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Aleilius
01-06-2009, 09:44 PM
This is a Phoenix-thread (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?t=7) from the old site (http://alchemy-forums.forumotion.com/forum.htm).

I wanted to get some discussion started on some new research I've been doing. Lately, I've been researching monatomic transition metals and their properties. I think I've hit something here, and I believe there is really something to this science.

Check out this patent (it's fairly complex, but if you have enough chemistry theory you should be able to understand it): http://www.rexresearch.com/ormes/ormes.htm


During efforts to effect quantitative analytical separations of transition metals from naturally occurring materials, it was discovered that ORMEs exist naturally and are found in salts with alkali metals and/or alkaline earth metals, all of which are coupled with waters of hydration and normally found with silica and alumina. ORMEs are also often associated with sulfides and other mineral compositions.

ORMEs may also, it was discovered, be prepared from commercially available T-metals. For ease of description the invention will be primarily described by the preparation of a gold ORME ("G-ORME") from commercially available metallic yellow gold.

The atoms of each ORME do not have d electron orbital overlap as do their corresponding T-metal clusters. ORMEs do not, therefore, exhibit the same characteristic emissions of their corresponding T-metal when subjected to analysis by instruments which depend upon electronic transitions. ORMEs must, therefore, be identified in new ways, ways which have heretofore not been used to identify T-metals.

An aqua regia solution of metallic gold is prepared. This solution contains clusters of gold chlorides of random size and degrees of aggregation. HCl is added to the solution and it is repeatedly evaporated with a large excess of NaCl (20:1 moles Na to moles Au) to moist salts. The addition of NaCl allows the eventual formation of NaAuCl3, after all HNO3 is removed from the solution. The sodium, like gold, has only one unpaired s electron and, accordingly, tends to form clusters of at least two atoms. The sodium, however, does not d orbitally overlap the gold atom as it has no d electrons, resulting in a surface reaction between the sodium atoms and the gold atoms. This results in a weakening of the gold-gold cluster stability and causes the eventual formation of a sodium-gold linear bond with a weakened d orbital activity in the individual gold atoms. The sodium-gold compound, formed by repeated evaporation to salts, will provide a chloride of sodium-gold. In these salts the sodium and gold are believed to be charged positive, i.e., have lost electrons: and the chlorine is negative, i.e., has gained electrons. When the salts are dissolved in water and the pH slowly adjusted to neutral, full aquation of the sodium-gold diatom will slowly occur and chloride is removed from the complex. Chemical reduction of the sodium-gold solution results in the formation of a sodium auride. Continued aquation results in disassociation of the gold atom from the sodium and the eventual formation of a protonated auride of gold as a grey precipitate. Subsequent annealing produces the G-ORME. The G-ORME has an electron rearrangement whereby it acquires a d orbital hole or holes which share energy with an electron or electrons. This pairing occurs under the influence of a magnetic field external to the field of the electrons.

G-ORMEs are stable and possess strong interatomic repulsive magnetic forces, relative to their attractive forces. G-ORME stability is demonstrated by unique thermal and chemical properties. The white saltlike material that is formed from G-ORMEs after treatment with halogens, and the white oxide appearing material formed when G-ORMEs are treated with fuming HClO4 or fuming H2SO4 are dissimilar from the T-metal or its salts. The G-ORME will not react with cyanide, will not be dissolved by aqua regia, and will not wet or amalgamate with mercury. It also does not sinter at 800C under reducing conditions, and remains an amorphous powder at 1200C. These characteristics are contrary to what is observed for metallic gold and/or gold cluster salts. G-ORMEs require a more negative potential than -2.45 v to be reduced, a potential that cannot be achieved with ordinarily known aqueous chemistry.

The strong interatomic repulsive forces are demonstrated in that the G-ORMEs remain as a powder at 1200C. This phenomenon results from canceling of the normal attractive forces arising from the net interaction between the shielded, paired electrons and the unshielded, unpaired s and d valence electrons. G-ORMEs have no unpaired valence electrons and, therefore, tend not to aggregate as would clusters of gold which have one or more unpaired valence electrons.

