Funny, I never equated a speculum with the luminal boundary- but what do I know?:)

Joshua
02-09-2011, 09:30 AM
Funny, I never equated a speculum with the luminal boundary- but what do I know?:)

Speculum is Latin for "mirror," I believe.

Andro
02-09-2011, 10:56 AM
I never equated a speculum with the luminal boundary

What about Carroll[...]?

Speculum is Latin for "mirror," I believe.

Alice had, in turn, a Rabbit Hole and Speculum (looking glass).

We are so focused on this reality or the other... Real World or Wonderland, Kansas or Oz, etc... that we tend to miss the actual gateways... SEPARATORS...

What is never plainly revealed in the 'Alchemical Corpus' often 'hides in plain sight' in legends and fairytales.

There is SO much more to these stories than meets the vulgar eye.

And the story of 'The Separator' (which started this thread), is one of the best I've encountered so far.

Andro
02-23-2011, 02:37 PM
The allegorical story of The Separator brings to our attention a mysterious THIRD 'deity', which is truly omnipotent and as such is placed above and beyond any and all dualistic archetypes.

This Separator is explicitly mentioned in 'Hermes Trismegist's Wahrer Alter Naturweg':


"Der Mensch, Minor Mundus, ist die Summa und Extract Majoris Mundi.
In Minore Mundi liegt der grosse Arcanum Macrocosmi, das grosse Universalgeheimniss.
Sheide nur das Böse vom Guten, du hast den Sheider bei dir, suche nur in dir."

My own translation:


"Man, the Microcosmos, is the Sum and Extract of the Macrocosmos.
In the Microcosmos lies the great Arcanum of the Macrocosmos, the great Universal Secret.
Separate only the Bad from the Good (Pure from Impure?), you have the Separator, look only in yourself."

In the same work, The Separator is mentioned as the Divine 'Instrument' used at the Creation of the World.

Questions to ask ourselves: What is our inner Separator? How can this Separator Principle be applied to practical lab work?

Rueb
02-24-2011, 04:44 AM
A few lines below these lines of the Separator in "Hermes Trismegist's Wahrer Alter Naturweg" you will find this part:


Von diesem Lichte meldet uns auch Moses in seinem Buche Cop. 1. wie Gott Himmel und Erde, Licht und Finsternisz aus dem groszen Chaos oder Wasser geschieden, und wie aus Wasser und Geist das Salz gebohren werde. Das Salz ist nun ein gut Ding, das herrlichste unter allen sichtbaren Wesen, der Saamen und das Korn der ganzen Welt. Unser Salz aber in der Luft, ist kein Salz, sondern nur ein Geist, und wird erst im Wasser zu einem Salz gebohren. Das Salz ist der gröszte Schatz und Reichtum der Welt, das Mittel-Wesen und aller Dinge Anfang und Ende. Es ist dieser der Geist, der indem er in der Luft wohnet, auch alle Saamen auf Erden, die Insecta nicht ausgenommen, lebend macht, er ist Alles in Allem. In der Erde wächset, blühet und sprosset er, in den Thieren belebet, verändert und kocht er, in den Bergwerken rauchet, durchdringet und figirt er. Wenn er durch Kunst gebrauchet wird, so erhält er das Leben und heilet alle Krankheiten und verändert die Metalle. In den Flüchtigen ist er flüchtig, in den Fixen ist er fix; in den Thieren thierisch; in Vegetabilien vegetabilisch; in Mineralien mineralisch, und in allen Dingen ist Dieser Geist einer durchdringenden und vollkommenen Eigenschaft und eines gar zarten und geistigen Wesens.

I understand this as that salt is a matrix to harbour and/or attract our first matter/spiritus mundi from the air/from the above which itself manifest as a saltpeter as so often called which is vulgar saltpeter.
"look only in yourself" only as in also ... The urine and body fluid works come to mind. We are after vulgar salts here.
The salt/saltpeter itself isn't the secret it is what this salt/saltpeter attracts/harbours in itself.

