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Nibiru
07-25-2011, 05:22 AM
(Deleted links to avoid the attraction of unnecessary attention to this forum by the powers that be)

Ghislain
07-25-2011, 08:29 AM
Genesis part II :)

Ghislain

Aleilius
07-25-2011, 08:32 AM
Can resistance really be peaceful?

Resistance, by its very nature, hearkens to a clash between two opposing forces. The peaceful are not a force, and do not clash.

There are those that cloak themselves in peace, speak of such things, but they have their own agenda. The peaceful have no agenda (except to be in peace).

Take this for what you will. It's merely my own opinion (skewed, or not).

Nibiru
07-26-2011, 03:21 AM
Can resistance really be peaceful?

Resistance, by its very nature, hearkens to a clash between two opposing forces. The peaceful are not a force, and do not clash.

There are those that cloak themselves in peace, speak of such things, but they have their own agenda. The peaceful have no agenda (except to be in peace).

Take this for what you will. It's merely my own opinion (skewed, or not).

Hi Aleilius, would you consider Gandhi a man who was merely cloaked in peace? If so, then I suppose I would have to agree with you. Perhaps non-violent resistance would be a better choice of words than peaceful resistance(so I edited my original post). Sometimes change is necessary, and resistance to oppression can be a powerful catalyst for social evolution.

Seth-Ra
07-27-2011, 07:23 AM
I'll probably be the "odd" guy here for a change, but what the hell. :)

I believe that the people should be "free" to an extent - but that there must be an established order and rulers and enforcers to maintain such, as people are not competent enough to govern themselves. (never have been, and even now, are just as bat-shit insane as they always are. A person is sane, but people are rabid. lol)
That being said - government should not be static either - it gets stagnant and thus bloated and you get, well, America today. lol

Now, ive always been a fan of Feudal Japan and the samurai - was studying Japanese swordsmanship (and sword construction) as well as history and lore thereof before i found alchemy, and while its usually hailed as a good thing, ive never been a fan of the Meji Era - "Uniting the country under a single sword of Peace." - seems like horse shit to me, especially when governments have a habit of stagnating when not being pushed by opposition, the warrior class damn near died off - many of them like dogs in the street. (not much use for them when there is no one left to battle) which then lets the controlling interests of the time, lock-hold of the upper-class power.
Me, im more of a Shogunate kinda guy: i think there should be various "Lords/Warlords" - whatever you want to call them - Rulers, that govern, and also try to over-throw one another. Their should not be a single ruling one for to long a time: The Ruler of today is the rebel of tomorrow, this keeps things in check, that is to say, it keeps everyone striving forward, both in military and scientific approaches, to gain an advantage, and in civilian relations - wanting to support the Ruler that is inline with you, the people - and if it gets out of hand, usurp it and make a new one.

While this, at first glance, seems like a never ending blood bath, its actually a reality check - people, especially in stagnant countries (like America for instance) likes to fill their days full of meaningless crap as a distraction from the fact that you arent guaranteed to live till tomorrow, and you should make your life as meaningful as you can - Death comes for us all, why squander what time you have? Are we not Artists? Are we not craftsmen, engineers, sculptors of all sorts of Art and works - not just for us, but later generations? Are we not husbands and wives - do we not have families, do we not have loved ones? Why would not make every moment count with them? All to often we forget how close death can be - but in a society where its kept in focus, life, no matter how short or long, is lived deeper because you make everything count.
Its not even that youre forced to make it count, so much as you want to, because you truly enjoy it, and it will both be beneficial and be your mark that is left. Also constantly having to look the inevitable in the face means making peace with it - stop fearing, move forward spiritually. Look deep within your soul and explore and contemplate.

Sure, we can all do these things without my idea of a shogunate power-exchange constantly coming and going, but that isnt just for personal working, but people as a whole. Furthermore, because of the constant battles, there wouldnt be over-crowding, plenty to go around and always new resources to seize (that of your opponents).

Now, id also like to point out, that while i like the ideas i just mentioned, that in no way means that opposing powers must hate one another, nor hold any malice, no, quite the opposite. Respect for your opponents - not the hate-war-mongering that we all know of in todays world. The only thing that makes the opponents, is differences of ideas and ways of life - so let the "friendly" (if you could call it that) battles wage, and not to extinction of any of them, or their ideas, but only to submission, everyone purposefully not allowing their side to become to dominant, so that opposing sides, and the people at anytime can usurp and change the game.

Constant change, and stability within the change - a sort of ouroboros. Besides, its not like worse isnt happening now, or going to continue happening - for to continue living is to continue feeding off the rest, whether plants or animals, or the misfortune of another - friend or foe, that is part of the ouroboros of life - the equivalence is there, taken from some, given to others, some to death, while new is born.

