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sign00
12-20-2011, 08:39 PM
This is a large thread about The Book of Aquarius, but what is discussed here is also talked about in a few other threads.

The Book of Aquarius (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2058-The-Book-of-Aquarius)
Book of Aquarius - Debate with Author ?? (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2589-Book-of-Aquarius-Debate-with-Author)
Most clear and modern books (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2515-Most-clear-and-modern-books/page4)

/dev
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This is a strange story so bare with me.

I'm a member of forgottenbooks.org and a few days ago I got an announcement they sent to all their members saying that a manuscript called 'The Book of Aquarius' had been anonymously emailed into their site. After reading it they thought it important enough to email all their members about and put the whole book up for free on their web site. The book is free for everyone, you don't have to be a member.

Now Forgotten Books is quite a big company, they publish thousands of books in different countries, so I downloaded the book and have just finished reading it.

The book is remarkable. The anonymous author actually claims to be making the Philosopher's Stone, which they claim is not a myth but a real and physical thing. Not only that, but it is even more powerful than the myths.

Of course normally I wouldn't just believe something I read on the Internet, but the author supports everything they say with hundreds of quotes from real alchemy books. So I looked up some of the alchemy books and they actually exist! And the quotes are actually in those alchemy books. Everything he/she says is supported by books written hundreds of years ago, so I don't see how this can be scam, unless he has a time machine too!

Somehow the author of this book has managed to decode the mystic language of the alchemists, and they even tell you how to read the alchemy books yourself, which makes it possible for anyone to read the alchemy books.

I know not many people will believe me but please check this out for yourself, since it is free.

But it goes further. The author also goes into detail about 2012 and how the golden age we are going into is actually when the Philosopher's Stone is free for all people. He/She even goes into stuff about enlightenment and metaphysics.

Here is a quote from the introduction.


The purpose of this book is to release one particular secret, which has been kept hidden for the last 12,000 years. The Philosophers' Stone, Elixir of Life, Fountain of Youth, Ambrosia, Soma, Amrita, Nectar of Immortality. These are different names for the same thing.

Throughout history this secret has been used by a very few to extend their lives hundreds of years in perfect health, with access to unlimited wealth, among many other miraculous properties. Some kept the secret because they understood that the time was not right for the secret to be free for all people, but most kept the secret out of their own jealousy, ignorance, egotism and corruption.

The Stone's history and the history of the human race up until this day is a strange story full of secret societies, hooded cloaks, and mystical symbols. Such theatrics are childish and shallow. It's pointless to look for the light in the shadows.

The Philosophers' Stone operates and is made by entirely natural and scientific means. Truth is always simple, beautiful and easy to understand.

The Philosophers' Stone is real; you can make it at home. The Stone makes old people young, heals all forms of sickness and disease, extends your life, turns any metal into gold, and more, as you will learn. This isn't a myth or a metaphor, it's a fact.

Don't judge this book before you've read it. This is not one of those airy fairy books written in all kinds of mystical language, filling pages with words that makes sentences but not sense. This book will make more sense than anything you've ever read before.

The age of secrets is over. I'm writing this book in common English. There's no need for mystical language or metaphor. This book contains no hidden meaning or codes; everything is stated plainly and directly, in the shortest and simplest of words necessary to convey the meaning.

Chapters 1 - 2 are the introduction and foreword.
Chapters 3 - 17 cover the theory of alchemy.
Chapters 18 - 28 cover the practical instructions for making the Stone.
Chapters 29 - 31 cover further information on the Stone.
Chapters 32 - 46 cover the history of the Stone.
Chapters 47 - 48 cover some more philosophical topics.
Chapter 49 is the alchemists' prophecy.
Chapter 50 is the afterword.
Chapter 51 is the bibliography.



What do you think of this?

Here is the link to download it for free:

http://www.forgottenbooks.org/bookofaquarius


-sign

thoth
12-20-2011, 09:25 PM
Hi,

Yes I think this is an important book. All the quotes he refers to, do seem to back up the theory of his book.

Even if his starting substance is wrong the process itself could apply to other matters.
I plan to follow the practical side of this book, at the very least you could learn a lot about the processes of alchemy

From the thread below I get the impression some of the more advanced members of this forum look on this author like the kid who found the box of matches while the parents are out of the house.......he's now opened the box of matches....... and has one in his hand and is on the verge of figuring out how to ignite the match, while everyone is thinking - dont encourage him !!

I've just bought my own box of matches...I just cant figure out why they give you free sandpaper

http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2058-The-Book-of-Aquarius

sign00
12-20-2011, 09:46 PM
Think about this...

If someone starts it now it could take a minimum time of 18 months, right? So then it would be finished around Summer 2013!

sign00
12-20-2011, 09:49 PM
Hi,

From the thread below I get the impression some of the more advanced members of this forum look on this author like the kid who found the box of matches while the parents are out of the house.......he's now opened the box of matches....... and has one in his hand and is on the verge of figuring out how to ignite the match, while everyone is thinking - dont encourage him !!

I've just bought my own box of matches...I just cant figure out why they give you free sandpaper

http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2058-The-Book-of-Aquarius

I will state this for you in an easy-to-read manner, so you can't miss it:

1. There is no reason for you to be here, except for fueling your ego.

2. You are only arguing a negative, and have nothing else to offer, which is impressively arrogant.

3. You assume everyone on this forum is stupid, when there are many very intelligent people who frequent this place. The idea of you arguing with me is laughable. I've probably done a lot more research than you.

4. People here do not just take my word for it (well some of them do, but we are not talking about those) they are here because they could understand the alchemical sources from what I wrote, and see for themselves the truth of alchemy.

5. Hundreds of people have physically seen the signs, with their own eyes. Those signs that you ramble about and throw randomly into sentences to try to look cool. We have seen them. Don't believe it? See for yourself in The Great Work. Or alternatively, go away.

To sum up: you are arguing a negative about something you don't understand with people who have personal experience.

thoth
12-20-2011, 09:53 PM
Hi Sign00

Yes this author has started it , I think up to 10 months ago. There are probably many variables which will affect time required, such as temperature, initial state of the starting matter, purification of matter before the 2nd stage, perhaps even different types of matters

I guess we will find out anyway within 2/3 years. Are you going to attempt the practical work as described in the book?

Illen A. Cluf
12-20-2011, 09:58 PM
What do you think of this?


I read it quite some time ago and saw some discussion about it on a forum. I wasn't impressed and neither were most from that forum. To date, the author has not yet even completed the process himself. I think that the author is sincere and does believe in the process, but there are aspects that don't conform to traditional alchemical wisdom - at least as far as I understand it, and I also have never made the Stone.

However, the author has an active forum, and shows the progress of his work. If interested, go to:

http://www.thebookofaquarius.com/forum/

Illen

sign00
12-20-2011, 10:04 PM
I read it quite some time ago and saw some discussion about it on a forum. I wasn't impressed and neither were most from that forum. To date, the author has not yet even completed the process himself. I think that the author is sincere and does believe in the process, but there are aspects that don't conform to traditional alchemical wisdom - at least as far as I understand it, and I also have never made the Stone.

However, the author has an active forum, and shows the progress of his work. If interested, go to:

http://www.thebookofaquarius.com/forum/

Illen

It seems I underestimated you guys, and I overestimated myself. [:I]

I reread all my previous posts, and even I can tell my acting skills are appalling. I don't really have anywhere to turn. Even if you guys did believe me it is still too suspicious and these forums don't magically disappear from the Internet, it'll be on here forever. [fishslap]

The idea is for everyone to read this book, and if that happens then this topic will be scrutinized and I'm certain many people will reach the same conclusion.

I AM THE AUTHOR

Did you not read the Foreword where it states not to ask me if you have guessed who I am? I would prefer not to be hunted.

Now, luckily I did this whole "release" in a country different to the one I usually reside in, and also using temporary email addresses and proxies. So even if the connection is magnificently traced I'll be gone.

I sent the original email anonymously out to 500 sites, and only 1 (forgottenbooks.org) put it up. I was expecting more response than this, although I suppose I should be happy with forgottenbooks.org. It is still a little disappointing. I even sent the email to the owner of ATS. No response. I'm very surprised sacred-texts.com, rexresearch.com and alchemywebsite.com all ignored the email too. I would expect them to understand something like this.

Anyway, I have no way of telling how many people have downloaded the book or what they think about it, and I obviously can't go around discussing this with people. I hoped to gain some response from this topic. So I created an account, rushed the first 20 required posts, and then started this one. The whole time I dumbed down my posts, attempting to sound more like an overenergetic kid with not so good spelling and punctuation. To everyone I replied to here somewhat aggressively, I'm not really like that, but I was having fun under my little alias and it was funny to watch everyone posting theories that make no sense and being able to shout at them without anyone thinking anything of it. But I slowly gave away that I do know what I'm talking about.

I'm not going to prove I'm the author by revealing the key to the SHA-1 hash, since the idea is that I release another key at the same time, so I can prove who I am the next time, and a forum is not a good place to do that as everyone would have to read it in order to get the next key. So if you choose not to believe I'm the author for this reason then that's not a problem.

So here's the deal: I'll answer questions for 48 hours, then I'll be gone. But from your side, you must all promise that if you ask a question you will make great effort to distribute this book to as many people as you can. Post it on Facebook, on forums, send it to everyone in your address book, everyone in the office or school. Everyone. And ask them to do the same. That's my deal.

sign00
12-20-2011, 10:07 PM
Hi Sign00

Yes this author has started it , I think up to 10 months ago. There are probably many variables which will affect time required, such as temperature, initial state of the starting matter, purification of matter before the 2nd stage, perhaps even different types of matters

I guess we will find out anyway within 2/3 years. Are you going to attempt the practical work as described in the book?

I am not here to learn about alchemy, I am here to teach it. I am here to teach - you can't teach me anything about alchemy. But from your perspective this doesn't matter, you don't need to try to teach me since I am not trying to learn from you.

Bennu Lugh
12-20-2011, 10:24 PM
I am not here to learn about alchemy, I am here to teach it. I am here to teach - you can't teach me anything about alchemy. But from your perspective this doesn't matter, you don't need to try to teach me since I am not trying to learn from you.

You seem very confident and I wish you the best of luck in the world if you are the author of the Book of Aquarius. There are a lot of significant quotes in that book.

I would, however, refrain from telling people how much smarter than them you are. It comes off more like a challenge. I've known too many people who say they know the answer when what they really have is another dead end. When they fail they tend to be laughed at.

Again, good luck.

thoth
12-20-2011, 10:33 PM
I am not here to learn about alchemy, I am here to teach it. I am here to teach - you can't teach me anything about alchemy. But from your perspective this doesn't matter, you don't need to try to teach me since I am not trying to learn from you.

Hi "Author" /Sign00, you misinterpret me, I am the one trying to learn, have no intention of teaching anyone because I am not at that stage - being a relative newcomer to the practical side. I plan to follow the books instructions in the next month or two. So many of the old books we could be chasing our tails round in circles - all the double meanings, and get lost in maze, but the BOA gives very clear instructions .

Hmmm I do wonder if you really are the author as he does seem willing to take on new ideas from experienced experimenters on his forum .....

Illen A. Cluf
12-20-2011, 10:44 PM
It seems I underestimated you guys, and I overestimated myself. [:I]

I reread all my previous posts, and even I can tell my acting skills are appalling. I don't really have anywhere to turn. Even if you guys did believe me it is still too suspicious and these forums don't magically disappear from the Internet, it'll be on here forever. [fishslap]

The idea is for everyone to read this book, and if that happens then this topic will be scrutinized and I'm certain many people will reach the same conclusion.

I AM THE AUTHOR

Did you not read the Foreword where it states not to ask me if you have guessed who I am? I would prefer not to be hunted.

Now, luckily I did this whole "release" in a country different to the one I usually reside in, and also using temporary email addresses and proxies. So even if the connection is magnificently traced I'll be gone.

I sent the original email anonymously out to 500 sites, and only 1 (forgottenbooks.org) put it up. I was expecting more response than this, although I suppose I should be happy with forgottenbooks.org. It is still a little disappointing. I even sent the email to the owner of ATS. No response. I'm very surprised sacred-texts.com, rexresearch.com and alchemywebsite.com all ignored the email too. I would expect them to understand something like this.

Anyway, I have no way of telling how many people have downloaded the book or what they think about it, and I obviously can't go around discussing this with people. I hoped to gain some response from this topic. So I created an account, rushed the first 20 required posts, and then started this one. The whole time I dumbed down my posts, attempting to sound more like an overenergetic kid with not so good spelling and punctuation. To everyone I replied to here somewhat aggressively, I'm not really like that, but I was having fun under my little alias and it was funny to watch everyone posting theories that make no sense and being able to shout at them without anyone thinking anything of it. But I slowly gave away that I do know what I'm talking about.

I'm not going to prove I'm the author by revealing the key to the SHA-1 hash, since the idea is that I release another key at the same time, so I can prove who I am the next time, and a forum is not a good place to do that as everyone would have to read it in order to get the next key. So if you choose not to believe I'm the author for this reason then that's not a problem.

So here's the deal: I'll answer questions for 48 hours, then I'll be gone. But from your side, you must all promise that if you ask a question you will make great effort to distribute this book to as many people as you can. Post it on Facebook, on forums, send it to everyone in your address book, everyone in the office or school. Everyone. And ask them to do the same. That's my deal.

I really feel sorry for you. You have never yet made the Stone but go around telling the world that you know the secret. It sounds much more like a huge ego trip that you are on, along with all the silly smoke and dagger nonsense, rather than a true and mature seeker, open to ideas from others. Your book could easily have been written over a couple of months, based on information already available - it's filled with quotes to make it sound respectable.

I think it's a shame that anyone would promote themselves as an Adept, without ever having made the Stone. If your experiment doesn't work, then what? Will you find one excuse after another why it didn't work? Or will you honestly admit that you were premature in your promotion?

I wish you the best of luck, and hope that you will mature in time. This art is already filled with enough egotists, misfits and pretenders. We don't need any more.

Illen A. Cluf

sign00
12-20-2011, 11:21 PM
You seem very confident and I wish you the best of luck in the world if you are the author of the Book of Aquarius. There are a lot of significant quotes in that book.

I would, however, refrain from telling people how much smarter than them you are. It comes off more like a challenge. I've known too many people who say they know the answer when what they really have is another dead end. When they fail they tend to be laughed at.

Sorry to see you are still of the same opinion, but you are still lurking and watching. Why is that? Do you not have better things to do?

Unfortunately I don't have time for this anymore, there are enough people who have started the Work to keep me busy, so I don't entertain skeptics anymore.

Addresses to all the silly, elitist over nothing, and pseudo-philosophical jargon speaking puffers:

As stupid as we look to you, that is how you look to us.