So what is so special about salts. It's their geometric forms.
Besides that isn't salt itself a union of good and bad or more like the union of one extreme with the other.
That no mans land lies within a salt.

If you separate a salt you get to its inner fire, to capture that is called the art. "The Separator brings to our attention a mysterious THIRD 'deity', which is truly omnipotent and as such is placed above and beyond any and all dualistic archetypes"
The Separator is us humans, the divine instrument is our intelligence and wisdom to do the work, to bring us the third deity, the spiritus mundi/the first matter.

... the above lines are thoughts of mine which are probably too materialistic ...
handle with care

Rueb

Andro
02-24-2011, 12:32 PM
Hi Rueb,

Since you are quoting from the German text of 'Alter Naturweg', I think it would be a good idea to translate your quoted segment into English (as I did), as a courtesy to readers who are not fluent in German.


The Separator is us humans, the divine instrument is our intelligence and wisdom.

Yes, to start with - but further insight is necessary to transpose and carry out The Work in the Realm of Matter.

Also, the First Matter/Universal Spirit is not [what I refer to as] 'The Third Deity', but merely the most Primordial Emanation of it.

It's like the first thing to come out the door of the corridor.

http://www.faqs.org/photo-dict/photofiles/list/493/874corridor.jpg

http://img.brothersoft.com/screenshots/softimage/0/3d_matrix_screensaver-endless_corridor-25349-2.jpeg
________________________________

Rueb
02-24-2011, 10:57 PM
I am sorry my english isn't that good to transcribe the essence and meaning of alchemical texts.
I am native german speaking from austria.

Rueb

Andro
05-19-2011, 03:22 PM
I often red from you citations of tv series/hollywood movies as alchemical sources, but I would not consider it to be part of the alchemical corpus.

At least do yourself/yourselves one HUGE favor and watch at least THIS EPISODE (http://www.watch-lost-online-free.com/Watch_Lost_Online_Season_6_Episode_15_Across_The_S ea.html) of the TV series 'Lost'.

IMO, it beats the hell (and heaven) out of certain aspects of the canonical 'Alchemical Corpus', as it is ridiculously forthcoming in some matters of Principle and Application.

'Our Water' is there, and its 'Source' as well... Not to mention countless other subtleties, which are not-so-subtle to the more subtle eye...

I most highly and strongly recommend watching the entire series, but the above linked online episode may well do the trick for the lazy (but smart) ones :)

If you decide to check out this lead and wish to comment and/or elaborate on any additional insights you may have gained from it, please take your comments to the Spiritus Mundi Thread (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2071-Spiritus-Mundi), where I feel they belong.
✂-----------------------------------

Salazius
05-24-2011, 01:05 PM
The Separator is the Principle used in the Lab in order to make a Distillation of the Water of Life. It is indeed a distillation, but a philosophical one, not a vulgar one. This is by this mean, by the Separator, the the Impure and the Pure are made apart.

Andro
06-12-2011, 03:20 PM
Here's a snapshot from 'Compass of the Wise', for whomever it might benefit:

http://i861.photobucket.com/albums/ab172/androgynus_album/SeparatorCompassQuote.jpg

I find it especially significant to notice the following section from the above quote, in the context of The Separator's 'Cloak':


"Shuts itself up against the emanation, against the introduction of Nature's egocentric will, operating with the Life-force of unity through Nature."
✂----------------------------------------------

Andro
09-17-2011, 01:12 PM
Read THIS (http://quantumpranx.wordpress.com/2009/03/03/kozyrevs-mirrors/#more-388).

Very much in context and on topic (Separator, No-Man's Land, etc...)

(For the slightly more scientifically inclined :))

Nibiru
10-01-2011, 01:38 AM
This is a short story of creation from the book "Pyramid Yantra for Vaastu" by: Dr. Dhara Bhatt that I thought was well written.