G-ORMEs can be reconverted to metallic gold from which they were formed. This reconversion is accomplished by an oxidation rearrangement which removes all paired valence electrons together with their vacancy pair electrons, with a subsequent refilling of the d and s orbitals with unpaired electrons until the proper configuration is reached for the T-metal.

This oxidation rearrangement is effected by subjecting the G-ORME to a large negative potential in the presence of an electron-donating element, such as carbon, thus forming a metallic element-carbon chemical bond. For that metal-carbon bond to occur the carbon must provide for the horizontal removal of the d orbital vacancy of the ORME. The carbon acts like a chemical fulcrum. When the element-carbon bond is reduced by way of further decreasing the potential, the carbon receives a reducing electron and subsequently vertically inserts that reducing electron below the s orbitals of the element, thus forming metallic gold.

The above general description for the preparation of G-ORME from commercially available metallic gold is applicable equally for the preparation of the remaining ORMEs, except for the specific potential energy required and the use of nascent nitrogen (N) rather than carbon to convert the other ORMEs to their constituent metallic form. The specific energies range between -1.8 V and -2.5 V depending on the particular element. Alternatively this rearrangement can be achieved chemically by reacting NO gas with the T-metal ORMEs other than gold. Nitric oxide is unique in that it possesses the necessary chemical potential as well as the single unpaired electron.
Example 1: Preparation of G-ORME ~

G-ORME was prepared from metallic gold as follows:

(1) 50 mg gold (99.99% pure) were dispersed in 200 ml aqua regia to provide clusters of gold atoms.

(2) 60 ml concentrated hydrochloric acid were added to the dispersion and the mixture was brought to boil, and continued boiling until the volume was reduced to approximately 10-15 ml. 60 ml concentrated HCl were added, and the sample brought to boil and checked for evolution of NOCl fumes. The process was repeated until no further fumes evolved, thus indicating that the nitric acid had been removed and the gold had been converted completely to the gold chloride.

(3) The volume of the dispersion was reduced by careful heating until the salt was just dry. "Just dry" as used herein means that all of the liquid had been boiled off, but the solid residue had not been "baked" or scorched.

(4) The just dry salts were again dispersed in aqua regia and steps (2) and (3) were repeated. This treatment provides gold chloride clusters of greater than 11 atoms.

(5) 150 ml 6M hydrochloric acid were added to the just dry salts and boiled again to evaporate off the liquid to just dry salts. This step was repeated four times. This procedure leads to a greater degree of sub-division to provide smaller clusters of gold chloride. At the end of this procedure an orangish-red salt of gold chloride is obtained. The salt will analyze as substantially pure Au2Cl6.

(6) Sodium chloride is added in an amount whereby the sodium is present at a ratio 20 moles sodium per mole of gold. The solution is then diluted with deionized water to a volume of 400 ml. The presence of the aqueous sodium chloride provides the salt Na2Au2Cl8. The presence of water is essential to break apart the diatoms of gold.

(7) The aqueous sodium chloride solution is very gently boiled to a just dry salt, and thereafter the salts were taken up alternatively in 200 ml deionized water and 300 ml 6M hydrochloric acid until no further change in color is evidenced. The 6M hydrochloric acid is used in the last treatment.

(80 After the last treatment with 6M hydrochloric acid, and subsequent boildown, the just dry salt is diluted with 400 ml deionized water to provide a monoatomic gold salt solution of NaAuCl2.H2O. The pH is approximately 1.0.

(9) The pH is adjusted very slowly with dilute sodium hydroxide solution, while constantly stirring, until the pH of the solution remains constant at 7.0 for a period of more than twelve hours. This adjustment may take several days. Care must be taken not to exceed pH 7.0 during the neutralization.

(10) After the pH is stabilized at pH 7.0, the solution is gently boiled down to 10 ml and 10 ml concentrated nitric acid is added to provide a sodium-gold nitrate. As is apparent, the nitrate is an oxidizer and removes the chloride. The product obtained should be white crystals. If a black or brown precipitate forms, this is an indication that there is still Na2Au2Cl8 present. If present, it is then necessary to restart the process at step (1).