At least I see this.

I don't mean this as in insult, but a matter of fact. What is the purpose of your arguing? To convert us all from our belief in something we understand and have experienced into people who believe something that doesn't make any sense and we can't prove?

This is the Internet! People pop us every day and write all kinds of trash. You don't have the Stone, they don't have the Stone, I don't have the Stone, BUT I do have a personal experience to the extent that I've fully witnessed more than half of the signs and stages explained by the alchemists, after following the instructions as they wrote. Same can be said for many of the forum members here.

Your babbling doesn't stand up to experience. Please go away.

sign00
12-20-2011, 11:27 PM
I really feel sorry for you. You have never yet made the Stone but go around telling the world that you know the secret. It sounds much more like a huge ego trip that you are on, along with all the silly smoke and dagger nonsense, rather than a true and mature seeker, open to ideas from others. Your book could easily have been written over a couple of months, based on information already available - it's filled with quotes to make it sound respectable.

I think it's a shame that anyone would promote themselves as an Adept, without ever having made the Stone. If your experiment doesn't work, then what? Will you find one excuse after another why it didn't work? Or will you honestly admit that you were premature in your promotion?

I wish you the best of luck, and hope that you will mature in time. This art is already filled with enough egotists, misfits and pretenders. We don't need any more.


More times than I can count, privately and publicly, I have been approached since writing the book by people who would like to recruit me into their secret societies or private forums. Just like I was here.

They think I have misunderstood and kindly offer to teach me to understand alchemy according to their own understanding. This is very arrogant of those people - although it does not help the public at large. But I deny every time, and it offends the people, so again they conclude that I am arrogant. Off with them, they are a**clowns.

They offered to be my teacher, but I refused - how disrespectful of me. <rolls eyes> I don't know what these people expect me to say... it is stupid of them to offer, but also shows their own misunderstanding and their own love of theatrics. What can I say? It's childish to me.

Hellin Hermetist
12-20-2011, 11:41 PM
From what I have heard, that book speaks about a certain process for the creation of the stone from urine. Now let's see what some of the most respected alchemical philosophers of the past have to say about it and judge for ourselves.

"God has created us this Mineral; to the end, that we should take it by it self, that we should uncompound or dissolve the Composition of the gross and thick Body; that we should separate and take for our selves whatever good it encloses inwardly, that we reject what it has of superfluous, and that our of a (mortal) Poison, we learn to make a (Sovereign) Medicine."
Ancient War of the Knights, Anonymous

"To give you a more prefect understanding of this agreeable Discourse; I will recite to you the Dispute which arose between the Stone of the Philosophers, Gold, andMercury; so that those who have a long time apply'd themselves to the search (of our Art) and who know how we ought to deal with {6} Metals and Minerals, may be thereby sufficiently informed how to arrive directly at the End which they propose to themselves."
Ancient War of the Knights, Anonymous

"You give me a most sensible Joy. I have read much; I have meditated yet more; I have exercised my self in the Practice of Chymistry; I have verified the saying of Artephius, who assures, That he knows not the Composition of Metals, who is ignorant how they must be destroyed, and without this Destruction it is impossible to extract the metallick Humidity, which is the true Key of the Art."
Hermetic Triumph, Limojon de St Didier

"There is no difficulty in giving you Satisfaction as to this Point: Nay, I do wonder how you came to form such a doubt; the Stone is the first Matter of the Metals, and consequently it is Prior to {Sun}, and to all other Metals; and if it derives its Original from them, or if it takes Birth from their Destruction, it does no therefore follow, that it is a Production posterior to Metals; but on the contrary, it is Prior to them, since it is the Matter from whence all Metals have been formed. The Secret of the Art consists in knowing how to extract from Metals this first Matter, or this metallick Germ, which is to vegetate, by the Fecundity of the Philosophic Sea."
Hermetic Triumph, Limojon de St Didier

"But let me tell you that so long as you love lies, and turn away from rational philosophy, you will never find the right way. I can speak from bitter experience. For I, too, toiled for many years in accordance with those sophistic methods, and endeavoured to reach the coveted goal by sublimation, distillation, calcination, circulation, and so forth, and to fashion the Stone out of substances such as urine, salt, atrament, alum, etc."
Via Veritatis, Anonymous

Such an interpretation of the language of the Ancients can only suggest itself to persons entirely ignorant of the nature of metallic substances; indeed, the Ancients wrote as they did solely in order to hide their real meaning from all but the close students of Nature. To this end they were in the constant habit of employing the terms "mercury " and "sulphur." And although the metallic essence is the true substance which, by natural coction, must be raised from the lowest to the highest stage of development, and although the meaning of the Ancients is intelligible enough to the initiated, yet the ignorant can gather from their language no more than the fact that the substance must be taken from the metals. But where are they to obtain it, and how are they to bring it to perfection?
Via Veritatis, Anonymous

At last I determined to devote myself to the study of the powers and virtues which God has laid into metals and minerals and the more I searched the more I found. One discovery led to another, and, after God had permitted unto me many experiments, I understood clearly the nature and properties, and the secret potency, imparted by God to minerals and metals.
Twelve Keys, Basil Valentine

So then if thou canst (as by the Liquor Alcahest thou mayst) reduce a Body (be it what it will, whether Eggs, or Hair, or Urine, or a Spirit ardent, or any mean Mineral which is not of a Metalline imposition) to Water, and after knowest how to impregnate that Water with a specificated, seminal, influential Light, so that that Water may penetrate its dimensions at the least 16 times, and become a Mineral, Mercurial Juice; thou mayst then expect as much profit from that Mercury, as from the best Mercury that is sold in the Apothecaries shops, and no more; for thou mayst so purifie it, and separate its faeces and crudities, as that it may become fit to joyn with thy perfect Bodies: but I doubt this way will be so hard, (try it when thou wilt, I fear the first will puzzle thee all thy life long, to turn all Bodies into Water, and the next would puzzle all the Devils in Hell, to bring this Water to a Metallick seminal viscosity) that thou hadst better leave musing on these Impossibilities, and take my counsel, that is, seek it there where Nature hath put it.
Ripley Revived, Philalethes

If I want I could stay here and bring analogous examples all the night, but I believe that these are more than enough for anyone who have his brains inside his head.

Andro
12-21-2011, 12:32 AM
I don't have the Stone.

Well... you said it. So what's all the babbling about, then?


Your babbling doesn't stand up to experience.

Neither does yours.

You don't have the Stone, as you have stated yourself.

You don't have the experience of having completed the Stone.

Need I say more?


I am not here to learn about alchemy, I am here to teach it.

I don't have the Stone.

And now for the mirror effect, following your own logic:


Your babbling doesn't stand up to experience. Please go away.

Complete the Stone and THEN come back and 'teach about alchemy' and simultaneously claim that you are not here to learn, but to teach...

Until then, (quote) "Please go away." (end quote) :).

Many people see 'signs' and interpret them according to their own mindsets, predispositions and belief systems. Hey, whatever works for you, buddy.

Now pay attention: I am not implying that seeing signs and interpreting them is 'wrong', just that there are many ways to communicate and interpret what we perceive.

ALL of these interpretations are relatively 'biased', as long as we have individual/specified personalities.


Please go away.

Sure, right away. Just finishing this post and I'll be on my way. LOL ;) Funny, you...
------------------------------------------------------------------
PS: We already have a thread (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2058-The-Book-of-Aquarius) here about the book of Aquarius.

If a moderator doesn't find your posts/attitude to be incompatible with this forum's guidelines and rules of conduct, he might move them over there...

PPS:


They offered to be my teacher.


I am here to teach - you can't teach me anything about alchemy.

Maybe I can? But no, I am not offering to be your teacher... Isn't that refreshing?
(one of many reasons being that I know the HUGE responsibility and the potential harm involved with instructing/sharing this kind of knowledge).

PPPS: I have personally read the book, and I rather enjoyed the non-practical (historical/spiritual) sections in particular. Well written.

PPPPS: Not for a moment do I doubt your 'good' intentions. I know roads paved with these. Not in Hungary, though...

:cool:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Illen A. Cluf
12-21-2011, 01:32 AM
More times than I can count, privately and publicly, I have been approached since writing the book by people who would like to recruit me into their secret societies or private forums. Just like I was here.

Congratulations. I'm sure there are many who can appreciate your doctrines and make yet another new cult out of them. Not for me. I prefer mature and responsible exchange and the ability to challenge ideas.


They think I have misunderstood and kindly offer to teach me to understand alchemy according to their own understanding. This is very arrogant of those people - although it does not help the public at large. But I deny every time, and it offends the people, so again they conclude that I am arrogant. Off with them, they are a**clowns.
They offered to be my teacher, but I refused - how disrespectful of me. <rolls eyes>


There's the rub. It's arrogant for others to teach you what they know, but not arrogant for you to force your ideas on others. I think the dictionary would call that hypocrisy, but I simply call it immature arrogance.

Here's how I see the situation:

You have experience in alchemy.
I have experience in alchemy.
You have not made the Stone.
I have not made the Stone.

Guess what? You don't need me as a teacher.
I don't need you as a teacher.

I far prefer mutual and mature discussion, where we are on EQUAL terms and where we can BOTH share ideas. Is that too difficult to understand? I think that many others feel the same way.

I have studied dozens if not hundreds of old alchemical treatises. The more respectable ones all maintain that the Stone ONLY uses minerals in its preparation. Many of them insist that the vegetable and animal matters - INCLUDING URINE - have no place in Alchemy. The word "urine" is mostly used in an allegorical sense. Of course, this is my learned opinion and I'm always open to different perspectives, as long as they make sense. There. I have shared some important information for you, although I see that your mind is already made up. See Hellin Hermetist's message for more details.

Good luck!

Illen A. Cluf

horticult
12-21-2011, 02:35 AM
> sign00

forgottenbooks.org - omen

your posts are like of those overdosed by ormus

so give us a gift & post here some valuable secret

III
12-21-2011, 04:55 AM
This is a strange story so bare with me.

I'm a member of forgottenbooks.org and a few days ago I got an announcement they sent to all their members saying that a manuscript called 'The Book of Aquarius' had been anonymously emailed into their site. After reading it they thought it important enough to email all their members about and put the whole book up for free on their web site. The book is free for everyone, you don't have to be a member.

Now Forgotten Books is quite a big company, they publish thousands of books in different countries, so I downloaded the book and have just finished reading it.

The book is remarkable. The anonymous author actually claims to be making the Philosopher's Stone, which they claim is not a myth but a real and physical thing. Not only that, but it is even more powerful than the myths.

Of course normally I wouldn't just believe something I read on the Internet, but the author supports everything they say with hundreds of quotes from real alchemy books. So I looked up some of the alchemy books and they actually exist! And the quotes are actually in those alchemy books. Everything he/she says is supported by books written hundreds of years ago, so I don't see how this can be scam, unless he has a time machine too!

Somehow the author of this book has managed to decode the mystic language of the alchemists, and they even tell you how to read the alchemy books yourself, which makes it possible for anyone to read the alchemy books.

I know not many people will believe me but please check this out for yourself, since it is free.

But it goes further. The author also goes into detail about 2012 and how the golden age we are going into is actually when the Philosopher's Stone is free for all people. He/She even goes into stuff about enlightenment and metaphysics.

Here is a quote from the introduction.


The purpose of this book is to release one particular secret, which has been kept hidden for the last 12,000 years. The Philosophers' Stone, Elixir of Life, Fountain of Youth, Ambrosia, Soma, Amrita, Nectar of Immortality. These are different names for the same thing.

Throughout history this secret has been used by a very few to extend their lives hundreds of years in perfect health, with access to unlimited wealth, among many other miraculous properties. Some kept the secret because they understood that the time was not right for the secret to be free for all people, but most kept the secret out of their own jealousy, ignorance, egotism and corruption.

The Stone's history and the history of the human race up until this day is a strange story full of secret societies, hooded cloaks, and mystical symbols. Such theatrics are childish and shallow. It's pointless to look for the light in the shadows.

The Philosophers' Stone operates and is made by entirely natural and scientific means. Truth is always simple, beautiful and easy to understand.

The Philosophers' Stone is real; you can make it at home. The Stone makes old people young, heals all forms of sickness and disease, extends your life, turns any metal into gold, and more, as you will learn. This isn't a myth or a metaphor, it's a fact.

Don't judge this book before you've read it. This is not one of those airy fairy books written in all kinds of mystical language, filling pages with words that makes sentences but not sense. This book will make more sense than anything you've ever read before.

The age of secrets is over. I'm writing this book in common English. There's no need for mystical language or metaphor. This book contains no hidden meaning or codes; everything is stated plainly and directly, in the shortest and simplest of words necessary to convey the meaning.

Chapters 1 - 2 are the introduction and foreword.
Chapters 3 - 17 cover the theory of alchemy.
Chapters 18 - 28 cover the practical instructions for making the Stone.
Chapters 29 - 31 cover further information on the Stone.
Chapters 32 - 46 cover the history of the Stone.
Chapters 47 - 48 cover some more philosophical topics.
Chapter 49 is the alchemists' prophecy.
Chapter 50 is the afterword.
Chapter 51 is the bibliography.



What do you think of this?

Here is the link to download it for free:

http://www.forgottenbooks.org/bookofaquarius


-sign


This is a strange story so " bare with me."

That is what nudists say. I kind of doubt your invitation to "bare" with you. For you to have any veracity you need to remove your mask. I have downloaded the book and the pictures. The pictures are Charles Fort all over agian. I offer no opinion on those and they are not relevant in this discussion. The reality of your level of being is revealed in every word you write here on this forum. A quote from CLUBCONSPIRACY http://www.clubconspiracy.com/forum/f30/alchemy-philosophers-stone-real-13250.html#post74014

posted by EroneousDylan in response to the same post we see here.
I am here as a new Member from another forum where this lying clown has been successful in scamming several equally stupid, lame and naive people.

First, the poster sign00 is also the author of this Book of Aquarius drivel.

See here where he gets caught and has to admit his deception.

Alchemy and The Philosopher's Stone is Real, page 2 (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread679877/pg2#pid10911427)

http://www.clubconspiracy.com/forum/images/smilies/mad.gif

Second, he has launched several sock puppets which follow him from forum to forum I found this out by worming my way in to his inner group of 12. All scammers.

Last, sign00 has stated that his real reason for scamming everyone is that if by some chance someone stumbles on the Stone, it will, and I quote him off his own forum "

Quoting sign00 from his own forum...

As for what to do with the Stone and the effects it will have on the world. I am confident that it will destroy everything and reduce the world to chaos.

No fears though, the Stone will create such enormous wealth and we can't be killed so, hey, all is okeydokey...

Uh oh.