"Before time began, there was just an inconceivably large egg out of which P'an Ku was created. When he emerged from the shell, darkness poured out of the egg, but so did light. All that was clear and bright rose to the sky and all that were muddy and heavy fell to the earth. Since he was afraid that the brightness above would fall onto the darkness below, he held the two apart with both his arms for thousands of years. He did so until finally he collapsed with exhaustion. He offered himself fully to the world. His last breath became wind and clouds. his voice became thunder, his left eye became sun and right became the moon, his limbs and torso became the plains and mountains, his blood formed rivers and lakes, his muscles formed soil and tendons formed paths and roads, his hair and beard formed stars, fine body hair and skin became grass, trees and flowers, his bones, teeth and marrow changed to rubies, jade, and minerals, Thus, he gave birth to all life."

Ghislain
10-01-2011, 04:56 AM
Hi Nibiru

It says P'an Ku is a 'he'...isn't Mother Earth a 'she'?

Perhaps Androgynous?

Ghislain

Nibiru
10-01-2011, 09:04 AM
Hi Nibiru

It says P'an Ku is a 'he'...isn't Mother Earth a 'she'?

Perhaps Androgynous?

Ghislain
Hi Ghislain, good catch! I'd have to lean towards the latter, at least in this story's context, but the "he" may not be a reference to the earth .. The "He" in this quote reminded me of the seperator character from Androgynus's story, and that's why I posted it in this thread.

Moshe
01-26-2012, 01:07 AM
Do go back to the point you are stressing here Andro, about the "separator", it is also a principle of equilibrium, between two polarities, Heaven and Hell for example, we will have a kind of "no man's land".
Separator is for me, an equilibrator, borned by the action of the two opposed forces, a dwelling place to keep balance (libra), but in the matter/dualistic world.
For now, this is what come to me.

Yes, that is well said Salazius.
The Separator is an equilibrator in the matter / dualistic world.
like Libra - which is the only inanimate sign of the zodiac. It is a dead-neutral - not a thriving living balanced positive realm of male and female unified.

As such, despite having a pretty cool role in the world of matter/duality, and having a pretty mysterious look to him/It, I don't think the Separator has the power to or is as highly ranked as the story makes him out to be - then he'd be God, which he is not.

solomon levi
01-26-2012, 04:13 AM
When I first read this on the separator, I was reminded of Thomas Vaughn's "binarius".
Do these seem the same Androgynus, or a bit different context?

"You may remember how, in my former discourse of the nature of man, I mentioned a certain simplicity of elements according to their several complexions in the several regions of the world. I shall now speak of another triplicity --- much more obscure and mystical --- without which you can never attain to the former, for these three principles are the key of all magic, without whose perfect knowledge you can never truly understand the least idioms in Nature. The first principle is one in one and one from one. It is a pure, white virgin and next to that which is most pure and simple. This is the First Created Unity. By this all things were made --- not actually but mediately --- and without this nothing can be made, either artificial or natural. This is " Bride of God and of the Stars." By mediation of this there is a descent from one into four and an ascent from above by four to the invisible, supernatural Monad. Who knows not this can never attain to the Art, for he knows not what he is to look for.

The Second Principle differs not from the first in substance and dignity but in complexion and order. This second was the first and is so still essentially ; but by adhesion to the matter it contracted an impurity and so fell from its first unity, wherefore the magicians style it Binarius. Separate therefore the circumference from the centre by the diametrical line, and there will appear unto thee the philosopher's Ternarius, which is the Third Principle. This third is properly no principle but a product of Art. It is a various nature, compounded in one sense and decompounded in another, consisting of inferior and superior powers. This is the magician's fire, this is Mercury of the philosophers, that most famous Microcosm and Adam. This is the labyrinth and wild of magic, where a world of students have lost themselves --- a thing so confusedly and obscurely handled by such as knew it that it is altogether impossible to find it in their records. There is no late writer understands the full latitude and universality of this principle, nor the genuine metaphysical use thereof. It moves here below in shades and tiffanies, above in white ethereal vestures ; neither is there anything in Nature exposed to such a public prostitution as this is, for it passeth through all hands and there is not any creature but hath the use thereof. "
http://www.rexresearch.com/alchemy6/animagica.htm