(11) If white crystals are obtained, the solution is boiled to obtain just dry crystals. It is important not to overheat, i.e., bake.

(12) 5 ml concentrated nitric acid are added to the crystals and again boiled to where the solution goes to just dry. Again it is essential not to overheat or bake. Steps (11) and (12) provide a complete conversion of the product to a sodium-gold nitrate. No chlorides are present.

(13) 10 ml deionized water are added and again boiled to just dry salts. This step is repeated once. This step eliminates any excess nitric acid which may be present.

(14) Thereafter, the just dry material is diluted to 80 ml with deionized water. The solution will have a pH of approximately 1. This step causes the nitrate to dissociate to obtain NaAu in water with a small amount of HNO3 remaining .

(15) The pH is adjusted very slowly with dilute sodium hydroxide to 7.0 + 0.2. This will eliminate all free acid, leaving only NaAu in water.

(16) The NaAu hydrolyzes with the water and dissociates to form HAu. The product will be a white precipitate in water. The Au atoms have water at the surface which creates a voluminous cotton-like product.

(17) The white precipitate is decanted off from any dark grey solids and filtered through a 0.45 micron cellulose nitrate filter paper. Any dark grey solids of sodium auride should be redissolved and again processed starting at step (1).

(18) The filtered white precipitate on the filter paper is vacuum dried at 120 C for two hours. The dry solid should be light grey in color which is HAu.H2O and is easily removed from the filter paper.

(19) The monoatomic gold is placed in a porcelain ignition boat and annealed at 300 C under an inert gas to remove hydrogen and to form a very chemically and thermally stable white gold monomer.

(20) After cooling, the ignited white gold can be cleaned of remaining traces of sodium by digesting with dilute nitric acid for approximately one hour.

(21) The insoluble white gold is filtered on 0.45 micron paper and vacuum dried at 120 C for two hours. The white powder product obtained from the filtration and drying is pure G-ORME.

The G-ORME made according to this invention will exhibit the special properties described in the "General Description" of this application, including catalytic activity, special magnetic properties, resistance to sintering at high temperatures, and resistance to aqua regia and cyanide attack.

Aleilius
01-06-2009, 09:46 PM
Example 2: Recovery of Metallic Gold from Naturally Occurring Material Containing G-ORMES ~

(1) 300 gr of dried material assayed by conventional techniques to show no gold present, ground to less than 200 mesh, is placed in a one-gallon vessel, fitted with electrodes, with 120 gr NaCl (Morton rock salt), 10 gr KBr, and 2 liters of tap water.

(2) The anode consists of a pair of 3/8" x 12" carbon welding rods wrapped together with No. 10 copper wire. The cathode consists of 1-5/8" ID x 14" glass tube with a medium porosity glass frit (ASTM 10-15 M) with a 1" x 15" x 1/16" stainless steel strip inside in a solution of 36 gr/l NaCl (approximately 500 ml). Both electrodes are placed into the sample vessel and supported by clamps extending about 5" into the sample solution.

(3) The sample is placed on a roller table at approximately 10 revolutions per minute. The electrodes are connected to a power supply consisting of a 120 volt variac in conjunction with a 2-3 amp 400-600 PIV rectifier. A 100 watt light bulb and the electrodes are hooked in series. The rectifier load is connected to the anode since the rectifier filters out all negative voltage and only passes positive voltage.

(4) The sample is kept under load for a period of 6-1/2 hours. The final pH is in the range of 3 - 6.5. The voltage across the electrode is 5 volts.

(5) After disconnecting the load, the sample was allowed to settle and the solution over the settled out material was removed by decantation using a peristallic pump.

(6) 800ml of the sample was placed in a 1000 ml beaker and 20 ml concentrated sulfuric acid was added to the solution.

(7) With stirring, the solution was boiled down slowly on a hotplate until the solution was just dry. "Just dry" is as defined in Example 1. The just dry salt contains sodium gold chloride.

(8) The just dry salt was taken up in 400 ml deionized water and again boiled down to the just dry condition. There should be no discoloration at this point, i.e., a clear solution is formed.