Although some people still seem to be of the opinion that the Stone will give wealth and we will all continue living pretty much as we were, except not dying and overpopulated... this couldn't be further from the truth. It reminds me of the movie Daywalkers. It will be nothing like that. People are already piling their investments into silver and gold deemed as the "safest" investments for the future. Civilization is busy preparing itself for destruction in every area.

WTH is the use in making the Stone if our wealth is....worthless? If the planet is imploding, and we have no wealth, where will we go? How will we live?

This doesn't sound like such a hot idea after all. Making sign00 Stone, what he calls a "great Work" ain't so great MOF it's an epic fail to end all epic fails.

BEWARE OF THIS DEVIL AND HIS SCAM


However, as your nature is exposed in every word you utter I don't need anybody else's opinion to expose you. You are clearly an outright fraud. I don't know why you are doing what you are doing. However your ignorance could be dangerous to others if they believe it and yourself if you believe it.

I don't normally respond like this to anybody. For somebody like you I will make an exception. You appear to be practicing the old alchemical scam of turning bullshit to gold and then leaving with the gold or some variant thereon. Your egotiistical ignorance is your most outstanding feature. Hope your having a good time because ROFLMAO is the right reception for this joke of a book.

He has been spamking the web with this. Just google "sign00" stone

sign00
12-21-2011, 05:38 AM
I'm bored of people coming here to enlighten me with "real" alchemy according to their own nonsensical interpretations, with no references from genuine alchemical writings. If you have some quotes for me then I'm more than willing to listen. Otherwise, I have better things to do.

Send me a postcard.

sign00
12-21-2011, 05:39 AM
I don't tolerate people who claim to have big secrets but are unable to explain what it is. Go away or receive my wraths.

The Stone is real. And anyone who understands alchemy must understand this, because "as above, so below". The fundamental concept of alchemy is that every level is the reflection of the one above, therefore the entire concept of alchemy is only valid if the Stone is real. If the Stone is spiritual then alchemy falls apart since it would be disproving its own theories.

duh

Illen A. Cluf
12-21-2011, 05:53 AM
I'm bored of people coming here to enlighten me with "real" alchemy according to their own nonsensical interpretations, with no references from genuine alchemical writings. If you have some quotes for me then I'm more than willing to listen. Otherwise, I have better things to do.

Send me a postcard.

Are you so obsessed with your own unchanging views that you can no longer listen to others? I repeat: Nobody here is trying to enlighten you with "real alchemy" because nobody here has knowingly made the Stone. In fact, there is no legitimate record of ANYONE over at least the last few decades who has made that accomplishment, although there are enough misfits who make that claim.

You seem unusually obsessed with believing things that are just not true, despite repetition.

As for quotes, again you only see what you want to see. Which reminds me of a song by Simon and Garfunkel .... "all lies in jest, until a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest". As I already mentioned, take a look at Helen Hermetist's message. LOTS OF QUOTES which, because of your self-inflicted blindness, you just can't see.

sign00
12-21-2011, 06:05 AM
This thread is redundant now - this is all in the book in the Questions & Answers chapter, you are wasting my time. Read the book....if you know how to read.

sign00
12-21-2011, 06:12 AM
Are blah blah blither total bollocks etc.

Excellent counterpoint, you really hit all the high spots. Is this sort of dialogue considered incisive debate in your circles or
merely witty banter?

OK, let me put it another way. In the movie Jurassic Park, there's a scene where a researcher sticks her hand in a pile of dinosaur shit, digs around, and pulls out an undigested berry. I'm sure if I read Cluffie, I too may discover a crap covered berry, but to me, the price is way too high.

sign00
12-21-2011, 06:17 AM
I have a long standing position of not aiding people who won't do any work themselves. Either read my book or leave the thread. Anything else is just egotistical, childish attention seeking. :mad:

III
12-21-2011, 07:13 AM
I don't tolerate people who claim to have big secrets but are unable to explain what it is. Go away or receive my wraths.


The Stone is real. And anyone who understands alchemy must understand this, because "as above, so below". The fundamental concept of alchemy is that every level is the reflection of the one above, therefore the entire concept of alchemy is only valid if the Stone is real. If the Stone is spiritual then alchemy falls apart since it would be disproving its own theories.

duh

or receive my wraths

Would that be the wraths of con?

Condemned by every syllable he utters ...

Ghislain
12-21-2011, 10:24 AM
Addressed to everyone and no one in particular...


tol•er•ance/ˈtɒlərəns/ [tol-er-uhns]

noun

1. a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race,
religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry.

Source: (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/tolerance)



In an article ”TOLERANCE Learning Its Limits” (http://www.thercg.org/youth/articles/0501-t.html) BY KEVIN D. DENEE


Tolerance is a hot topic today. It is debated in politics. It is taught in schools to children of every age.
It is endorsed by corporations of varying sizes. It is promoted by civil rights advocates. In the Western world,
and increasingly in other countries, tolerance is intrinsic to the fabric of society.

Denee goes on to describe Tolerance coming from a biblical perspective, but lays down a few general rules:

YOU SHOULD BE:

Excusing, forbearing, forgiving, kind-hearted, longsuffering, merciful, patient, receptive and understanding

YOU SHOULD NOT BE:

Accusative, critical, condemning and holier-than-thou.

Denee then goes on to say...


The bottom line is this: We SHOULD NOT and CANNOT tolerate sin. We live in a tolerant
age, a time when people accept every vile and corrupt lifestyle under the sun. But, again, this
should not describe us when sin is involved in a “lifestyle choice.”

As an important side note, God is also extremely intolerant of false doctrine (II John 10-11)

Many things in life require balance. When it comes to tolerance, there are some who
seem to accept any kind of behaviour. There are others who do not accept anything,
and “get in your face” when you do something or believe something contrary to what
they do or believe. Both ditches are wrong.

In another article:

”The art form of Tolerance Learn to not be affected by rude people and build good karma in buckets!” ( http://jerricousher.hubpages.com/hub/The-art-form-of-Tolerance-Learn-to-not-be-affected-by-rude-people)

By Jerrico Usher


...We should be enlightened enough to see past peoples actions to the heart of why their
doing them. Most people who act unkindly are simply sad, or frustrated in their life. I know this
doesn't give them any right to be unkind but it also doesn't give you the right to reflect that
unkindness back...

...Ask yourself before you judge them, why am I affected so drastically by their actions? Why is it
so personal to me? These questions will unlock the true reason YOU are mad at them.. Often
although their actions are worthy of your upset, it is not their actions or rudeness directly that is
causing your emotions to take you over in an angry or irritated trance!

This is a great, albeit long, article so I won’t bore you with the details here, but I do recommend reading it.

Every day's a school day! :)

Ghislain

Hellin Hermetist
12-21-2011, 11:56 AM
I'm bored of people coming here to enlighten me with "real" alchemy according to their own nonsensical interpretations, with no references from genuine alchemical writings. If you have some quotes for me then I'm more than willing to listen. Otherwise, I have better things to do.

Send me a postcard.

Look man, I posted enough quotes from genuine alchemical writings for your pleasure, but it seems that you are blind or that your brains aren't inside your head. Except from that I have sth more to inform you.

I know that you have gone to other forums, like abovetopsecret.com, to make the same propaganda you are trying to make here. You have even copied entire messages from there and post them here. I also know that most of the people there have studied only one or two modern books written about the subject (the truth is that all these books speak about chemistry and not alchemy) or haven't studied any book at all. The result is that you made quite an impression in these types of forums and found many followers there.

Now, I want to inform you that things are different here, so don't waste your time by trying to find new followers. Most of the people here have studied many classical texts and many have some practical experience too. Some members of the forum have in their possession rare ancient Greek or Arabic manuscripts, which you haven't seen even in your dreams. Others know how to extract heavy oils with tinging properties from metals or to give metals the form of running mercury. So, don't expect to persuade many people to follow your advices. Maybe it's better for you to spend your valuable time in another forum.

sign00
12-21-2011, 03:34 PM
I'm not your MAN, boy, you cannot refute anything I actually say so now you have invented a straw man and put words in its mouth. What a dishonest cunt you are!

You have no point - you are a blitherer who brings up irrelevancies. I dispose of them, not to convince a moron like you, but for the benefit of others not intractably stupid like you. You, a compulsive moron, have convincingly demonstrated that you will continue to bring up such inanities repeatedly, even after they have been utterly shot down, just as a dog will return to its vomit.

And now, having disposed of all your idiotic points yet again, they and you are dismissed. (Although I know you will blither on nonetheless - it's a compulsive disorder you seem unable to overcome.)

sign00
12-21-2011, 03:40 PM
or receive my wraths

Would that be the wraths of con?

Condemned by every syllable he utters ...


Look who can use colours! <rofl>

You are obsessed and can't admit that you totally missed the context. On top of that you can't even complete the quote correctly.

As I said before, go fuck yourself you self-important ass. When you are done with that perhaps you will be relaxed enough to re-read the thread and admit you missed the point entirely. It's way past time for you to get real.

HTH & HAND

Illen A. Cluf
12-21-2011, 03:44 PM
I'm not your MAN, boy, you cannot refute anything I actually say so now you have invented a straw man and put words in its mouth. What a dishonest cunt you are!

You have no point - you are a blitherer who brings up irrelevancies. I dispose of them, not to convince a moron like you, but for the benefit of others not intractably stupid like you. You, a compulsive moron, have convincingly demonstrated that you will continue to bring up such inanities repeatedly, even after they have been utterly shot down, just as a dog will return to its vomit.

And now, having disposed of all your idiotic points yet again, they and you are dismissed. (Although I know you will blither on nonetheless - it's a compulsive disorder you seem unable to overcome.)

Well, what more needs to be said. This misfit has fully exposed his true face. With this type of language, shouldn't the Moderator ban him?

sign00
12-21-2011, 03:46 PM
...was my fault, 100%.

Not one of you know enough alchemy to challenge me, for instance, the simplest, fundamental use of human urine. So piss away.

Anyone with a modicum of alchemical talent would know that semen is the better ingredient. Don't bust your testicles, if you have one, thinking about it now...I can see auras, and so I know that during "those moments" energy is radiating off the genitals like crazy. Which would lead me to assume that the semen must also be full of energy.

There...more free stuff from me and what have I received in return from this forum?

Shit.

Hellin Hermetist
12-21-2011, 03:51 PM
Conclusion of the whole topic. Don't drink your putrefied urine like the author of the topic did. It can cause serious mental disorders. Goodnight.

Hellin Hermetist
12-21-2011, 04:00 PM
Anyone who want to have some fun can go here and watch the same silly performance from the same stupid man.

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread679877/pg1

He hasn't even changed the title of the topic or the content of his messages. He copies and pastes them here. What a moron!

lifetime seeker
12-21-2011, 04:00 PM
Everyone calm done... take some breathes and stop this non-sense.

This thread has digressed to the point which it will destroy any good.

Sign00, there is a point of contention here, no matter who started what first,
this disscussion must stop. And as a new member, I'm sorry but the weight
lies upon yourself to show restraint.

When there's a party happening and someone new shows up then
a fight breaks out; I'm sorry but the new guy is no longer welcome.
IMHO, you've got to regain you composure and possibly gracefully leave.
Enemies are not what we are trying to create.

Sign00, you have created a site which has gained a following. Many who study what lies
on Web have already taken notice. If you believe in yourself and written work, please continue
the pursuit, encourage the followers and attempt a creation. Maybe new elements
will be found and all can benefit.

Actions will always speak louder than words

One thing in my life I have learned
- when people yell at me
- it causes me to turn and walk away

Let this season of thankfulness show all of us the way

sign00
12-21-2011, 04:25 PM
Everyone calm done... take some breathes and stop this non-sense.

This thread has digressed to the point which it will destroy any good.

Sign00, there is a point of contention here, no matter who started what first,
this disscussion must stop. And as a new member, I'm sorry but the weight
lies upon yourself to show restraint.

Oh I see, the newbie must take the blame for the older and more experienced posters to the forum. <larf> What a croc. So typical of my entire forum experience, a buch of know-nothigs claiming they know-something while blithering like toads on a pond at midnight.


When there's a party happening and someone new shows up then
a fight breaks out; I'm sorry but the new guy is no longer welcome.
IMHO, you've got to regain you composure and possibly gracefully leave.
Enemies are not what we are trying to create.

Sign00, you have created a site which has gained a following. Many who study what lies
on Web have already taken notice. If you believe in yourself and written work, please continue
the pursuit, encourage the followers and attempt a creation. Maybe new elements
will be found and all can benefit.

Actions will always speak louder than words

One thing in my life I have learned
- when people yell at me
- it causes me to turn and walk away

Let this season of thankfulness show all of us the way

I have done my best, talk to your fellow posters who have ruined this thread and, in tunr, ruin all aclhemy. Talk to them, the hate mongers and the fools.

You could have simply said that you are unable to grasp the concept of my comprehending context. Maybe if you if you read the entire book before
leaping to your baseless conclusion you'll have better luck.

If you insist on prompting your flawed perspective then I suggest that you go fornicate yourself with a broken bottle.

HTH & HAND.

sign00
12-21-2011, 04:28 PM
Conclusion of the whole topic. Don't drink your putrefied urine like the author of the topic did. It can cause serious mental disorders. Goodnight.

Once again no fact, combined with a flailing attempt to denigrate your opponent.

Game, set, match. Thanks for playing, better luck next time.

sign00
12-21-2011, 04:55 PM
He hasn't even changed the title of the topic or the content of his messages. He copies and pastes them here. What a moron!

Incidentally, I'm in the middle of writing a new book on how to detect lies and misinformation, for which this is a perfect example.

sign00
12-21-2011, 05:38 PM
There are an estimated 14,000 excess deaths in the United States are linked to the radioactive fallout from the disaster at the Fukushima nuclear reactors in Japan, according to a major new article in the December 2011 edition of the International Journal of Health Services. This is the first peer-reviewed study published in a medical journal documenting the health hazards of Fukushima.

So what do we have here? Assclowns who would rather attempt to trade wits with a Superior instead of making the Stone and spreading the health.

Now, your mindless bloodthirst exposed for what it is, you want to back off? Well, slither away then, but don't expect me to take you or your specious rationalizations any more seriously now than before. You are crawling back into your hole to lick your wounds after being soundly publicly thrashed, but you have learned nothing and will, when your wounds heal, emerge again just as stupid as ever.

I'm out of here. Death isn't good enough for the lot of you.

Illen A. Cluf
12-21-2011, 05:58 PM
after being soundly publicly thrashed

You sure got that backwards!! Based on your dismal performance here, you have forever proven your total lack of credibility. We see through you very clearly. Play your childish games with the naive newbies on your forum. Don't mess around with those here who know better.