And a different source:
http://books.google.com/books?id=diegxYk2zVEC&pg=PA153&lpg=PA153&dq=alchemy+binarius&source=bl&ots=Gn9zLqf7sS&sig=6u95tviSvMmCgU-Rphey-jgFsCU&hl=en&sa=X&ei=CNEgT6_tAcSliQLo2aX6Bw&sqi=2&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=alchemy%20binarius&f=false

Hmmm. I found another source that equates the serpent binarius to that one in the garden of eden which
persuaded Eve to eat the fruit.

Andro
01-26-2012, 04:18 AM
Moshe, you have interpreted the story in a very different way than me, which is great IF it works for you.

The Separator (in this context) is NOT Libra, but nevertheless encompassed by it.

The Separator is of an Aries/Mars nature, and also a Portal to non-duality FROM and TO a world of duality (Libra).

But we also need Libra (the scales, represented in this story by the archetypal oppo-same emissaries of 'god' and 'satan'), we need the utmost archetypal extremes of duality in order to move beyond it.


"Venus and Mars are the parents of the Stone."

Andro
01-26-2012, 04:23 AM
Sol,

Basically - Yes to all your points above.

:cool:

Andro
10-26-2014, 06:19 PM
Il Separatio - The Primordial Matrix (http://survivivore.wordpress.com/2012/05/17/il-separatio-the-primordial-matrix/)

Kiorionis
10-28-2014, 03:22 AM
The Separator is an interesting Character. After my last couple experiences with magic mushrooms, I've been looking into the 'grid' as it relates to alchemy and the Athanor.

Androgynus, your link to that blog post on the Primordial Matrix has made some connections for me :)

Chapter One of Sal Lumen Et Spiritus Mundi Philosophici or the Dawning of the Day begins with a similar character:


This vast Body then [the World], is indued with motion, yea, continually agitated therewith; and this motion cannot be wrought without some vital Spirit: for whatsoever wants Life, is immoveable. But here I mean not of violent motion from place to place, but of that, which in reference to a form, is privation to perfection, imperfection. The vegetation of Plants, and concretion of Stones, are effected by the motion of this universal Spirit, agitating this great Mass, and the mediation of a certain radical and nutritive Spirit, whose origine or principle, like some primary procreating cause, resides in the Centre of the Earth; and thence, as from the heart, exerts all vital functions, and extends itself through the whole Body. And this root or principle is included in the bosome of the ancient Demogorgon, that universal Parent, whom, old Poets, those diligent Searchers of Natures Secrets, have ingeniously described clothed in a green Cloak, obduced with rust, and covered with thick darkness; feeding all kindes of Animals, into whose belly, the virtues of the Celestial Luminaries, continually descend, penetrating the very bowels of the Earth, and impregnating it with all kindes of Creatures.

The addition of the Green Cloak wrapped in darkness is interesting to me, as it connects with the Hermetic Tree, and even the idea of the Black Sun. And continuing along, Sal Lumen defines the Demogorgon further:


where the elementary qualities and powers offer their services to this old Parent, as to the Producer and Distributer of all things; who continually occupies Iliastus, in dispensing of specifical forms; and Archeus, in exciting vital heat: which Iliastus and Archeus, are as it were two instruments, whereby he informs, conserves and augments all things.

Here note, that by Iliastus we mean a general Steward that affords matter for all generation; and by Archeus, natural or radical heat, which digests this matter, and acts upon it.