(9) The just dry salt was then taken up in 400 ml 6M HCl, and thereafter boiled down to the just dry condition. The dilution and boiling down step was repeated four times, alternating with a deionized water and a 6M HCl wash, with the sequence controlled so that the last washing was with 6M HCl. The purpose of steps (8) and (9) is to remove all traces of hypochlorite oxidant.

(10) The just dry salts are taken up in 400 ml anhydrous ethanol and stirred for approximately ten minutes. This step is to dissolve the gold chloride salt, to remove the sodium chloride.

(11) After stirring, the slurry was filtered through #42 paper on a Buchner funnel.

(12) 5ml of concentrated sulfuric acid was slowly added to the filtrate, mixed, and the filtrate was then allowed to sit for approximately one hour. The filtrate was filtered through #42 filter paper on a Buchner funnel, and then passed through a filter of 0.5 micron Teflon. The sulfuric acid precipitates out any calcium. Filtration removes the precipitant and a light yellow filtrate is recovered, with all traces of calcium sulphate removed.

(13) The light yellow solution was again boiled down to just dry, taking care to avoid any charring. At this point there should be no further evaporation of ethanol and the just dry residue should be free of color. The residue should have a sweet smell similar to burnt sugar. The occurrence of the sweet smell indicates the end point of the boil-down.

(14) The just dry residue is taken up in 600 ml deionized water to provide a water-soluble gold form which is the gold auride. If desired, the G-ORME can be recovered at this stage or converted into metallic gold. For gold recovery, the solution is put into a 1000 ml beaker and an electrolysis unit was set up as shown in FIGURE 2 of the drawing.

As shown in FIGURE 2 of the drawing, the electrolysis unit comprises a 220 volt, 120 amp power supply (20) which is connected to the anode (12) and cathode (14) of the electrolytic cell. The solution is stirred using a magnetic stirrer (16). The anode (12) is a gold electrode, 2 cm2 in size, upon which gold in solution will plate out. The cathode (14) comprises a 6.8 cm2 platinum electrode contained in a Nafion 117 chamber (18). Nafion 117 is a perfluorocarbon sulfonic acid membrane, marketed by the duPont Company, and is a proton-conducting membrane. Inside the Nafion chamber is 200 ml of electrolyte solution containing 5 ml sulfuric acid per 600 ml of electrolyte solution. It is important to keep the Nafion chamber wet at all times. The potential was measured across the electrodes and then an additional -2.2 volts potential was applied and maintained for a period of two hours.

(15) After the two hours, the potential was raised to 3.0 volts and maintained for approximately 18 hours. Bubbles formed on both the gold and platinum electrodes. A black material formed on the gold electrode after three to four hours.

(16) The gold electrode was removed from solution while voltage was still being applied. The electrode was dried in a vacuum oven overnight at 115 C. The electrode was weighed before and after the plating to determine the amount of gold collected.

The metallic gold is, therefore, produced from a naturally occurring ore which, when subjected to conventional assaying, does not test positive for gold.
I am not that skilled in this kind of technical stuff... although it doesn't mean I don't find it interesting. Tell me, can these experiments be re-created by yourself (in full or parts of them) or do they require instruments that are out of your range?
I can do these, and I'll probably start gathering materials and designing an experiment/hypothesis to test whether or not these materials do what the patent claims.

If they do indeed display strange qualities then this is a great discovery!

Take a look at these pages:

1. [link broken]
2. http://www.subtleenergies.com/ormus/tw/oranges.htm
3. http://www.subtleenergies.com/ormus/tw/quick.htm
4. http://www.subtleenergies.com/ormus/tw/reports.htm
For those of you that listen to Coast to Coast AM:

There will be a show on tonight about white powder gold. Here's the excerpt:


"Historian Laurence Gardner will discuss such topics as secret societies, the bloodline of the Holy Grail, & White Powder Gold. "
Take a look at it on this page: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/shows/2008/02/18.html

Also you may listen to it at 12AM CST on this station: www.cjob.com (just click listen now).
I wanted to list another interesting page about this discovery. Go here: http://spiritofmaat.com/mar08/white_powder_gold.html


The red brown dioxide analyzed to be iron, the reduced hydrogen material was aluminum and calcium, and the white material, annealed under argon was calcium and silicon.