As for your book on lies - I hope you use yourself as a prime example. You have come onto various forums now always promoting yourself through the guise of another member. If that isn't an outright lie! At least you're an expert on one thing.


I'm out of here. Death isn't good enough for the lot of you.

Merry Christmas to you as well!

Good riddance! Take care of that enormous Ego of yours. And wash your filthy mouth out with some strong soap.

Hellin Hermetist
12-21-2011, 06:08 PM
Incidentally, I'm in the middle of writing a new book on how to detect lies and misinformation, for which this is a perfect example.

He forgot to provide also the link I gave in my message, so I give it again here.

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread679877/pg1

Lets see who is the liar now

Illen A. Cluf
12-21-2011, 06:48 PM
He forgot to provide also the link I gave in my message, so I give it again here.

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread679877/pg1

Lets see who is the liar now

Here's what this liar wrote to me:



Help For you

You're an asshole but I feel in the Xmas mood so.............

I have some helpful information for you.

There are exactly two categories of people who might read any article
you post. The first group comprises those who know you're a liar, a
plagiarist, a fraud and an idiot. The second includes only those who
have never heard of you..

Your lies and incoherent nonsense just give the first group an
opportunity to laugh at you, and any of the second group who see that
crap will immediately migrate to the first.

If you want to maintain as good an image as possible, your best bet?

Shut the fuck up.

I think it's likely another of his standard messages, sent to the many people who dared challenge his nonsense.

I remember reading in a Psychology book once that often people reflect their own inner failings onto others. I think this applies to this author. His style, Ego, dogmatism, rapid mood swings, and profanity reminds me of ***. I wonder if they're related?

Andro
12-21-2011, 07:18 PM
Here's what this liar wrote to me:


"You're an asshole"
"There are exactly two categories of people who might read any article you post.
The first group comprises those who know you're a liar, a plagiarist, a fraud and an idiot."
"Shut the fuck up."

I think it's likely another of his standard messages, sent to the many people who dared challenge his nonsense.

I remember reading in a Psychology book once that often people reflect their own inner failings onto others. I think this applies to this author. His style, Ego, dogmatism, rapid mood swings, and profanity reminds me of ***. I wonder if they're related?

If he is resorting to threats ('his wrath', etc...) and to personal insults like you posted above, he is overstepping the guidelines and rules of conduit on this Forum, and I think Dev and/or Sol should be made aware about this. Noone is getting banned from AF because of personal opinions, but when the threats and insults start, it's a different story altogether.

III
12-21-2011, 07:30 PM
Well now sign00, you have taken off the mask. You come across as a badly written character in in a work of fiction portraying the evil alchemical conman. You claim superiority but rant and rave like a psychotic. You threaten those who won't believe in you with your "wraths". You threaten, curse and call names those who doubt you. Even PT Barnum distinguished between those who were suckers and those that are not. He was content to fleece the suckers without getting upset about those who were not. Barnum knew he was providing dubious items as entertainment and did not confuse that with "truth". You appear to be confusing your confused egotistical fantasies with reality. The more you write the more delusional you appear. I admit, I adapted the quotes I included since if you should be taken out and hanged it isn't for the "cold blooded murder of the English tongue". Tar and feathering was a more common fate of alchemical conmen. And how could I turn down the opportunity for a pun? "Con" which describes you versus "khan" that doesn't.. Have you no humour? Need I ask? Your narcissistic self importance wouldn't leave room. As a matter of fact this whole discussion is quite traditional. Anybody making such claims as you do is going to be challanged, have their "corns" stomped on as DeRopp has put it. Such a "corn stomping" will tell much about the person being so challanged. Without claims it becomes merely the "waundering monks game" which is basically a metaphyisical dialog in which each person takes the next step in turn and the limits of their knowledge revealed. However, spouting lots of quotes is an accademic game which does not indicate any genuine understanding or knowledge and gives no indication at all of the genuine synthesis of being that can occur in alchemy. So now the question before us is this; just how delusional are you? Do you genuinely believe your fantasies are real? Are you psychotic? At least that would be genuine, and a genuine indicator of an alchemy gone wrong.

I don't "know" any of the other people posting here. However, there is nobody else I have read here that strikes me as non-genuine. They might be accurate or inaccurate or whatever in their understandings and practices. That is a different thing. You delude yourself to think that anybody might want to teach you as you appear quite unteachable. There is something blatently different about you, and it is NOT that you are an accomplished alchemist. Perhaps you have fallen prey to "madness", that afflicted so many unsucessful alchemists who took a wrong turn somewhere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megalomania
Megalomania is a psycho-pathological condition characterized by delusional (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/wiki/Delusion) fantasies of power, relevance, or omnipotence (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/wiki/Omnipotence). 'Megalomania is characterized by an inflated sense of self-esteem (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/wiki/Self-esteem) and overestimation by persons of their powers and beliefs'.[1] (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/#cite_note-0) Historically it was used as an old name for narcissistic personality disorder (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder) prior to the latter's first use by Heinz Kohut (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/wiki/Heinz_Kohut) in 1968, and is used these days as a non-clinical equivalent.[2] (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/#cite_note-1)[3] (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/#cite_note-2) It is not mentioned in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/wiki/Diagnostic_and_Statistical_Manual_of_Mental_Disord ers) (DSM)[4] (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/#cite_note-dsm-3) or the International Statistical Classification of Diseases (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/wiki/International_Statistical_Classification_of_Diseas es) (ICD).

Illen A. Cluf
12-21-2011, 07:40 PM
If he is resorting to threats ('his wrath', etc...) and to personal insults like you posted above, he is overstepping the guidelines and rules of conduit on this Forum, and I think Dev and/or Sol should be made aware about this. Noone is getting banned from AF because of personal opinions, but when the threats and insults start, it's a different story altogether.

I thought that his use of profanity, especially against Hellin would be enough to have him banned. I believe that Yahoo has a strong policy against the use of profanity and threats, enough to have anyone banned from any Yahoo group.

Anyways, I think that he has already left.

Illen A. Cluf
12-21-2011, 07:59 PM
Just a few things to add to this discussion about the Book of Aquarius.

Despite the author's refusal to understand that I did indeed read his book (actually quite a few months ago), I went through it very carefully. Sure, he has a lot of good quotes in it, but anyone could do the same. The book could easily have been written in two months or less using a lot of cut and paste.

There are mistakes in the document (e.g. he says that Fulcanelli did not make the Stone until the 1930's which is incorrect), and I disagree that the quotes used to support the author's claims have much to do with his claims. In my opinion, many of them have very little or nothing at all to do with urine. He makes a far stretch and uses selective quoting which doesn't even work to make his points.

Finally, if you read the old texts properly, you will know that this urine process has absolutely nothing to do with the alchemy that the ancients actually discussed. The ancients stressed, time and time again, that the matter can only come from the mineral world. Even though urine contains minerals (almost everything does ,to some extent) it comes from the Animal Kingdom, NOT the Mineral Kingdom.

Plain and simple, this theory is not founded on any traditional alchemical basis. It mostly follows several of those nebulous treatises written after the 16th century. I'm convinced that this theory, like so many popular theories circulating the web, will lead to nothing but a dead end.

As for the author him/herself, although there are strong similarities with *** in terms of temperament and personality, the writing style is quite different from the writing style of ***.

It is interesting to note that the owner of bookofaquarius.forgottenbooks.org, which this author started out by saying he had a major interest in, is a David Forsythe. It is obvious that he also has an interest in old books, so it could possibly be that he is the author himself.

thoth
12-21-2011, 10:34 PM
(Speaking as a relative beginner on the practical side) I still have an open mind on the process he refers to. Keeping Helen Hermetist's quotes in mind, about the starting matter being Mineral, its hard (for me) to know in alchemy when the old authors are speaking in metaphors or just plainly. Could the oil of lead actually refer to a heavy corrupt liquid matter

When they say the starting matter is definitely not A,B, C are they really saying it is A,B ,C ?

I plan to try the procedure described in the book. It may be a dead end but the worst that can happen is nothing - I may learn a few practical things and maybe get some insights. May try using different matters.

I was dissappointed though that Sign00 was so rude and agressive, that would make me doubt ......Someone who is confident in their theory shouldnt need to turn up the heat (except in the crucible)

Again as a relative newcomer I would be interested if anyone has any opinions on the DEFINITIONs section of his forum, are they accuurate ?

Still looking for Ariadne's thread...

Illen A. Cluf
12-21-2011, 11:10 PM
(Speaking as a relative beginner on the practical side) I still have an open mind on the process he refers to. Keeping Helen Hermetist's quotes in mind, about the starting matter being Mineral, its hard (for me) to know in alchemy when the old authors are speaking in metaphors or just plainly. Could the oil of lead actually refer to a heavy corrupt liquid matter

When they say the starting matter is definitely not A,B, C are they really saying it is A,B ,C ?

I plan to try the procedure described in the book. It may be a dead end but the worst that can happen is nothing - I may learn a few practical things and maybe get some insights. May try using different matters.

I was dissappointed though that Sign00 was so rude and agressive, that would make me doubt ......Someone who is confident in their theory shouldnt need to turn up the heat (except in the crucible)

Again as a relative newcomer I would be interested if anyone has any opinions on the DEFINITIONs section of his forum, are they accuurate ?

Still looking for Ariadne's thread...

Hi thoth,

Please don't let anything that I (or anybody else) say change your own curiosity, need to experiment and verify in your own mind. Until someone has actually made the Stone, their understanding is not really any more definite than that of anyone's else's.

As for determining when the ancients are likely speaking openly or metaphorically, I think you get a better "sense" after reading many dozens or even hundreds of old treatises. Even then, you can never be certain, but can at least be fairly confident of their intentions.

Andro
12-21-2011, 11:28 PM
When they say the starting matter is definitely not A,B, C are they really saying it is A,B ,C ?

The 'Matter' is One and One only.

Materials used as magnets/fixers/matrices for our 'One Matter' can be of many kinds, including (but NOT limited to) the mineral realm.

All geniuses have a little Hermes in them. Many of them speak and inquire deeply about our ONE Matter.

Tesla, Russel, Reich (to mention a few) knew of IT, even though they were not 'Alchemists' in the 'classical/traditional' sense of the word.

Many times they can be more explicit and much less mystifying than the 'traditional' Alchemical writings.

Maybe you should read them as well... (the more scientifically inclined among you).

Alchemy is a completely natural process, it happens all around us, all the time.

And NOT only in the mineral realm, but in EVERY realm (just like Nature is not exclusively limited to one realm or another :)).

Our only 'job' as Alchemists is to improve (using the means available in our times) on a phenomenon that is already constantly happening anyway.

There is no such sing as a single recipe. There are only the principles/laws of nature, which need to be applied in our lab/oratories.

This is my perspective.

Awani
12-22-2011, 02:08 AM
I'm out of here. Death isn't good enough for the lot of you.

Bye!

[member banned]

:cool:

Ghislain
12-22-2011, 10:08 AM
Who was that masked man?

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSmHMuIHIYgCJaFdkO2_ZRyN6cleKtSQ VT9icc1E7j6GGn51Bjwig

Sign00 sounded like someone crying out for help; I dont think He/She got much from me. :(

They say a change is as good as a rest. That was like a breath of fresh air stirring up stagnant complacency.

Also a good test of each members composure. How did you all fare?

It did pose one question for me; I have never been a member of any other Alchemical forum...was that the
norm in other forums?

I guess enough was enough though and the ban was well timed http://th146.photobucket.com/albums/r251/xyzero123/th_bow.gif

softly, softly, catchee monkey

Ghislain

Andro
12-22-2011, 03:35 PM
Who was that masked man?

Quoth 'V for Vendetta (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/V_for_Vendetta_%28film%29)':


Evey: Who are you?
V: Who? Who is but the form following the function of what, and what I am is a man in a mask.
Evey: Well, I can see that.
V: Of course you can. I'm not questioning your powers of observation, I'm merely remarking upon the paradox of asking a masked man who he is.
Evey: Oh, right.


Also a good test of each members composure. How did you all fare?

I suppose I fared-well :p


I have never been a member of any other Alchemical forum...was that the norm in other forums?

Pornography is a matter of Geography :)

:cool:

Illen A. Cluf
12-22-2011, 04:30 PM
Who was that masked man?

Obviously someone looking for a great amount of attention, yet so incredibly unsure of him/herself that he/she must remain masked.


Sign00 sounded like someone crying out for help; I dont think He/She got much from me. :(

He/she specifically went to great lengths insisting that he/she did not want or need any help whatsoever. For Sign00, this theory is all or nothing. No other possibility is comprehensible. What this immature (and obviously young) individual needs is a good old fashioned spanking and some major growing up. As mentioned in other posts, I have no sympathy for frauds at all. There is far too much "tolerance" or "political correctness" in this world at the present time, and I think it has the potential to cause our undoing in terms of evolutionary growth as a society. Too few people seem to see this and do not speak out for what is wrong. This only encourages these misfits to continue to prey on susceptible and naive people. Tolerance is certainly a noble quality, but only up to a point. Everything is always in flux, going from one extreme to another, and I feel we need to know where the cut-off point is. I strongly feel that tolerance should only extend within a reasonable range. We have gone far too much out of that range. This is why today we hear so many stories about innocent persons being beaten up while dozens of bystanders stand around and do absolutely nothing. We no longer seem to know where the limits of depravity ends and where responsibility starts.


They say a change is as good as a rest. That was like a breath of fresh air stirring up stagnant complacency.

I don't think it was a breath of fresh air at all. It was more like a very foul odor. But it did indeed test complacency. Very few jumped in to try to make this person aware of his/her wrong doings. Some even seemed to support him/her against those who who tried to stop the deception!


Also a good test of each members composure. How did you all fare?

It never feels good to jump in (I've had a few restless nights), but someone has to do it for the sake of many others who could be easily manipulated by these strong Egos. I would certainly do it again.


It did pose one question for me; I have never been a member of any other Alchemical forum...was that the
norm in other forums?

No. This person is mild compared to some individuals on other forums. By the way, this individual came onto other forums in the same way, promoting him/herself through his own post, pretending to be someone else. That was quite some time ago. I don't think he/she was prepared for the incredible perception and experience of some of the members here.

Thanks to all who "jumped in"! For your courage, sense of responsibility, and willingness to defend reason and order, you have my greatest respect.

Illen

Nibiru
12-22-2011, 07:50 PM
Withdrawing my fuel from the fire :)

Ghislain
12-22-2011, 09:19 PM
Nibiru

What questions would you have posed?

Illen

You could just ignore that sort of person if they really are getting to you.

You know what you know...they can not change that just by disagreeing with you and they
go away unlearned.

Sometimes the argument is what they seek, although I must admit I was not expecting
the rude outburst that came forth. No one deserved that so I guess I can see your point of view,
but forgive me if I don't fully agree with you.