This Demogorgon then is he, by whome, as by his Instrument, God produces all things in and under Heaven: so that he containing his Iliastus and Archeus, does with singular providence, unknown to vulgar Philosophers, and therefore masked under the supplement of occult causes, form and generate, then nourish and preserve all things.


Besides this alchemical work, there is are references to the Demogorgon in literature. Plato's Dream (http://www-personal.umich.edu/~esrabkin/sf/PlatosDream.htm) by Voltaire:


Demogorgon received the lump of mold we call Earth, and having formed it as it now appears, thought he had created a masterpiece.

And lets not forget Medusa, the Gorgon, and her ability to turn men into Stone.


While descriptions of Gorgons vary across Greek literature and occur in the earliest examples of Greek literature, the term commonly refers to any of three sisters who had hair made of living, venomous snakes, as well as a horrifying visage that turned those who beheld her to stone. Traditionally, while two of the Gorgons were immortal, Stheno and Euryale, their sister Medusa was not, and she was slain by the demigod and hero Perseus.
http://i1071.photobucket.com/albums/u502/chorvidus/Medusa_zps5889a99b.jpg


The Demogorgon is similar to the Demiurge, in my opinion.

Kiorionis
05-12-2015, 11:13 PM
I was reading through the introduction to a translation of the Sepher Yetzirah and came across this paragraph. Thought I'd add it in case it sparks any connections.


The following interesting quotation is from Rabbi Moses Botarel, who wrote his famous Commentary in 1409:--"It was Abraham our Father--blessed be he--who wrote this book to condemn the doctrine of the sages of his time, who were incredulous of the supreme dogma of the Unity. At least, this was the opinion of Rabbi Saadiah--blessed be he--as written in the first chapter of his book The Philosopher's Stone. These are his words: The sages of Babylon attacked Abraham on account of his faith; for they were all against him although themselves separable into three sects. The First thought that the Universe was subject to the control of two opposing forces, the one existing but to destroy the other, this is dualism; they held that there was nothing in common between the author of evil and the author of good. The Second sect admitted Three great Powers; two of them as in the first case, and a third Power whose function was to decide between the two others, a supreme arbitrator. The Third sect recognised no god beside the Sun, in which it recognised the sole principle of existence."

Kiorionis
05-10-2016, 04:01 PM
I came across an interesting reference just now, from This Website (http://www.shivashakti.com/yaksh.htm)


The yakshas (male) and yakshinis (female) look after treasure hidden in the earth, and come under the dominion of the god Kubera.


The 64 Chetakas

These are servitors of Shiva, akin to elementals. Once drawn into service, they require nourishment. You have to keep this work force happy if you take them on.

They are (1) Amorous One (2) Vehicle (3) Heroic One (4) Separator (5) Angry One (6) Poet (7) Roaring like a Lion (8) Very Noisy (9) Beautiful [. . .]

zoas23
05-11-2016, 02:34 AM
The allegorical story of The Separator brings to our attention a mysterious THIRD 'deity', which is truly omnipotent and as such is placed above and beyond any and all dualistic archetypes.

This Separator is explicitly mentioned in 'Hermes Trismegist's Wahrer Alter Naturweg':

(...)

My own translation:

(...)

In the same work, The Separator is mentioned as the Divine 'Instrument' used at the Creation of the World.

Questions to ask ourselves: What is our inner Separator? How can this Separator Principle be applied to practical lab work?


First time I see this thread, but I completely follow your logic of the Third Deity who is the Instrument of the creation of the World and also a separator!

You can find much more on this issue is you read the Chaldean Oracles, where Hecate is the "Third Deity" (The First one is the First Mind, the Second one is the Second Mind or Nous).

Hecate is the one who creates the World, but is also the "membrane" or the "separator" or the "limit" (in the Oracles the word Horos is used: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%CF%8C%CF%81%CE%BF%CF%82 )

In some other interpretations of the Oracles, Hecate is NOT the "membrane" and the "separator" itself, but her mother (whilst the Hypezokos -Flower of Fire- or "Demiurge" is the Separator and the son of Hecate).