So what is peace? Is it really an action, or is it really a mindset, whether in war and battle, or everyday life? You are always consuming life - how is that a peaceful action? Surely its an ideal/mindset - so what is the desired ends and with what thought do you execute the means?

Found this quote that kinda fits i think:

It is told that Buddha, going out to look on life, was greatly daunted by death. "They all eat one another!" he cried, and called it evil. This process I examined, changed the verb, said, "They all feed one another," and called it good. - Charlotte Perkins Gilman


Just an unconventional perspective, happily tossed into the gears of peace and resistance. :)




~Seth-Ra

Frater IA
07-28-2011, 01:23 PM
Peace is the balance, the balance must be maintained, this does not mean the lack of evil, but the balance of it with divine influence. If there is too much of one or the other, both may wreak havoc in your life and those around you. Peace, is the subtle balance of opposing forces. The more off balance you become or all become, the more violently influential forces seek to come back into balance.

Seth Ra, your vision seems fitting, as it is a constant way of maintaining through subtle means of chaning smaller factions, rather than entire countries rising in revolution. ;)

Ghislain
07-29-2011, 07:44 AM
Times are changing...Pisces - Aquarius...people will govern themselves.

Ghislain

Frater IA
07-30-2011, 03:09 AM
Times are changing...Pisces - Aquarius...people will govern themselves.

Ghislain

Agreed, and I am overjoyed by it. Last night I could actually feel the process happening within me, it was quite overwhelming how powerful I could feel the creative fires burning inside me breaking down the socially bred barriers and expanding my consciousness. ;) I hope that all feel this change in them, it is both destructive and beautiful.

Lapis Solaris
07-30-2011, 06:57 AM
Peace is the balance, the balance must be maintained, this does not mean the lack of evil, but the balance of it with divine influence. If there is too much of one or the other, both may wreak havoc in your life and those around you. Peace, is the subtle balance of opposing forces. The more off balance you become or all become, the more violently influential forces seek to come back into balance.

I would agree for the most part, however, as I see evil, it is not the equivalent to Chaos or something that is inconvenient as most people would view what is "bad" or "evil". I believe that good is achieved by balance, and therefore both Chaos and Order are involved. Positive and negative both work towards perfection and Order. The way that I infact see evil is an imbalance due to denying what is Good or what is Order; separation from The Great Truth.

Ghislain
07-30-2011, 04:12 PM
Would this clip be more appropriate?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnfIvSVZRfo

Ghislain

P.S. feel free to delete this if it is not, but then one has to ask oneself where is freedom?

Awani
07-31-2011, 05:36 PM
Freedom is a state of mind, evil is ignorance... ignorance always have a tendency to bite the ignorant in the ass sooner or later.

One of the most important lessons I felt I learned in the Amazon was this fact... and as I saw it in a vision it somehow was proved to me. Later experiences have verified it for me.

:cool:

Seth-Ra
07-31-2011, 06:15 PM
Freedom is a state of mind, evil is ignorance... ignorance always have a tendency to bite the ignorant in the ass sooner or later.

One of the most important lessons I felt I learned in the Amazon was this fact... and as I saw it in a vision it somehow was proved to me. Later experiences have verified it for me.

:cool:

This, i totally agree with.

If people have a good King/Emperor - whatever, then they feel they are free, because there is order they agree with. If the ruler sucks, the people are unhappy, and feel "the walls closing in", as it were - chained and shackled in mind and spirit. I think in the present state of conditions that there should be a sort of "revolution" - without the struggle, we have this stagnation which leads to a cesspool of problems. (was going to elaborate, but i think the wording says it all.)

So bring on the new, and the battles thereof, stir and churn the waters - add the fire to circulate and distill, and let not the distillate set idle!
:)

Ignorance is indeed evil and all religions, and im pretty sure math/science (law of equivalency), would agree that the actions bite them in the ass. (10 fold, 3 fold, etc... etc... same idea) Well stated Dev. :)

The Sword is the key, to open the worlds, reveal the hearts, and show their power. Is there no wonder that the blood is iron, and the heart, the center of our life-fire? As magnets, let them attract, like the Excalibur in the Stone, crafted iron to grown iron - as a key to a lock, the people's souls be heard, and the rulers govern properly - both with wisdom and understanding, and may the fires perfect all of them - ideals and societies, at the time of peace - be war, at the time of war - make peace, make the Volatile to be Fixed and the Fixed, Volatile - motion and change, eternal! :D


Heh, i get a little passionate sometimes... more fire of the heart. :)


~Seth-Ra

Nibiru
07-31-2011, 07:28 PM
Since this topic seems to be growing, here are the original links I had posted:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7r4xNne20E8

http://www.whatis-theplan.org/

Albion
07-31-2011, 07:59 PM
Awesome.