Acting the way Sign00 acted is not the norm in this forum and therefore I had to ask myself, why did
Sign00 act the way s/he did. Perhaps Sign00 has been the victim of another's injustice that s/he wants
to vent this on the rest of the world. If this was the case then Sign00 needed help to cope with that, not
our scorn.

A world of tolerance would be a better world...it may not be the easiest world however :confused:
At the same time I am not advocating non action, just appropriate action that may benefit all party's concerned.

It all starts inside each of us, we fabricate the world we wish to live in.

Ghislain

III
12-22-2011, 10:47 PM
I think that the best usage to which we can put this is as a learning experience. He was attempting to wear the mask of a "superior" being without realizing how fake his mask so obviously was. Since he isn't what he was pretending to be his ego constructed mask yelled FAKE at every turn. He made clear he was in it for money and power and that it had nothing at all to do with spiritual practice or accomplishment. At least he was honest in that. His becoming quite unhinged so easily indicates he has done none of the prepatory purification work etc. He would be a danger to himself and others in many spaces as his attitudes also clearly indicate.

Many of the fake alchemists we all will run across will be of a similar variety. In the Tantric alchemy field J.R. Haule estimated that 99% of those supposedly teaching Tantra were really teaching only tantric sex and were not teaching Alchemy. Like sign00's focus on wealth and power, they focus on sex sex sex and power and wealth. In Tantra, sexual practices are also energy practices. It's about the results of using the tools, not about the tools that produce them. Those that make it all about sex are usually using the tools to collect dozens or hundreds of sexual partners, never getting any more skilled in the use of the tools to advance towards enlightenment.

We are self designing self realizing intellegences. Our immortal soul is our Great Work, our Magnum Opus. To say that during the millenia of supression would get one burned at the stake for heresy or otherwise penalized. So it had to be talked about in veiled terms. Those taken in by that intentional mis-lead added to it quite sincerely and built up a sizable literature actually looking to create a literal physical stone of magical qualities. During many periods having unauthorized sex in unauthorized ways for unauthorized durations having unauthorized effects was enough to get one killed so that was well hidden. Looking for "gold" was much safer and rich patrons were always on the lookout for obtaining more gold. So those looking for gold were always revealed as to their understanding. Those who were most dangerous to the alchemist were those who knew that it wasn't about gold. In the end things split off and we ended up with lots of chemists and a few oldfashioned spiritual alchemists using various physical means. One might say that the "stone" then is the materialized "attention" produced by any suitable means.

Illen A. Cluf
12-22-2011, 11:09 PM
Hi Nibiru, thanks for the reply.



Illen

You could just ignore that sort of person if they really are getting to you.

You know what you know...they can not change that just by disagreeing with you and they
go away unlearned.

That was the whole point. Of course nothing I or anybody else said could have changed his/her mind. Perhaps, though it might plant a tiny seed in the back of his/her mind, especially when the theory does not pan out.

But my strategy was not really to change anyone's mind, especially his/hers. It was merely to get him/her to show his/her real face, and to point out to any vulnerable newbies not to jump on anyone who comes across so strongly and with such pretended determination. By "newbies" I only mean someone who is freshly starting out and craving for direction. We are all "newbies" until we finally make the Stone. At least I still consider myself to be one, despite my decade of experience.


Sometimes the argument is what they seek, although I must admit I was not expecting
the rude outburst that came forth. No one deserved that so I guess I can see your point of view,
but forgive me if I don't fully agree with you.I don't think he/she expected that intense of an argument. He/she seems quite convinced and used to the idea that most people will just fall at his/her knees without question. I know others with the exact same attitude.

I was also quite surprised by the immediate rudeness. We all began quite gently, with mutual respect, but he/she suddenly went ballistic.

It's great that you disagree. That's what discussion is all about. It would be a sad world if we all agreed. Sharing points of view and respecting those views is of prime importance. However, when one steps totally outside the guidelines of common respect and decency, then he/she deserves to be reprimanded. If you have children, you will understand this. There are far too many parents today who let their children get away with all sorts of misbehavior, out of lack of responsibility, and often those children end up in a life of violence or crime. Nobody wants to be the "bad guy" when it comes to discipline, but in the end, it is often far better than not to do anything.


Acting the way Sign00 acted is not the norm in this forum and therefore I had to ask myself, why did
Sign00 act the way s/he did. Perhaps Sign00 has been the victim of another's injustice that s/he wants
to vent this on the rest of the world. If this was the case then Sign00 needed help to cope with that, not
our scorn.

It's likely because his/her parents did not point out to him/her what was appropriate or inappropriate behavior along with some other issues concerning inadequacy. I totally agree that s/he needs psychiatric help, but that does not mean that we should not help protect the innocent from his/her machinations.

Ask yourself this question: If you see a bully, victim of his upbringing, severely beating up an innocent victim, do you just walk away and say: "oh, well, he's just venting his hostility because of his background, I feel sorry for him, so I'll just walk away" or do you help the innocent victim? There are thousands of victims in the world, some permanently damaged for life. They did not deserve that. Yet their story is seldom heard, and all you ever read in the media is about those poor aggressors and what a terrible life they led, and how that "justified" their behavior. Talk to some of the victims. Do they deserve to live a horrible life because of our concern for the aggressors? I would say that our first and primary concern is for the innocent. That was my position. Don't let one misfit ruin the lives of hundreds. Protect the innocent first by taking away any influence he may have on them, and then deal with him separately.


A world of tolerance would be a better world...it may not be the easiest world however :confused:
At the same time I am not advocating non action, just appropriate action that may benefit all party's concerned.

As I said, I'm all for tolerance - but only up to a point. Society has gone to a level where there is far too much tolerance and concern for aggressors, but little or no consideration for the numerous victims of such abuse. Few realize this, because the stories of the victims are seldom heard. There has to be a choice - the innocent victims or the guilty aggressors. I always choose the former.


It all starts inside each of us, we fabricate the world we wish to live in.

That's why I think that we need to start to have far more concern for the innocent victims. Don't be brainwashed by the press. The story of the aggressor is exciting. The story of the victim is anything but. It's downright sad.

Illen

Ghislain
12-23-2011, 08:48 AM
I think that the best usage to which we can put this is as a learning experience. He
was attempting to wear the mask of a "superior" being without realizing how fake
his mask so obviously was.

And what did we learn from that? That we were dealing with an immature
misguided child. And what do you do with an immature misguided child?
Join them in their tantrum?


His becoming quite unhinged so easily indicates he has done none of the
prepatory purification work etc. He would be a danger to himself and others in
many spaces as his attitudes also clearly indicate

I think what, “His becoming quite unhinged so easily indicates”, is that s/he has
a deep problem.

If someone comes to you with a wound do you dress the wound or cut it deeper?
Do you give the person warmth, rest and reassurance or do you complain to them
that they are bleeding all over your carpet and that in fact they are probably going
to die from their infliction?

Do you condemn the person who inflicted the wound or get the other side of the
story first?

The difference between physical wounds and mental wounds is that you can see
and understand the former where the latter just leaves you feeling helpless and
tending to react badly, sometimes hiding our head in the sand and denying there
is a wound at all.

There is a saying, “Rome wasn’t built in a day”, used when a task is too big or
difficult to be accomplished quickly, originally a French proverb, 'Rome was not
made all in one day,' which was recorded in 'Li Proverbe au Vilain' (c. 1190).

1190 till now! How long do we wait, making excuses, before we realise we are
doing it all wrong?

Do we ignore the fact that nothing is changing and just join in with the norm. Do
we wait patiently in discomfort for others to take action; lifting themselves above
the norm, or do we join the others and take action ourselves; albeit raising our
discomfort level temporarily for the benefit of all?...including ourselves.


But my strategy was not really to change anyone's mind, especially his/hers. It
was merely to get him/her to show his/her real face, and to point out to any
vulnerable newbies not to jump on anyone who comes across so strongly and
with such pretended determination.

When a parent smacks a child they are usually venting their frustration and inability to
cope with the situation on the child. What does that teach the child?..to do the same...

Did Sign00 learn anything from his interaction with us or did we reinforce his
misguided beliefs?

Ghislain

Illen A. Cluf
12-23-2011, 02:13 PM
When a parent smacks a child they are usually venting their frustration and inability to
cope with the situation on the child. What does that teach the child?..to do the same...

Did Sign00 learn anything from his interaction with us or did we reinforce his
misguided beliefs?

Remember, that nobody got "smacked". I think you completely misunderstood my post. This was not so much about the aggressor, but about the victims. Why is it today that everyone is so blind to the plight of the victim? Has media brainwashing really become so powerful? As I said before, I truly believe that excess of complacency will be our downfall.

Illen

Bennu Lugh
12-23-2011, 10:23 PM
Ghislain wrote:


Remember, that nobody got "smacked". I think you completely misunderstood my post. This was not so much about the aggressor, but about the victims. Why is it today that everyone is so blind to the plight of the victim? Has media brainwashing really become so powerful? As I said before, I truly believe that excess of complacency will be our downfall.

Illen

Hi guys -

It looks like you're both arguing the same point from two different views. I don't think anyone here was trying to ignore the victim and simply placate the aggressor. Trying to de-escalate Sign00's outbursts is akin to pushing the bully away from the helpless victim. Often times fighting fire with fire in an argument leads to a bigger fire with more casualties.

By the same token, in cases such as Sign00, no matter how much you try to calm someone with an ego that size, it's best just to cut strings and sever a caustic relationship. Sometimes victims are victims because they put themselves in that situation (and I'm speaking from the point of view of a victim).

III
12-24-2011, 07:16 AM
Hi guys -

It looks like you're both arguing the same point from two different views. I don't think anyone here was trying to ignore the victim and simply placate the aggressor. Trying to de-escalate Sign00's outbursts is akin to pushing the bully away from the helpless victim. Often times fighting fire with fire in an argument leads to a bigger fire with more casualties.

By the same token, in cases such as Sign00, no matter how much you try to calm someone with an ego that size, it's best just to cut strings and sever a caustic relationship. Sometimes victims are victims because they put themselves in that situation (and I'm speaking from the point of view of a victim).

I don't see that we have to put this into any kind of bully - victim paradyme. We have a possibly deranged (I did ask him if he was psychotic) person spewing verbal chunks in all directions with what appears to be some delusional ideation going on. There is no need for anybody to take on a victim identity in this situation. And for anybody to take on a victim identity because of another person hitting their shit which actually is a proper Alchemical function of sorts and behaving badly, exposes some of that persons need for more purification. Whether sign00 will ever thank us for exposing some of his flaws or not doesn't matter. If he thanks us then perhaps he understands. If he blames us and storms off in a huff his understanding leaves much to be disired.

In interacting alchemicaly with a person one of the first things needed in terms of work is an unmasking. Sign00 certainly was unmasked to at least some degree. That doesn't mean that there is not a great deal more left to unmask.

III
12-24-2011, 07:42 AM
And what did we learn from that? That we were dealing with an immature

misguided child. And what do you do with an immature misguided child?
Join them in their tantrum?



I think what, “His becoming quite unhinged so easily indicates”, is that s/he has
a deep problem.

If someone comes to you with a wound do you dress the wound or cut it deeper?
Do you give the person warmth, rest and reassurance or do you complain to them
that they are bleeding all over your carpet and that in fact they are probably going
to die from their infliction?

Do you condemn the person who inflicted the wound or get the other side of the
story first?

The difference between physical wounds and mental wounds is that you can see
and understand the former where the latter just leaves you feeling helpless and
tending to react badly, sometimes hiding our head in the sand and denying there
is a wound at all.

There is a saying, “Rome wasn’t built in a day”, used when a task is too big or
difficult to be accomplished quickly, originally a French proverb, 'Rome was not
made all in one day,' which was recorded in 'Li Proverbe au Vilain' (c. 1190).

1190 till now! How long do we wait, making excuses, before we realise we are
doing it all wrong?

Do we ignore the fact that nothing is changing and just join in with the norm. Do
we wait patiently in discomfort for others to take action; lifting themselves above
the norm, or do we join the others and take action ourselves; albeit raising our
discomfort level temporarily for the benefit of all?...including ourselves.



When a parent smacks a child they are usually venting their frustration and inability to
cope with the situation on the child. What does that teach the child?..to do the same...

Did Sign00 learn anything from his interaction with us or did we reinforce his
misguided beliefs?

Ghislain

Hi Ghislain,

Did Sign00 learn anything from his interaction with us or did we reinforce his misguided beliefs?

We don't know. He may not realize what he learned for some while yet.

I think what, “His becoming quite unhinged so easily indicates”, is that s/he has a deep problem.

Psychosis is certainly a deep problem. And people botching an Alchemical procedure can end up in psychosis or something indistinguisable from one.

Or, perhaps he was merely practicing outer theater to see what response we would give to such behavior. We have insufficient data to really know. I sincerely doubt that anybody here was wounded by sign00's antics. It was only because he played a really consistant "fake alchemist" that I called him a fraud. He hit multiple points. What would Don Juan do?

Now is he misleading us by trying to appear much more ignorant than he really is by badly claiming superiority or trying to make us believe he is more knowledgable than he is and as he appears to be trying to represent Did he really blow up or pretend to blow up? How convoluted is he being? Maybe it is as simple as it appears or maybe it isn't. Whatever sign00 is doing indicates some degree of convolution. He is NOT as represented, about the only thing we can be sure of.

Now of course that takes me to a major point not yet explicitly covered in this way; a person can only teach and convey that which they can do and have made their own. So with anybody that teaches alchemy, one has to be able to do lots of different things and yet finds that there is a lot more that they don't know and can't teach.

Ghislain
12-24-2011, 11:28 AM
Hi Illen

The “smacking” was used as a metaphor. I know nobody got actually smacked but then nobody was
an actual victim either; were they? Anyone can switch off or just ignore something they don’t like
on the net, but we get dragged into believing it really matters.

If you re-read this thread the replies to Sign00 started off very calm and mature but gradually they
deteriorated until they became almost the same. S/he managed to bring some people down to
his/her level. If s/he were not banned I’m sure the quality of the conversation may have depreciated
even further.


perhaps he was merely practicing outer theater to see what response we would give to such behavior.

I have no idea what intension, if any, Sign00 had when starting this thread, but if s/he saw it as a
game, who do you think won?

This may be a case of inherent competitiveness versus altruism. Can there be such a thing as true
altruism? I search for it every day in myself only to find some ulterior motive for my actions. Am I
controlled by my competitiveness in replying to these posts; trying to find the solution before
everyone else. Is this competitiveness what drives the Alchemist? Is it all a game?

Have I said too much ;)

How smug did Agnes Gonxha Bojaxhiu ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother_Teresa) feel... Writing that I felt, "Shame on me", but is there any
question that shouldn't be asked?