I follow the first interpretation.

If you don't want to get into the Oracles, a quick wiki article about it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaldean_Oracles#Metaphysics_of_the_Oracles

________________________________________

And since the Oracles and the philosophy of Plotinus and Porphyry are one and the same...

The First "God" is ONE (Hen)
The Second "God" is Nous ("Intellect", but not in the sense we use the word nowadays)...
And the Third "God" is Psyche ---> Who is Hecate in the Oracles and the "Anima Mundi" in several alchemical texts.

Needless to say that these "Macrocosmic" deities had a correspondence in the Microcosm and the Psyche of the Macrocosm is, of course, in correspondence with the Psyche of the Microcosm.

Psyche... the "Separator", the Greek "Horos".

EDIT: If anyone has the compass.... please, please, please, send it my way! ;)
EDIT #2: Compass no longer needed! ;)

Awani
01-19-2017, 12:38 AM
Continued from HERE (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?5097-Hermeticism-vs.-Gnosticism-Differences&p=47204#post47204).


The 'Looking Glass' or 'Dual Mirror' I've mentioned above has this interesting quality of reflecting our convictions back at us, even if they contradict each other :)

Now, to take these concepts a bit further, on our physical plane, this 'Looking Glass' or 'Veil' or 'Dual Mirror' (or Separator (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2002-The-Separator)) can be (metaphorically or not) associated with the surface/water level.

From the preface of Nietzsche's 'The Gay Science':

Where you stand, there dig deep!
Below you lies the well!
Let obscurantists wail and weep:
"Below is always - hell!"

The 'Light of the 'Black Sun' (limitless, UN-specified potential) rises from (below) Earth -> to (above) Heaven ('White Sun'/Left Brain/fixation/collapse of probability via Conscious Intent) and thus gathers the 'powers' of both 'Above' and 'Below', to accomplish the 'Miracle of One Thing'.

Are you trying to win me over by throwing Nietzsche in my face? LOL. Also I assume in this case "gay" means "happy"?

----------------------------------------------------

My mind is utterly not in this line of thinking, so I have problems understanding what you mean.

Could you re-write the above for an idiot please.

:cool:

Andro
01-19-2017, 07:34 AM
Are you trying to win me over by throwing Nietzsche in my face? LOL. Also I assume in this case "gay" means "happy"?

I'm nor trying to win anyone over.

Yes, 'gay' means 'merry' or 'happy'. That's what it always meant before it was hijacked by them faggots :p

The Gay Science (http://www.holybooks.com/wp-content/uploads/The-Gay-Science-by-Friedrich-Nietzsche.pdf)


Could you re-write the above for an idiot please.

I wrote in the most simple way I could (for the topic). And you're no idiot.

Maybe I'll attempt a different angle, with examples...

Murgen
05-24-2017, 09:22 PM
I've been searching for years after this information about "the separator".

When I was studying theology and Christian esotericism, no one (neither the priest nor the mason) could explain to me the whys and wherefores of the firmament that divide the waters during day 2.

So the "separator" is at work at day 1 and day 2.

Day 1: "[...] God divided the light from the darkness.[...]"
Day 2: "And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters [...]

The word translated as firmament refers to the notion of "solid dome".

An other riddle of that day 2 that has fascinated me for long: why is that the only day for which God does not say "And God saw that is was good". That Knight's tale shed light on the issue: it is equally good and bad.

Andro
05-24-2017, 09:51 PM
These verses from Genesis (that you are referring to) are indeed among the most significant Keys to Alchemy, in its actual, 'hands-on' practice. They are also quite well reflected in the Emerald Tablet and in many other 'Genesis' traditions & cosmologies.

I intend to expand a bit on this in the future, however I am currently very busy with other projects.