The point being that there was no consistency in the analysis of the three materials even though they were all three the same element, that material is 99.9% pure rhodium.


When you dissolve metallic gold into aqua regia, you convert to chloride to get rid of all the nitric. All you really have is a cluster of metallic gold. I don't care how long you boil this, it never will dissolve to the monoatom. The diatonic bonds of gold are so profoundly strong, and if you really think about it, gold has an electronic structure of 5d106s1 and that in itself tells you it will never go to the monoatom.

All of the other s1 elements are lithium, sodium, potassium, rubidium, cesium, these are explosively reactive substances that we call the alkaline metals. If you throw them in water, they burn. Gold has the same structure as these alkaline metals. Gold gets ahold of itself and it will not let go. You can get it down to the diatom, but it will never go farther than that, so the best that you can ever hope for, is AU2CL6. You never lose the diatonic bond, and that's why when you refine gold, you always get 99.9% recovery, because its real easy to recover, it never loses its metallic character.

But if you know how to take those metallic bonds apart and get monoatomic gold, which is what mother nature did by literally dissolving it to a single atom when it comes up out of the earth, about 98% of the gold comes up as monoatomic gold, about 2% comes up as metal. A diamond and carbon are the same element, a diamond is a high energy crystalline form of carbon.


So I begrudgingly read the book and have now read 500 to 600 books on alchemy and its history. All of it goes back to a man the Hebrews called Enoch, the Egyptians called Thoth, in Greece, they call him Hermes Trismegistus they are all the same man. It is claimed he ascended by partaking of the white drops, the man who never died, he ascended because he was so perfect.

We have found, and this in the standard Bristol/Myers Squibb literature, that over the last four or five years, there is tremendous research going on with precious elements and cancer treatment. The precious elements have been found to inter-react with the cell by a vibrational frequency or by a light transfer to correct the DNA. Any incorrect part of the DNA is corrected by the precious element.

It perfects the cells of our body. The element going into our body is not a metal, the element is not a heavy metal, the element is AN ELEMENT, and so there is no heavy metal POISONING. You can eat any amount of this white flour you want to and it won't hurt you, it goes through your digestive system.

In fact, we took some brain tissue from a pig and a cow and we analyzed it, first we destroyed the organic matter and did a metals analysis. Over 5% of the brain tissue by dry matter weight is RHODIUM and IRIDIUM and no one knows it, because it can't be directly measured. The elements are flowing the light of life in your body, the elements are in fact, what the light is.

I can show you four papers by the US Naval Research Facility where they have PROVEN that the cells communicate with each other by a process identical to superconductivity, but they can't figure out WHAT is superconducting. It is these 'stealth' atoms at work. The atoms that are in your body, the atoms that flow perpetually the light of life, but no one knows they are there, because they don't identify by (normal) instrumental analysis.

Very interesting!
The Enoch stuff keeps popping up here and there... sure is very interesting especially with the DNA connections...

All this stuff about DNA talking is not such humbug after all (at least I don't think so). Of course it isn't talking in plain English, but doing a sort of esoteric Lost Speech communication.

That is what ayahuasca (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?t=286) is for!
If ingesting this gave him the ability to live eternal, where is the old duffer?

Then we can all ask him directly as to how he managed it and get him to spill the beans!

Then we can all ask him directly as to how he managed it and get him to spill the beans!

From what I've deduced from the various texts I've read he's in the next dimension. Ingestion of ORMEs type materials supercharges the astral or "rainbow" body, and after prolonged use one begins to emit a certain "glow" or "light."

This eventually turns into a full light body, and one can then shed his physical body while maintaining consciousness and "life." After this point it's said that the individual becomes immortal and can travel anywhere in space and even to various other dimensions.