To pose this another way, how would we feel if the answers we seek were posted and proved; right
here, right now, today? Did anyone actually want, “The Book of Aquarius”, to give us all the
answers? Would that be the end of the game?

http://cdn.pimpmyspace.org/media/pms/c/iu/ge/xd/ysurrender.gif I Concede to you III


We don’t know

http://www.barefoot.im/images/art/tmb/cheers_smiley_1796_102.jpg Here’s to the continued search.

Ghislain

Illen A. Cluf
12-24-2011, 02:36 PM
Hi Ghislain,


The “smacking” was used as a metaphor. I know nobody got actually smacked but then nobody was
an actual victim either; were they? Anyone can switch off or just ignore something they don’t like
on the net, but we get dragged into believing it really matters.

I hope that this is my last post on this subject, as I seem to be constantly repeating myself. Yes, nobody became a victim on this forum, but only BECAUSE of how Sign00 got demasked and exposed. If some had not jumped in, then I suspect that another dozen or so would have gravitated to Sign00's forum, where there are already a thousand potential "victims" (yes - over a thousand!), not only to his theory on alchemy, but also his dogmas on life, the universe and everything.


If you re-read this thread the replies to Sign00 started off very calm and mature but gradually they
deteriorated until they became almost the same.

S/he managed to bring some people down to his/her level.

That is not true at all. Nobody here threatened this person and nobody here used the type of foul profanity that this person used. In short, nobody on this forum was reduced anywhere near to the low level of this person.


If s/he were not banned I’m sure the quality of the conversation may have depreciated even further.

Also not true. This person left the forum BEFORE s/he was banned.

True Initiate
12-25-2011, 07:29 PM
I remember reading in a Psychology book once that often people reflect their own inner failings onto others. I think this applies to this author. His style, Ego, dogmatism, rapid mood swings, and profanity reminds me of ***. I wonder if they're related?

I thought that too!

By the way do know what *** is up to now? He believes he is a Vampire now and offers his Vampire tinctures for a good price on Ebay!
http://members.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewUserPage&userid=vampirealchemist

and here:
http://myworld.ebay.com/vampirealchemist/

Salazius
12-25-2011, 07:43 PM
IMPRESSIVE ! WOW !!

"Vampire Ascension" sounds like Twilight thing ...:)

Illen A. Cluf
12-25-2011, 08:39 PM
I thought that too!



Doesn't surprise me. By the way, he runs his own forum, with 33 incredibly naive and dedicated followers. He demands a monthly fee from them of $5, which amounts to almost $2,000 per year!! Yet he claims that the fees are trivial.

Since a year and two months ago, he has only posted ten times to his forum!:

1. Seven of those times are repeatedly demanding the payment from his members.
2. One message is a self-promotion about his book.
3. That leaves only two messages in over a year that actually address some of the numerous questions which he mostly ignores - each of these messages is only one short sentence long!

This guy has almost completely deserted his faithful followers, yet none of them seem to be aware that he has deserted them. He uses his usual ploy (he has been doing this for at least five years or longer) of promising them a free vial of his elixir. He has promised this again and again and has never delivered. But it always seems to work.

Illen

III
12-26-2011, 02:57 AM
Hi Illen

The “smacking” was used as a metaphor. I know nobody got actually smacked but then nobody was
an actual victim either; were they? Anyone can switch off or just ignore something they don’t like
on the net, but we get dragged into believing it really matters.

If you re-read this thread the replies to Sign00 started off very calm and mature but gradually they
deteriorated until they became almost the same. S/he managed to bring some people down to
his/her level. If s/he were not banned I’m sure the quality of the conversation may have depreciated
even further.



I have no idea what intension, if any, Sign00 had when starting this thread, but if s/he saw it as a
game, who do you think won?

This may be a case of inherent competitiveness versus altruism. Can there be such a thing as true
altruism? I search for it every day in myself only to find some ulterior motive for my actions. Am I
controlled by my competitiveness in replying to these posts; trying to find the solution before
everyone else. Is this competitiveness what drives the Alchemist? Is it all a game?

Have I said too much ;)

How smug did Agnes Gonxha Bojaxhiu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother_Teresa) feel... Writing that I felt, "Shame on me", but is there any
question that shouldn't be asked?

To pose this another way, how would we feel if the answers we seek were posted and proved; right
here, right now, today? Did anyone actually want, “The Book of Aquarius”, to give us all the
answers? Would that be the end of the game?

http://cdn.pimpmyspace.org/media/pms/c/iu/ge/xd/ysurrender.gif I Concede to you III



http://www.barefoot.im/images/art/tmb/cheers_smiley_1796_102.jpg Here’s to the continued search.

Ghislain

Hi Ghislain
I have no idea what intension, if any, Sign00 had when starting this thread, but if s/he saw it as a
game, who do you think won?

Sign00 did not win this one. However, "There is a sucker born every minute". It's a percentage game for him. He only needs to win 1% or less to make money. The more various members find about this guy the more crooked he looks. For him to "win" everybody would have to ignore knowing how to use google to find his history or be afraid to post opinions because of fear of the Wraths of Con.

How smug did Agnes Gonxha Bojaxhiu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother_Teresa) feel... Writing that I felt, "Shame on me", but is there any
question that shouldn't be asked?


All questions need to be asked. Hiding that she promoted pain and sufferring so that the person may experience the sufferring of Christ as they died deprived of medical care and sufferring horribly to "aid" their soul I find disturbing. That opioin was expesssed in medical textbooks in the USA up until the mid 50s when the last holdouts abandoned it in favor of opioids for pain relief. I don't agree with her basic premise and am disturbed by how she applied it. She was more like a torturer than an angle of mercy in many ways.

This may be a case of inherent competitiveness versus altruism. Can there be such a thing as true
altruism? I search for it every day in myself only to find some ulterior motive for my actions. Am I
controlled by my competitiveness in replying to these posts; trying to find the solution before
everyone else. Is this competitiveness what drives the Alchemist? Is it all a game?

There are "games" and there are zero sum "games". Zero sum games can be played for a single winner takes all. As stated by HIGHLANDER "There can be only one". However, enlightenment doesn't mean that only one can be enlightened. What is actually being competed for? If the competition here is to come up with the answer first what is the prize, 1 "airpoint"? That is not much of a payoff. What is "won" by being the most knowlegable alchemist in the world? One of the prizes in my opinion is knowing/feeling the sorrows of the world. That doesn't qualify as an ego desireable prize in most of the world. DeRopp, in the MASTER GAME and followed by CHURCH OF THE EARTH, puts 3 levels on it; the 4th room of knowing the whole truth about ones self, 5th room knowing the whole truth about everything and the 6th room, "man of sorrows".

Obviously that isn't the game Sign00 is playing. Instead he is playing the old H. Spencer Lewis game, send me a low monthly fee forever. However he doesn't hold up the other end of it with sendong out an endless stream of lessons "everybody knows".


This may be a case of inherent competitiveness versus altruism



I'm in it for "The good of all sentitent beings everywhere". What are the stakes you are playing for? That clearly is not what Sign00 is in it for.

To pose this another way, how would we feel if the answers we seek were posted and proved; right
here, right now, today? Did anyone actually want, “The Book of Aquarius”, to give us all the
answers? Would that be the end of the game?


The worth of the game is in the playing. Even if "the answer" is revealed it doesn't get you anything. You may hear the most elegant theory of how to hit a fastball but that doesn't produce the ability to do so whereas hunbreds of hours of practice might. So, in solving the problem of how to re-synthecize ones self as an enlightened being we each have a custom unique problem to solve as no two persons are identical. As far as I know, there is no general solution. There are methods to find the unique solutions. If indeed he manages to become "most enlightened" and ads one more step to the process, then he only holds that position until somebody supersets him. That and $3.50 will get him a coffee at a coffee shop. He expects great power and wealth according his statements along with the general destruction of society which doesn't matter because of "immortal" life so he can't get hurt. Some "win". The eternal game is "keep it going" but that doesn't appear to be his game. The experience of the journey itself is the reward.

researcher
12-26-2011, 01:39 PM
He demands a monthly fee from them of $5

Whats even worse, it was bumped up to 5.25 quite some time ago. He never made any mention of it except one instance in the front page of his forum among all the paragraphs. He then reinterates the $5. I don't even think any of his members know about it.

I was a member of his groups for a while but decided to leave after one long and discusting post he made. Things weren't adding up for a long time but this was the last straw. I had no idea he's been promising the elixer for five years though.

Illen A. Cluf
12-26-2011, 04:23 PM
Whats even worse, it was bumped up to 5.25 quite some time ago. He never made any mention of it except one instance in the front page of his forum among all the paragraphs. He then reinterates the $5. I don't even think any of his members know about it.

I was a member of his groups for a while but decided to leave after one long and discusting post he made. Things weren't adding up for a long time but this was the last straw. I had no idea he's been promising the elixer for five years though.

You're right! He did up it to $5.25 a month. If this was just a token contribution as he states, then why such a specific amount? I think I know the answer. He has 33 members, so at $5.00 a month, he would net $1,980. He wanted to net two thousand dollars, so by changing it to $5.25, that would give him $2,079, which is above $2,000 rather than below.

I thought it was strange also, that several members wished him a 30th Happy Birthday (February 28, 2011) but he never even bothered to thank these well-wishers.

Yes, about the Elixir, he mentioned that on his forum on November 11 as a lure in order to get everyone to pay their dues. I remember him offering the same lure to members of an earlier forum, several times, many years ago. It might not have been quite five years ago. Maybe about three years ago.

researcher
12-26-2011, 05:14 PM
I think I remember speaking to a former member of his now disbanded IAO who said he was talking about it back in 2007 so yes it has been almost 5 years. I know for sure he's been saying it almost as long as his current forum as been up.

I had given him the benifit of the doubt until he started talking about money so much and kept removing members who questioned the fees or his methods and simply ignored their questions.

It seems to me he has at best made some partally successful tictures. He most likely is just using this to fund his own research and hoping one of his members succeeds so he can duplicate it.

Illen A. Cluf
12-26-2011, 05:56 PM
I think I remember speaking to a former member of his now disbanded IAO who said he was talking about it back in 2007 so yes it has been almost 5 years. I know for sure he's been saying it almost as long as his current forum as been up.


It was actually during the middle of September, 2006 when he first promised to send out 50 samples to his forum members. So it actually has been just over five years that he has held out this elusive lure. It's amazing that the current members stilll believe that they will receive it.

> He most likely is just using this to fund his own research and hoping one of his members succeeds so he can duplicate it.

Most of his more important recipes that he writes about in his book (Moses, etc) actually initially came directly from his members (I believe it was from the RAMS publications).

researcher
12-27-2011, 02:11 PM
He also had this lottery a year ago where he picks a name of someone who donated and sends them the stone. This lottery was later canceled.

solomon levi
12-28-2011, 01:57 AM
Ha! I was gone for a week and these guys slip in.
I'm glad Dev caught it. He has done the same thing in other forums.
I recognised it from the first post, but I'm just reading it today.

He seems delusional - arguing with people that weren't even arguing,
attacking the first people to reply at all... weird selling strategy.
But he just can't help himself.

III
12-28-2011, 06:39 AM
Ha! I was gone for a week and these guys slip in.
I'm glad Dev caught it. He has done the same thing in other forums.
I recognised it from the first post, but I'm just reading it today.

He seems delusional - arguing with people that weren't even arguing,
attacking the first people to reply at all... weird selling strategy.
But he just can't help himself.


Hi Solomon,

While the cat's away ...

Delusional is a mild way to describe it. I don't think he had nearly as much fun as we did tweeking his ego. Then we got to watch a different show, The Wraths of Con.

Awani
12-30-2011, 04:43 PM
I got this E-mail. As the person asked me to make what is written clear in this thread (and since he has been anonymous) I see no problem posting the whole thing.


Hello,

I'd like to quickly clear up a little bit of concern regarding this topic:
http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2557-Alchemy-and-The-Philosopher-s-Stone-is-Real

The user sign00 who claimed to be the author of The Book of Aquarius was lying, and this was part of a smear campaign against me, the actual author.

I'm sorry that this happened on your forum, unfortunately there's nothing I can do about it except warn people not to trust anyone claiming to be the author. The same thing has happened on multiple forums across the Net in a short space of time, all done by the same person.

You can see the relevant discussion on my own forum here:
http://www.thebookofaquarius.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1470

Anyway, it is quite upsetting that many of the members here did in fact believe he was me, especially since they were so polite to him.

I just wanted to clear this up, and ask that you would make it clear in the topic that sign00 is an imposter.

Kind regards,
Anonymous

The plot thickens with this quote found in the link above:


UPDATE
After a little investigation, it seems to be going on everywhere, with topics started on forums all over the Net. I believe the culprit is a man named Frank Camper, who lives in Alabama. Strangely people believe he is the author, despite the fact he is posting random comments sprinkled with swearing and general insanity.

The alchemy forums thread is particularly disturbing:
http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthre ... ne-is-Real

UPDATE 2
I can now confirm after further investigation that the culprit was indeed Mr. Camper, his reasoning appears to be that he believed I was the infamous Nick ********, against whom he has a vendetta, possibly he or someone he knows lost money to Nick.

Who are these people with no lives?

Three things are obvious concerning these people and others like them (all calling themselves Alchemists):

- inflated EGO
- monetary greed/agenda of some sort
- fascist thinking (my facts or the highway)

Clearly to anyone the above list should be enough to verify the fact that these people are no more real alchemists than Harry Potter.

:cool:

Illen A. Cluf
12-30-2011, 05:36 PM
Thanks, Dev.

That explains a lot of things that just were not adding up.

It makes sense that this disturbed Frank Camper person is not the author. Also, I do not believe that the author is *** because the writing style is quite different.

As I initially said, Based on what was written in the book, I believe that the author of the Aquarius book is very sincere about his approach. However, I still think that it is unpardonable that he would go as far as he did without first having completed his experiment. It will also be very embarrassing for him if nothing comes from that experiment.

Illen

True Initiate
12-30-2011, 05:42 PM
Well that's why he goes by the cover name Anonymous.

Awani
12-30-2011, 07:07 PM
I mean it is easy to invent a name... so I don't see why one has to put extra weight on being "anonymous". I don't think it says True Puffer in your passport, right? LOL!


Thanks, Dev.

You're welcome;)

:cool:

solomon levi
12-30-2011, 08:22 PM
Dopplegangers everywhere!
I don't know who's who anymore.
:D

solomon levi
12-30-2011, 08:22 PM
Dopplegangers everywhere!
I don't know who's who anymore.
:D

solomon levi
12-30-2011, 08:26 PM
LOL!
Now there's an echo!
I'd delete the double post but it's so enlightening.
That's what I get for writing about parallel universes.