It's also related to THIS (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?4745-Flat-Earth&p=43620#post43620), but let's not go there now :p


I've been searching for years after this information about "the separator".

When I was studying theology and Christian esotericism, no one (neither the priest nor the mason) could explain to me the whys and wherefores of the firmament that divides the waters during day 2.

So the "separator" is at work at day 1 and day 2.

Day 1: "[...] God divided the light from the darkness.[...]"
Day 2: "And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters [...]

The word translated as firmament refers to the notion of "solid dome".

Another riddle of that day 2 that has fascinated me for long: why is that the only day for which God does not say "And God saw that is was good". That Knight's tale shed light on the issue: it is equally good and bad.

Kiorionis
06-28-2017, 12:40 AM
From my most recent meditations. I'd love an analysis:

Why are we separated? If all things are for and from One Thing, why Duality, Triplicity and the Quarters exist?

On account of the Separator, who has the last word: If you listen he speaks truth, if you listen close enough, he ramains silent.

Separation is essential while at the same time is superfluous. The Microcosmic Paradox, rather than the macro. It is the Mind moving too quickly in order to sublimate. It is the heart beating out of synch, in order to create. It is the body not knowing the mind's direction, even though it is quite direct.

Schmuldvich
06-28-2017, 01:03 AM
On account of the Separator, who has the last word: If you listen he speaks truth, if you listen close enough, he remains silent.

Oooo I like this!

elixirmixer
07-13-2017, 10:58 AM
Some people believe that this part of scripture is to be taken literally, and argue, that as you get higher in the atmosphere, and therefore colder, and closer to space, that the gases up there have frozen over and that it is indeed a huge solid dome over a 'essentially' flat plane.

A lot have speculated also that the Jews also believe in the dome, and that a she rival earth was part of the world consiousness take over plot.

In my studies I've found good arguments for both a sphere and a dome, all I know is that I don't know for sure till I see it for myself.

Also, then there is theory that space is a different type of 'water' and that our atmosphere has 'separated' into 'layers' which I think might be what Andro was referin to with the emeral tablet and the 'practical' comment (please correct if I'm wrong)

The other aspect of separation to consider is the effect it has on the consciousness, when one separates themselves from the world. Mostly strongly expressed through the repeated story of the 40 day wilderness bash, often (if not always) associated with un-paralleled divine graces being bestowed.

You will notice (I hope) that Andro's signature speaks somewhat on seein through the illusion, standing back from the world, "win the game by not playing". Andro (and I apologise if you don't like me using you as an example, feel free to tell me not to do it again) has obviously a very sound understanding to say the least of what I feel, but also has the ability to transverse the astral planes, which is the direct reward, of the condition of having successfully achieved the process of separation. This is after and supieror to Baptism. For baptism is a "dipping", the first time someone has stepped I to the steal plane, only to soon return. However, after baptsim, when we are truly touched by 'the spirit' then we slowly fill ourselves with it (if your smart, not like me) and then once you are full then you can swim deeply in these great healing waters.

Well that's at least how I see separation at the deepest level, I know it's a universal law and has many applications but to me, the true batism is the dipping into the spirit world, and the separation is basically intensive spirit training, pre-luminary challenges before being offered higher powers from God/Godess Elohim kindred.

This is just my opinion, love to hear why you think.

Awani
07-13-2017, 12:26 PM
However, after baptsim, when we are truly touched by 'the spirit' then we slowly fill ourselves with it (if your smart, not like me) and then once you are full then you can swim deeply in these great healing waters.

Yes, and some people surf in the very same water as others drown in. Water is water. It's all about "you" and "how you deal with the water"...

What is funny is that in the moment of understanding, or "knowing", one does realise that it is not about "you"... or in my case, it is not about "me".

I am a drop. It is about the ocean. The ocean can survive without a drop, but the drop will dry out without the ocean.

Seperation is embrace.

That is the way I approch it.


The more you know, the less you need. - Australian Aboriginal saying

:p