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View Full Version : What type of condenser is suitable for spagyrics?



JC3
02-24-2012, 08:06 AM
In Practical Handbook of Plant Alchemy it is said you can use "for instance a Liebig condenser", that is horizontal one, but I've seen vertical condensers with coil inside, and they look more convienent (they occupy less space). But are they optimal for spagyrics?

asta
02-24-2012, 02:40 PM
In my oppinion, both are good, but I preffer using Liebig ones, are easier to clean, and the oils go down more easily.

thoth
02-24-2012, 10:17 PM
For spagyrics I understand low temperatures as possible are required to avoid killing the life force. I use a liebig. It is also important to have the T-piece which connects the flask to the condenser such that the vapour does not have to travel up too far before it reaches the cool condensing area, so horizonatal condenser is way better than a vertical one. Also have a flask with as short a neck as you can get so vapours are close to T piece as possible.

If the vapours have to travel too far before meeting the condensing area where they are directed to reciever flask, they condense too early and just fall back into your boiling flask.

If money is not a problem then go and get yourself a heating mantle - so much easier to control temp than using a gas or elctric hob. I have one that can take either a 500ml flask or a 1000ml flask.


I started off with Junius's book too...

Susu
02-25-2012, 06:10 AM
I just got a Liebig condenser myself due to using that type of distillation in chemistry class. Like Asta says they are easy to clean and can get the job done. How will you going about with cycling the water? I used a water jet pump they use in aquariums and have it connected to the hose going in the condenser and have the exit hose draped over a bucket where the pump recycles the water back into the condenser. Saves a lot of water and I don't need to be near a sink. I found mine at a pet store for about $30.

I can use some advice on heat sources though. I have an electric stove that can work but it really eats at my electric bill. Any one know of a cost effective alternative? So far I got home made alcohol/oil lamp.

asta
02-25-2012, 11:38 AM
I can use some advice on heat sources though. I have an electric stove that can work but it really eats at my electric bill. Any one know of a cost effective alternative? So far I got home made alcohol/oil lamp.

Here in Europe we use a very popular heating mantles of the trademark Nahita. I got a 500 ml capacity heating mantle that uses at max 260 W (the half energy a computer use) for rought 60 € in a second hand market. New ones cost around 100 €. I see american mantles are more expensive.

JC3
02-28-2012, 10:16 AM
In my oppinion, both are good, but I preffer using Liebig ones, are easier to clean, and the oils go down more easily.Thanks, you convinced me.

By the way, I found that soxhlet extractor described in Frater Albertus' book can speed up the process of making the spagyrics from around 16 days to one day. Do you think it's good idea to buy it?

MarkostheGnostic
03-01-2012, 05:02 AM
I just got a Liebig condenser myself due to using that type of distillation in chemistry class. Like Asta says they are easy to clean and can get the job done. How will you going about with cycling the water? I used a water jet pump they use in aquariums and have it connected to the hose going in the condenser and have the exit hose draped over a bucket where the pump recycles the water back into the condenser. Saves a lot of water and I don't need to be near a sink. I found mine at a pet store for about $30.

I can use some advice on heat sources though. I have an electric stove that can work but it really eats at my electric bill. Any one know of a cost effective alternative? So far I got home made alcohol/oil lamp.

eBay is the place for heating mantles, cords, and Variacs. I have a hard shell mantle for a a 2000 ml RBF and a soft mantle for a smaller 250 ml RBF, that I expect to learn vacuum distillation with this summer. I sat on eBay and bid with 10 seconds left to win a Gast vacuum pump, recommended by a biochemist at The Shroomery.org.

The small water pump, submersed in an insulated cooler, works for my Liebig tube, as well as for the Allihn on my Soxhlet extractor. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condenser_(laboratory) Coiled Graham condensers look way cool, but are more expensive, probably unnecessary time exposure in the water jacket, and clearly more difficult to clean.

Susu
03-27-2012, 09:27 PM
By the way, I found that soxhlet extractor described in Frater Albertus' book can speed up the process of making the spagyrics from around 16 days to one day. Do you think it's good idea to buy it?

If this case is true, could a Liebig condenser work as a substitute in case someone does not have a soxhlet condenser? I would assume that the receiving distilled end would just be recombined with the original flask. Seems tedious but if it works I'd give it ago. Opinions?

MarkostheGnostic
03-28-2012, 11:07 PM
If this case is true, could a Liebig condenser work as a substitute in case someone does not have a soxhlet condenser? I would assume that the receiving distilled end would just be recombined with the original flask. Seems tedious but if it works I'd give it ago. Opinions?

A Soxhlet extractor comes in 3 sections. The Soxlet extractor is the whole unit, but the extraction chamber is the Soxhlet proper, in combination with a flask and a condenser.. The bottom is a boiling flask, either flat or round bottom, depending upon the heat source. I bought a flat-bottom flask for use with a variable hot plate. Only later did I obtain a soft electric mantle for a round-bottom flask. The actual extracter plugs into the mouth of the flask. It is essentially a chamber that accomodates a tubular (and pricey) filter paper thimble (or a tucked in coffee filter), in which a solid substance is held. There is an exit tube with a loop so that the accumulating solvent builds up until it reaches the exit hole, and at that point, the extraction chamber drains back into the boiling flask (nerds like to cheer when this happens). Sitting on top of the Soxhlet proper, is a condenser with the far end left open (unless one is extracting under vacuum). The condensing process in this case is called refluxing. In a reflux condenser, the vapors from the solvent rise up into the condenser, but not with the purpose of passing through the upper end. rather, the vapors condense and fall back into the extraction chamber to percolate through the matter being extracted. Water is used first with spagyric herbal extractions, and only later is ethanol added. A Liebig tube is not the usual kind, as it is a straight tube, without bulbs or coil, and may permit more uncondensed vapor to escape. An Allihn condenser is perhaps the most common, although a Graham would work too. A Friedrichs coiled, 'cold-finger' condenser would not work because it is not open, and it would cause the apparatus to explode. The pic shows an Allihn condenser.

http://i42.tinypic.com/8zqq3b.jpg