Andro
12-30-2011, 08:33 PM
Dopplegangers everywhere!

Double posts as well :D


I don't know who's who anymore.

I suspect that 'wh' questions will soon become obsolete :)

Doctor WHO ? ? ?

Andro
12-30-2011, 08:35 PM
I'd delete the double post but it's so enlightening.

Don't delete the double post ! ! !

It's an integral part of the thread ! ! !

solomon levi
12-30-2011, 08:37 PM
What then is it?

Or, in the King's english: WTF!

thoth
12-31-2011, 07:03 PM
I suspected sign00 was not the author of that book, as the styles were completely different. I have been looking at the Author's forum and he never once got angry or abusive, just asked people to back up their theories with quotes from the old writers.

There was no logic to sign00 taking offensive when people were friendly to him, unless he actually wanted to peeve people off and discredit the author. (I did at one stage think sign00 could have been N*** *****)

Its a bit like the movie where the guy has the latex mask pulled off him only to find out its somebody else altogether ..... ah the intrigue .....:)

Ghislain
12-31-2011, 11:48 PM
Clearly to anyone the above list should be enough to verify the fact that these people are no more real alchemists than Harry Potter.
:cool:

Dev The above list is enough to verify the fact that these people are people.

There is a saying in the north of England thats says, "There is nowt stranger than folk"

and "Harry Potter is not a real Alchemist" ... Are you pulling my leg? :) Next you'll say there is no Santa!

Ghislain

III
01-01-2012, 10:03 PM
Dev The above list is enough to verify the fact that these people are people.

There is a saying in the north of England thats says, "There is nowt stranger than folk"

and "Harry Potter is not a real Alchemist" ... Are you pulling my leg? :) Next you'll say there is no Santa!

Ghislain

Hi Ghilain,
My daughter had hair down to her waist and a potting wheel. She was certainly a Hairy Potter.

rogerc
01-02-2012, 04:45 AM
Hi Ghilain,
My daughter had hair down to her waist and a potting wheel. She was certainly a Hairy Potter.

Willie Nelson was the original hairy pot-er

driftrat
01-02-2012, 05:02 PM
I suspected sign00 was not the author of that book, as the styles were completely different. I have been looking at the Author's forum and he never once got angry or abusive, just asked people to back up their theories with quotes from the old writers.

There was no logic to sign00 taking offensive when people were friendly to him, unless he actually wanted to peeve people off and discredit the author. (I did at one stage think sign00 could have been N*** *****)

Its a bit like the movie where the guy has the latex mask pulled off him only to find out its somebody else altogether ..... ah the intrigue .....:)

Thoth..The author of the 'Book of Aquarius' is Jay Weidner...a modern internet character apparently trying to build a cult following. I as well as some reasonably lucid viewers strongly disclaim his less than adequate sci-approach and simplistic interpretations apparently derived from some sorta secrete research.... just send the checks to the "Master" and get a genuine alchemy degree.

Illen A. Cluf
01-02-2012, 05:11 PM
Thoth..The identy of the unknown author of the Book of Aquarius is Jay Weidner...a modern internet character apparently trying to build a cult following. I as well as some reasonably lucid viewers disclaime his less than adequate sci-approach and simplistic interpretations apparently derived from some sorta secrete research.... just send the checks to the "Master" and get a genuine alchemy degree.

I remember coming across some of his nonsense in the past. How did you identify the author as Jay Weidner?

driftrat
01-02-2012, 07:40 PM
Illen...he was on Coast to Coast late night AM 1440 Medford, Oregon abokut 3 mts ago (google with key 'Aquarius') and unknowingly gave it away...

driftrat
01-02-2012, 07:41 PM
Intuition is great sign00, however understanding the true character of such gifted knowledge requires at least a "modicum" of genuine thought. If your going to focus of personalities there are better suited BS forums out there . It also helps to lose that thin skin when communicating with us 'Imbeciles of the Lesser' kiddo as it'll be less painfull when you crash into the brick wall.

Andro
01-02-2012, 07:45 PM
Why do I get the feeling we are in the middle of a crossfire between at least two individuals with (inter?) personal vendetta issues?

Oh, Alchemy and politics........... It can get independently 'dirty' in each of the two, but together - it can be a real mess :)

Illen A. Cluf
01-02-2012, 07:46 PM
he was on Coast to Coast late night AM 1440 Medford, Oregon abokut 3 mts ago (google with key 'Aquarius') and unknowingly gave it away...

I thought that he was just giving his views on the book? Although it did seem suspicious that he "totally agreed" with the book. Also, suspiciously, he has also written about "Aquarius" and the 2012 doomsday nonsense.

driftrat
01-02-2012, 07:52 PM
Why do I get the feeling we are in the middle of a crossfire between at least two individuals with (inter?) personal vendetta issues?

Oh, Alchemy and politics........... It can get independently 'dirty' in each of the two, but together - it can be a real mess :)

such the nature of the beast my friend...and ours to muddle through the roadblocks.

thoth
01-02-2012, 11:01 PM
Driftrat, I dont know who the author is but everybody on this forum is still searching, at one level or another, so it seems reasonable to at least consider what the author is presenting. His quotes of the old writers do seem to back up his theory (I know we can all selectively present quotes to support our arguments). It may very well be a dead end but so far this author has not sold anything - maybe its a long term plan, but as of the present, no checks have goine to the master.....also the author does not refer to what you call "secret research: ..........

Andro
01-02-2012, 11:14 PM
I think we should all beware of becoming walking/talking/posting tabloids.

I know it's the 'Operation Of The Sun' we're dealing with, but 'The Sun (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sun_%28United_Kingdom%29)' needs not be taken literally in every context :)

There seems to be a recent (although minor) trend of 'exposing' 'frauds'/'errors' and giving the 'truth' instead...

NOBODY holds a monopole over absolute 'Truth', assuming such a thing even exits...
--------------------------------------------------------------

driftrat
01-03-2012, 04:20 AM
thoth...again the author is Weidner or his "alter-ego spun as a different person or he's in colusion as it is unlikely he did the research. He is a lier and not so clever opportuntist. I stand firm on my analysis which is easy enough to check on the internet. If you have fallen for his BS please don't sell all your stuff is still good advise.
Like yourself and most I've read on this forem - we are all still searching...

driftrat
01-03-2012, 04:28 AM
I think we should all beware of becoming walking/talking/posting tabloids.

I know it's the 'Operation Of The Sun' we're dealing with, but 'The Sun (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sun_%28United_Kingdom%29)' needs not be taken literally in every context :)

There seems to be a recent (although minor) trend of 'exposing' 'frauds'/'errors' and giving the 'truth' instead...

NOBODY holds a monopole over absolute 'Truth', assuming such a thing even exits...
--------------------------------------------------------------

in my circle we refer to exposing frauds and phonys as 'peer review'...I like to feel that God allows a little hitch-hikeing to stimulate the conversation.

solomon levi
01-03-2012, 05:55 AM
It's good to point these things out.
It's just we don't like to dwell on personalities here at Alchemy Forums.
While there may be an audience for it, it takes away from the practical
things we could be discussing. If it becomes a distraction, the thread or
topic will be closed. That's just the rule or focus of the forum.

driftrat
01-03-2012, 08:26 PM
in due respect solomon...in the world of esoteric science exposure of frauds is primary to the value and credibility of the study. I nor any of my company find the practice as anything other than playful and again stimulating to the nature of our quest. I certainly defer to the guidlines of which you refer however I believe it only adversely narrows the study and certainly roadblocks true adepts as years can be spent to these causes. This is my last input on this subject.

solomon levi
01-03-2012, 10:25 PM
We do appreciate the knowledge Driftrat.
We just don't want it to become a political campaign against Weidner.
I'd rather discuss the path he proposes and why it is or isn't possible.
Urine provides a good nitrous salt that is suitable for the work if prepared correctly.
Whether we like Weidner as a person or not, urine is on the table and was
before he wrote his book.

driftrat
01-04-2012, 03:08 AM
solomon "Urine provides a good 'nitrous salt' that is suitable for the work if prepared correctly"
this is the area where I find ambiguity. - any suggestions or thread direction? ..I understand the Salt can represents the action of conscious on matter (quantum) however the term 'nitrous' appears vauge and arbitrary. Some articles say distill urine 3 times for a basic exlire - which seems a llittle simplistic without knowing the temp? I'm new at this but not for naught I hope.

solomon levi
01-04-2012, 05:06 AM
Hi Driftrat.
Well it may not make any sense if you are new or haven't done a lot of reading,
but there is a lot of pointing in alchemy to nitre, also known as salt peter.
It is the salt of dew, of thunderstorms - aerial nitre. It is also found in urine
and feces, "salt of the stables", on walls of caves, etc.

I really haven't read the book of Aquarius so I don't know his details,
but distilling urine as you say can give us a few salts and solvents which act on minerals.
In urine is the saltpeter, a sea salt and sal ammoniac among others. The liquid portion
after distillation becomes aqueous ammonium hydroxide and a phlegm.
I suppose if you need a temp you should search at what temp liquid ammonia evaporates
and approach it gradually.

driftrat
01-04-2012, 06:16 AM
sorry solomon I don't understand anything you posted other than a response equal to pouring some empty into the void. You present yourself as an informed indivual. Well I am likewise well educated, experienced in life and currently a serious student of the art. Please show that mutual respect or pass. I do read a lot and am well studied to the various chemicals in urine. My query is directled specifically about the exlire. Perhaps if you could guide me to a more relevant thread there might be some progress at least in my searchings.
FYI The book of Aquarius is esentially a collection of historical alchemic text's of which I assumed you would be well familar with...
Have you tried utilizing ammonium carbonate from the factory (they distill the urine in cast iron vessels).?
Can some form of "life force" be inhaled from the foam of body temp urine (intuitivly strong premise and simple enough to test) ?

I have to add that the Yang terrain of fece's (shit) would indicate this stuff would be a poor source of any said life force element that we would want to encourage. The mention of fece's in that context, simply reflects any residual product left over from the distillation or fire extraction process..

solomon levi
01-04-2012, 06:53 AM
I have been completely respectful.
If you don't understand anything i said, why bother judging what
you don't understand?
I'm not presenting myself as anything.
I'm sharing information. If you make that personal, as you seem to do -
you seem attracted to personalities instead of knowledge, and now you've
invented/projected a personality for me.

I am not especially well-educated - didn't go to college. I've just read alot
and done some work and had the help of this community and my spirit.

By exlire do you mean elixir?

I know what the Book of Aquarius is. I'm already fairly familiar with sources,
though there is still much I haven't read.

You assume a lot and expect me to assume alot about you.
I don't know you or what you know, except that you are hung up
on personalities, your own and others, and so since I don't
practice making assumptions about people, I don't know how to answer
your questions about "exlire". And with your attitude, I'm not feeling
like wasting my time on you anymore.
Your assuming that I have not shown respect tells me that you have a big ego
that needs to be fed. I'm not in that business so look elsewhere.

If you continue with this personality crap, you won't be here long.

Now, if you'd like to start over, please tell me what alchemy you practice
and what exlire means to you, and I'll do my best to guide you to an appropriate
post if I cannot help you myself.

driftrat
01-04-2012, 05:32 PM
As I am well educated in both real life, road time and academia you might be a little more reseptive to my questions and research techniques -ie; using one term (word) to describe another is called pouring the empty into the void. Also it dosen't make any progress to our common search when one of us comes off as an authority- you sound a little heavy - remember we both lack the answers. ...apparently you haven't read my post.
A suggestion...do your thing just leave me out of it
go to 'light is not the fastest' in 'forum' and actually try to understand it or back off to your field...which by your above post is about personalities and not substance.

III
01-04-2012, 09:09 PM
sorry solomon I don't understand anything you posted other than a response equal to pouring some empty into the void. You present yourself as an informed indivual. Well I am likewise well educated, experienced in life and currently a serious student of the art. Please show that mutual respect or pass. I do read a lot and am well studied to the various chemicals in urine. My query is directled specifically about the exlire. Perhaps if you could guide me to a more relevant thread there might be some progress at least in my searchings.

FYI The book of Aquarius is esentially a collection of historical alchemic text's of which I assumed you would be well familar with...
Have you tried utilizing ammonium carbonate from the factory (they distill the urine in cast iron vessels).?
Can some form of "life force" be inhaled from the foam of body temp urine (intuitivly strong premise and simple enough to test) ?

I have to add that the Yang terrain of fece's (shit) would indicate this stuff would be a poor source of any said life force element that we would want to encourage. The mention of fece's in that context, simply reflects any residual product left over from the distillation or fire extraction process..

Hi Driftrat,

As far as I know I'm the only serious practitioner of Tantric Alchemy around here. I have never done any of the "glassware" alchemy presented here and have no idea if any of it actually works, though I have worked rather extensively with the various shamanic plant substances. I have practiced the Tantric Alchemy since puberty, and have succeeded in every aspect of it and am fully satisfied with what I have done and know. I know that it can be taught and learned, that the things talked about generally work but the REASONS given are often quite bogus. I'm here trying to learn to communicate with other alchemical practitioners of whatever kind. I may be the only person here that that isn't looking for answers to any alchemical problems. I have no idea if some of these glassware alchemical procdures work in any alchemical way or not. I did read all of the "book" in question and found nothing more than a few hands full of pasted quotes, certainly nothing that makes any original contribution.


However, the difference between the various genuine folks here, like Solomon and others, and our recent very obviously fraudulent visitor is outstandingly obvious. All I know about urine is how useful it is in medical analysis and all the different things it can tell you about health, b12 and metabolites.

Rueb
01-04-2012, 10:32 PM
Urine is a wonderful materia because it involves the alchemist in the most simple of ways and shows you how important you are. To be quite honest it is rather simple to get to a tinging powder rather quick although very weak.
Still it is this proof which so many are searching for to get going.
But you will also conclude that this is just scratching the uppermost surface.

it goes way deeper ...

Your faith was strong but you needed proof
You saw her bathing on the roof
Her beauty and the moonlight overthrew you
She tied you To a kitchen chair
She broke your throne, and she cut your hair
And from your lips she drew the Hallelujah

driftrat
01-04-2012, 10:55 PM
Hi Driftrat,

As far as I know I'm the only serious practitioner of Tantric Alchemy around here. I have never done any of the "glassware" alchemy presented here and have no idea if any of it actually works, though I have worked rather extensively with the various shamanic plant substances. I have practiced the Tantric Alchemy since puberty, and have succeeded in every aspect of it and am fully satisfied with what I have done and know. I know that it can be taught and learned, that the things talked about generally work but the REASONS given are often quite bogus. I'm here trying to learn to communicate with other alchemical practitioners of whatever kind. I may be the only person here that that isn't looking for answers to any alchemical problems. I have no idea if some of these glassware alchemical procdures work in any alchemical way or not. I did read all of the "book" in question and found nothing more than a few hands full of pasted quotes, certainly nothing that makes any original contribution.