In the past, some revolutions have worked out well - others haven't. All have eventually been co-opted to one degree or another.

[As it begins to take on a life of its own, the outworking always gets a bit messy. Here is an example of a simple (albeit perhaps forseen) problem: fake official communications: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d06oINVcqYc&feature=related Perhaps not a big deal - but just a reminder that there is always a gap between an ideal and how it plays out.]

But I think the difference between now, and times past, is that TPTW no longer have the support of the energy of the illusion and therefore can no longer maintain their hidden agendas, period.

Although they almost certainly will not "go gentle into that good night," their hay-day is over. Their nest has already been unknotted from on high. It's just a question of how it will all unravel, who will be tugging on what threads, and what alternatives will develop.
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRm7dmW5yNmj0Iuo8FZ2vtcy7lrHZoJi v5xaE9ahI0PlCvzIrsmxA

Nibiru
08-01-2011, 01:32 AM
But I think the difference between now, and times past, is that TPTW no longer have the support of the energy of the illusion and therefore can no longer maintain their hidden agendas, period.

Although they almost certainly will not "go gentle into that good night," their hay-day is over. Their nest has already been unknotted from on high. It's just a question of how it will all unravel, who will be tugging on what threads, and what alternatives will develop.
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRm7dmW5yNmj0Iuo8FZ2vtcy7lrHZoJi v5xaE9ahI0PlCvzIrsmxA
Well said :)

Awani
08-01-2011, 01:50 AM
If people have a good King/Emperor - whatever, then they feel they are free, because there is order they agree with. If the ruler sucks, the people are unhappy, and feel "the walls closing in", as it were - chained and shackled in mind and spirit.

Personally I don't think there needs to be a ruler regardless of how good this person is... saying that some people enjoy being ruled so what is needed is the opportunity to choose.

The lack of choice in modern society (for example you can't choose not to be a part of a tax system, political system etc) is the true slavery and does not fit with the following (as I have stated elsewhere):

http://www.deviadah.com/pictures/article%204.jpg

:cool:

Nibiru
03-29-2012, 10:58 PM
In the past, some revolutions have worked out well - others haven't. All have eventually been co-opted to one degree or another.


Revolution - R = X
X = ?

zoas23
03-30-2012, 01:18 AM
Revolution - R = X
X = ?

I do believe in peaceful resistance and it's not an just an ideal.
I lived my early childhood under a fascist regime, the military dictatorship of Argentina.
There was a guerrilla fighting them... but, in the end, it was only peaceful resistance what made them fall down. Civil disobedience.
There wasn't a Bloody Revolution. This was in 1983, I was a little kid.

In 2001 I saw the same thing. The government, this time a democratic government, decided to take impossible economical decissions. These decissions caused a very few violent incidents and the governemt decided to declare a state of siege. It was this decission that caused mostly everyone to leave their houses which such thing was forbidden for the very first time since the democracy started in 1983. People left their houses with cooking pots and started to make noise on the street, mostly everyone did it. In 2 days the whole government was resigning.
(yes, there were a few small incidents and yes, the police killed 8 persons that day... but it was a peaceful protest).

This thread, for some odd reason, made me remember of the Confessio Fraternitatis, the most "political" of the three original Rosicrucian manifestos.
And such thing lead me to remember one of my favorite moments in history, something that happened way before any person even pronounced the word "Rosicrucian", which is the moment in which Gemistos Pletho gave his conferences in Florence about Platonism and the Chaldean Oracles.
Something as simple as ideas can change everything.
Would the Rennaisance itself have existed without those conferences? It's hard to say it, but maybe not... probably not.

Sometimes just writing something, saying something, can change the whole world.

Andro
03-30-2012, 03:26 AM
Most 'revolutions'/'regime changes' are engineered.

The ones that aren't, are brutally suppressed and you most likely won't even hear about them.

Hell, some governments are even ENCOURAGING 'peaceful resistance'!

That way, the ones controlling the governments can do whatever the fuck they want and 'change' whatever the fuck they want to 'change', while maintaining the facade that everyone is allowed to 'express their opposition'.

Not only that, but they are manipulating 'The People' into believing it's their 'peaceful protest' that caused the change.

It's one of the oldest tricks in the book. Some call it 'Pressure from Above' & 'Pressure from Below'. (How Hermetical :))

The 'P.T.B.' apply 'Pressure from Above' whenever they want to enforce changes, but they need to make it so it looks like 'The People' are the ones asking for these 'changes'.