However, the difference between the various genuine folks here, like Solomon and others, and our recent very obviously fraudulent visitor is outstandingly obvious. All I know about urine is how useful it is in medical analysis and all the different things it can tell you about health, b12 and metabolites.

thank you lll...thought I landed on shallow waters fishing for deep thilnkers ...I don't wish to quantify Solomon other than to point out he could not have read my post's beyound the first 3 words...then llike a thug who needs a hug he warns me to watch out or I'm history...now if your reference to me is as the "ovious fraudulent vistor" then perhaps your Tantric studies have become somewhat narrow...My background includes serious Tibetian studies and we might benefit from some real communication.

driftrat
01-04-2012, 11:31 PM
Urine is a wonderful materia because it involves the alchemist in the most simple of ways and shows you how important you are. To be quite honest it is rather simple to get to a tinging powder rather quick although very weak.
Still it is this proof which so many are searching for to get going.
But you will also conclude that this is just scratching the uppermost surface.

it goes way deeper ...

Your faith was strong but you needed proof
You saw her bathing on the roof
Her beauty and the moonlight overthrew you
She tied you To a kitchen chair
She broke your throne, and she cut your hair
And from your lips she drew the Hallelujah

well rip me up
slap me down
...set off the school alarm
...show me... what you got...

lifetime seeker
01-04-2012, 11:58 PM
Man o' Man...

What is it about Alchemy which brings out the Ass in people?

Is it because the Internet provides a mysterious Vale of expert Opinion?

Or... is it simply the playground of Bullies.

Grow-up

Ghislain
01-05-2012, 12:03 AM
DR

The reference to, "our recent very obviously fraudulent visitor", I think you'll find is directed at the originator
of this thread.

I think what everyone should realise within this forum is that if we are here at all it is because we don't have
all the answers; I know I don't.

It is not a pissing contest it is just a place to exchange views and information which one can choose to take
or leave...the beauty here is that most can do just that...take it or leave it.

As most of us do not know each other personally we are not privy to the experience each of us hold, as
such I hold every person here in high regard...if we have made it this far we must be doing something right.

This is not personally directed at anyone, its just my view, which I pose as this whole thread appears to
be descending into who has the biggest penis...when everyone knows I have.

http://chickenshop.co.uk/images/T/xctmpZrtrCY.png

Ghislain

alchemicalturtoise
01-05-2012, 12:13 AM
Ehem... i actually read all 12 pages of the thread... Without any knowledge of Alchemy, just by the writing style of the opening post - isn't it strikingly sensationalist, sort of re-told in www language story of mysteriously appearing texts - like the 'Five Tibetan Rites' etc.? Somehow sounded too Dan Brown-ish to me to be taken seriously in the first place...
Also, i am not sure someone can be at the same time delusional/psychotic and so opportunist to calculate how much they need exactly to increase the annual fee of the 33 followers so to surpass the summ of 2000 usd... hm.
Also, i do doubt that someone who has studied indepth ancient texts - or even scanned them briefly, but carefully enough to copy-paste needed parts - would loose their cool so easily and start abuse verbally members here... Trolling comes to mind, to me , as to a bystander, it seems that someone just made a sick joke of their participation at the forum...

driftrat
01-05-2012, 12:34 AM
thank you lll...thought I landed on shallow waters fishing for deep thilnkers ...I don't wish to quantify Solomon other than to point out he could not have read my post's beyound the first 3 words...then llike a thug who needs a hug he warns me to watch out or I'm history...now if your reference to me is as the "ovious fraudulent vistor" then perhaps your Tantric studies have become somewhat narrow...My background includes serious Tibetian studies and we might benefit from some real communication.
thanks for clearing that up - evidently I'm more paranoid than I reallize. I was with a girl in Berkeley in the early 70's we called Ingin who drank some of her urine every morning. She was very open and talked about her beliefs quite freely. She was more a Pantheist however did calime feel and see color fields from plants and seemed to be at peace with most stuff.

driftrat
01-05-2012, 02:15 AM
DR

The reference to, "our recent very obviously fraudulent visitor", I think you'll find is directed at the originator
of this thread.

I think what everyone should realise within this forum is that if we are here at all it is because we don't have
all the answers; I know I don't.

It is not a pissing contest it is just a place to exchange views and information which one can choose to take
or leave...the beauty here is that most can do just that...take it or leave it.

As most of us do not know each other personally we are not privy to the experience each of us hold, as
such I hold every person here in high regard...if we have made it this far we must be doing something right.

This is not personally directed at anyone, its just my view, which I pose as this whole thread appears to
be descending into who has the biggest penis...when everyone knows I have.

http://chickenshop.co.uk/images/T/xctmpZrtrCY.png

Ghislain
thanks Mr G...it never was a pissing contest with me...it was really about piss :).

III
01-05-2012, 05:07 AM
Ehem... i actually read all 12 pages of the thread... Without any knowledge of Alchemy, just by the writing style of the opening post - isn't it strikingly sensationalist, sort of re-told in www language story of mysteriously appearing texts - like the 'Five Tibetan Rites' etc.? Somehow sounded too Dan Brown-ish to me to be taken seriously in the first place...

Also, i am not sure someone can be at the same time delusional/psychotic and so opportunist to calculate how much they need exactly to increase the annual fee of the 33 followers so to surpass the summ of 2000 usd... hm.
Also, i do doubt that someone who has studied indepth ancient texts - or even scanned them briefly, but carefully enough to copy-paste needed parts - would loose their cool so easily and start abuse verbally members here... Trolling comes to mind, to me , as to a bystander, it seems that someone just made a sick joke of their participation at the forum...

Hi Alchemicalturtoise

just by the writing style of the opening post - isn't it strikingly sensationalist, sort of re-told in www language story of mysteriously appearing texts - like the 'Five Tibetan Rites' etc.? Somehow sounded too Dan Brown-ish to me to be taken seriously in the first place...

BINGO. This post set off my BS detectors right off. 00 wasn't believable from the start, too small a caliber. There wasn't anything this person wrote that came off as honest except his pissed (had to get urine in here somewhere) off attitude. That seemed authentic. One of the things I do is read a lot of peer reviewed medical research journals and pick out the BS. I also look for docs committing fraud, in their data and medical records. I also have observed crooked IMEs make fake reports on exams I have witnessed. I've learned to be a very careful reader. I'm a very skeptical reader.

Today I have confirmed my perfection of a rare, or maybe medium rare, alchemical techique of transforming a raw chunk of meat into a perfectly cooked chateaubriand for the second time in a row; and that is pure bull or at least steer, but no shit or piss. Positively glorious.

alchemicalturtoise
01-06-2012, 05:43 AM
BINGO. This post set off my BS detectors right off. 00 wasn't believable from the start, too small a caliber. There wasn't anything this person wrote that came off as honest except his pissed (had to get urine in here somewhere) off attitude. That seemed authentic. One of the things I do is read a lot of peer reviewed medical research journals and pick out the BS. I also look for docs committing fraud, in their data and medical records. I also have observed crooked IMEs make fake reports on exams I have witnessed. I've learned to be a very careful reader. I'm a very skeptical reader.
Me too, and albeit English is not my first language (and not even second) so i am trying not to jump into conclusions ; but i am pro a writer and have worked for years as an interpreter for the government so i also have heightened sensitivity to wording. ( Here its that i really know nothing on the subject, so my only bet was to judge whether the OP sounds credible - vs evaluating the 'factual' material they present.)


Today I have confirmed my perfection of a rare, or maybe medium rare, alchemical techique of transforming a raw chunk of meat into a perfectly cooked chateaubriand for the second time in a row; and that is pure bull or at least steer, but no shit or piss. Positively glorious.
Congrats! That's a real art! (And this is from experience. ;) )

solomon levi
01-08-2012, 09:59 PM
As I am well educated in both real life, road time and academia you might be a little more reseptive to my questions and research techniques -ie; using one term (word) to describe another is called pouring the empty into the void. Also it dosen't make any progress to our common search when one of us comes off as an authority- you sound a little heavy - remember we both lack the answers. ...apparently you haven't read my post.
A suggestion...do your thing just leave me out of it
go to 'light is not the fastest' in 'forum' and actually try to understand it or back off to your field...which by your above post is about personalities and not substance.

Somehow your education has failed to enlighten you that you, me
and Jay Weidner are One. Your imagined separateness is not practical,
only psychological. If it makes you feel better about yourself, believe it.
What it has to do with alchemy, I do not know.

solomon levi
01-08-2012, 10:00 PM
thank you lll...thought I landed on shallow waters fishing for deep thilnkers ...I don't wish to quantify Solomon other than to point out he could not have read my post's beyound the first 3 words...then llike a thug who needs a hug he warns me to watch out or I'm history...now if your reference to me is as the "ovious fraudulent vistor" then perhaps your Tantric studies have become somewhat narrow...My background includes serious Tibetian studies and we might benefit from some real communication.

This is not me being a thug. This is me informing you of the rules
of this forum which I did not create. I am simply a moderator, wearing
a hat.

Andro
01-08-2012, 10:12 PM
'Pouring the Empty into the Void'

Ironically (or not), this is a Major Key for the more occult operations of Our Art.

Note that the two terms ('empty' and 'void') are NOT interchangeable.

driftrat
01-09-2012, 01:47 AM
Your abstractions of my character and experience are way off...
The phrase 'pouring the empty into the void' was first coined by Gurdjieff in his Western schools and was used to point out the uselesness of explaining words with words... what do you mean by the terms?
My experiments in distillations and the study of what is termed 'life force' have brought me to this site which I'm beginning to wonder - is there any substance here or is this just another PC social club?

driftrat
01-09-2012, 02:03 AM
This is not me being a thug. This is me informing you of the rules
of this forum which I did not create. I am simply a moderator, wearing
a hat.
well pull the hat up sir...apparently its so large it fell down over your eyes...:)

Hellin Hermetist
01-09-2012, 02:09 AM
Hi driftrat,

Will you share any more infos about your experiments with the so called "life force"?

driftrat
01-09-2012, 02:31 AM
Somehow your education has failed to enlighten you that you, me
and Jay Weidner are One. Your imagined separateness is not practical,
only psychological. If it makes you feel better about yourself, believe it.
What it has to do with alchemy, I do not know.

by this logic even without education one can extrapolate that we are also Jesus, John Wayne ,Hitler etc; ...so your point is ?

driftrat
01-09-2012, 02:35 AM
that is why I'm in this site Hellin...are you familiar with what's called 'bakers amonium? I am more hermetic in the art...are you?

Hellin Hermetist
01-09-2012, 02:48 AM
You mean sodium bicarbonate or sth like that? Baking powder maybe?

Ghislain
01-09-2012, 08:41 AM
Bakers Ammonium - Ammonium Carbonate - Sal Volatile - Salt of Hartshorn

Formerly was crushed and used as smelling salts.

It was a predecessor to baking soda and baking powder.

Source: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonium_carbonate)

Ghislain

Ghislain
01-09-2012, 08:58 AM
As this thread has really gone off subject and there are other threads on the subject of "The Book of
Aquarius" would it be better to close this thread as it seems to affect people? IMHO

The Book of Aquarius (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2058-The-Book-of-Aquarius&highlight=book+aquarius)

Book of Aquarius - Debate with Author ?? (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2589-Book-of-Aquarius-Debate-with-Author&highlight=book+aquarius)

And mentioned in this thread:

Most clear and modern books (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?2515-Most-clear-and-modern-books/page4&highlight=book+aquarius)

Ghislain

Andro
01-09-2012, 10:53 AM
As this thread has really gone off subject [...] would it be better to close this thread as it seems to affect people?

Yeah, this thread seems to act as a magnet for Eris (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eris_%28mythology%29) (Discord), so I'm inclined to agree.

solomon levi
01-09-2012, 07:34 PM
by this logic even without education one can extrapolate that we are also Jesus, John Wayne ,Hitler etc; ...so your point is ?

My point is, the subjectivity of all this is rediculous.
We could make anyone an enemy, an "other", a "not me",
and it would all be a lie, a subjective belief, a thinking in the mind.
My other point is, personalities are not who we are. There's nothing
good or bad about them. There's no thing that is not the One entire.
Why argue about the machine being a machine as if it should be other?
Just because you, me and Jay have a machine doesn't say anything
about who we are, our essence. Why are you focussed on that crap?
Do you honestly believe your education affords you some respect above
any one else? Your education is who you are? You know well you are not
what you have accumulated/acquired. Isn't being on the human journey
admirable enough? What isn't respectable about that? What can you add
that is greater than that?

Anyway, I'm sorry if you were offended by my words. I don't know you from
Adam and I'm not into making assumptions, so there's no reason that I should have known
how educated you are or what type of alchemy you practice or anything, so why take it personally?

Communication is an art. You know well from G that just because we may use the same words doesn't
mean we mean the same thing. So tell me, don't expect me to read your mind. I've read your posts
and I still don't know what "elixir" means to you. I'd love to get to know you and talk about it.
I'm sorry that we got off on the wrong foot. Let's put this behind us and I'm sure we can have
some wonderful intelligent conversation.

Sincerely,
Sol

III
01-09-2012, 07:40 PM
I don't know about closing it. It seems to be functioning very well at getting under some masks and has been most revealing. That can be worth a lot. Before somebody can be worked with they must be unmasked.

solomon levi
01-09-2012, 08:11 PM
Bakers Ammonium - Ammonium Carbonate - Sal Volatile - Salt of Hartshorn

Formerly was crushed and used as smelling salts.

It was a predecessor to baking soda and baking powder.

Source: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonium_carbonate)

Ghislain

Also Van Helmont's "offa alba", created by mixing spirit of urine with spirit of wine,
or simply liquid ammonia with strong alcohol. The ammonium carbonate precipitates
from the mixtuire of the two solutions.

Here is a thread you may find interesting Driftrat, it's a bit long though:

"I did some experiments with the "alkahest" made from urine.
I circulated common alcohol with the volatile ammonia salt.
I took the first several drops and put some gold leaf to it yesterday.
this morning I see the gold leaf has completely dissolved.
there is however no coloration to the liquid, it still remains as clear and white as it was previously.
I wonder if anyone else has had the same results, if not I may know why.
ManO"
http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?1037-researching-gw-stone-and-alkahest/page4

driftrat
01-14-2012, 07:23 PM
I'm thinking (intuition) that the 'morning dew' is similar to H2O which has been fed the neg side of a magnet. This produces the same water terrain as would be captured around a large waterfall .