Then, 'The People' apply 'Pressure from Below', preferably 'Peaceful Resistance'.

They're practically ASKING for it.

And then, 'they' can implement the 'changes' they wanted in the first place, but now it APPEARS that is was the people's 'peaceful protesting' that brought on the 'changes'.

Problem - Reaction - Solution

Classic.

And SO many are still buying into that.

Always the same.

Please do yourselves a HUGE favor and watch the 70's movie Network.

It can be watched online HERE (http://www.putlocker.com/file/93LBX0TR49WK4OK#) (I'm not sure if it works from all countries).

Back to 'peaceful resistance' - here's a tip:

ARMED peaceful resistance may sometimes be a bit more effective...

It's still peaceful - but with a twist :)

Watch the video below:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vplwUROCAFY&feature=share

Still, all this being said, a critical mass of SHIFT IN CONSCIOUSNESS is IMO what's really needed to take us to the next level. CAN this happen? I don't know.

But what I DO know, is that there are factors at play that are beyond 'their' control and beyond 'our' control as well.

We'll have to live/die and see for ourselves...

Observing and dealing with Cause (Spirit, Consciousness, Ex-Aether-Ra...) rather than with Effect.

Just like Alchemy... Just like Life...

Quoth Depeche Mode:


It's a lot, it's a lot.
It's a lot, it's a lot.
It's a lot, it's a lot
Lot lot like life.

:cool:

Nibiru
04-03-2012, 04:49 PM
Not only that, but they are manipulating 'The People' into believing it's their 'peaceful protest' that caused the change.

It's one of the oldest tricks in the book. Some call it 'Pressure from Above' & 'Pressure from Below'. (How Hermetical :))

The 'P.T.B.' apply 'Pressure from Above' whenever they want to enforce changes, but they need to make it so it looks like 'The People' are the ones asking for these 'changes'.

Then, 'The People' apply 'Pressure from Below', preferably 'Peaceful Resistance'.

They're practically ASKING for it.

And then, 'they' can implement the 'changes' they wanted in the first place, but now it APPEARS that is was the people's 'peaceful protesting' that brought on the 'changes'.

Problem - Reaction - Solution

Problem - Reaction - Solution
911 - Fear - Patriot Act

I've felt the occupy/anonymous movements may be potential traps the more I've looked into it. This is why I've never actively participated in any of their events. Sounds like an easy way for the power to declare a large percentage of the youth as "terrorists" and open their Camps..




Back to 'peaceful resistance' - here's a tip:

ARMED peaceful resistance may sometimes be a bit more effective...

It's still peaceful - but with a twist :)

My only fear with an armed and peaceful resistance, is that this would give the authorities an excuse to quickly turn the resistance violent. As soon as one civilian was provoked into firing a shot, the protesters would be massacred. I don't know if the people would be able to defend themselves against the military, even if every one of us were armed. The weapons/technology they have in comparison to civilians is just far too advanced, IMO. I wonder what would happen if everyone quit paying taxes, voting, following the rules, etc??


Still, all this being said, a critical mass of SHIFT IN CONSCIOUSNESS is IMO what's really needed to take us to the next level.

Agreed, and this is what I was hoping to portray with the equation I posted above.

Revolution - R = X
X = ?
If we want a revolution it's best to begin with our own consciousness evolution..

Nibiru
04-15-2012, 05:02 PM
The "Ungrip" documentary falls in line quite well with one potential route towards a r-Evolution of consciousness. It also details an independent form of "The Lab" concept.

Here's the entire video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tScuHwVtRcY

Nibiru
05-24-2012, 10:02 PM
This video was filmed during the NATO conference in Chicago last weekend:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olh-8BqAAqY&feature=plcp

Nibiru
06-03-2013, 05:37 PM
The problem with revolution vs evolution is that through revolution one 'side' is always on the loosing end. This gets us nowhere IMO. Just more revolutions of the infinite cycles of power and oppression. From my understanding a 'circulation' is not the end result or goal of an alchemist. This being said I'm more inclined towards transmutation over circulation/revolution...


Here's a good video/song about the futility of the nature of revolutions from the 70-80's band "Crass". I've had the band/organization's symbol tattoo'd on my leg since I was 17 years old, it's one of only two real tattoos that I felt strongly enough about to have marked into myself permanently. The other is a piece inspired by the art of H.R. Giger, who's one of my favorite artists.

Bloody Revolutions by: Crass (Lyrics scroll with the video)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMoQYbfj59s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMoQYbfj59s