Although I'm not sure I believe this yet -- it's just what I've found in my research.
Wow, so I just had one of those moments of pure insight relating to the ancient production of the white powder of gold. It's said that elemental gold will only become the white powder of gold once it has been heated to near 10,000C, but the ancients did not have proper mechanisms for PRODUCING this heat. However, this does not mean they did not have other means of generating/harnessing heat from some other source...

Unfortuantely, this is all I'm willing to disclose at this point in time.... However, I believe I know the secret.
As above so below. Did they heat it in the invisible fire, acid or did they heat it in another kind of fire, nitrogen?

Nitrates and Sulphides explain a great deal about how meny an alchemist has met a sticky end...

Especially when you describe it as a kind of charged proton suspended in solution!

**Zip, Crackle** "eureka I've done it!" **sizzle, sizzle, BOOM!**

Nothing left of the poor chap but his smoldering boot's, did he ascend to heaven or become a new type of liquid wallpaper paste?

How to make instant confetti, take one tiny pinch of finely powdered KCl add to it one tiny pinch of finely powdered S (sprinkled on the top, DO NOT mix them together!!!), see those crystals turning purple, re-treat to the very far side of the lab (very swiftly), pick up a weighty old tome or book ( a copy of harry potter and the philosophers stone will do nicelly!), throw it at it and duck for cover, it will rain instant confetti... Muhahaa! Needless to say anything more than half a G (Gram) will level the workbench at best or at worst level the laboratory with you standing in it...

On another note they prescribe nitroglycerine for a dodgy ticker, or bad heart. So now you know what's in that solution of nitro-gel your old grand-dad slips under his tongue from time to time!

Ah, and said afore mentioned explosive can be made safe, by applying and distilling it in linseed oil, so it beggers the question of the red stone, why was it solluted (distilled) in an oil?

Electro-Hydromethyl-Nitrate or as the scientist said in the movie the core once said "I call it, UNOBTAINIUM!"

Their is a lot more to monatomic gold and ORMES than at first greets the eye!

It has to be hidden in the periodic table somewhere its the alchemists job to find it, science decrys alchemy, but science should never forget it's roots stem from alchemy....

Au + Ag'32 - Mg'12 - N'7 - H'5 - O'8 = ?

Atomic state = 0.0 say hello to unobtainium and there was I thinking carbon has a footprint of 0, but isnt carbon according to the scientific community the building block of life?

Magnesium is known to react with the nitrogen to form manesium nitrate and magnesium oxide, here is our oxidizer for our solution of the elixir. Silver and Gold also both react to nitrogen. Stired but not shaken.

Dont forget to have linseed oil to hand, you dont want the great work to evaporate before your very eyes!

Did you know that electrum is a non-castable alloy of gold and silver (yellow to white powder), with gold being more dominant (by how much depends on different standards used throughout history), so 50 / 50 would give you .32 its also saddly lacking from the periodic table.

Magnesium compounds are typically white crystals. Most are soluble in water, providing the sour-tasting magnesium ion Mg2+. Small amounts of dissolved magnesium ion contributes to the tartness and taste of natural waters. The magnesium ion is necessary for all life, so magnesium salts are an additive for foods, fertilizers (Mg is a component of chlorophyll). Also utilized in the manufacture of iron and steel.

Needless to say it also burns with the brightness and intensity of the sun... I figured out the secret long ago...
Since the liquid to gas expansion ratio of this substance is 1:694, tremendous amounts of force can be generated when liquid nitrogen boils off for whatever reasons. In a well-known accident in 2006 at Texas A&M University, the pressure-relief devices of a tank of liquid nitrogen were sealed with brass plugs. As a result, the tank failed catastrophically, and exploded. The force of the explosion was sufficient to propel the tank through the ceiling immediately above it.
As the inventor (rediscoverer) of this ancient substance I hear by invoke my rights to be the first human guinea pig test subject. Immortality shall be mine, I will be the first to sample the divine!

And then I'll sell the sucker to everyone else at a cost of $59.99
Has anyone here tried some ormus or the white powder gold?

I would like your opinions about the experience. I have tried it just recently...
Hi spiralwave, where did you get this material from? Most of the ORME style white gold you buy off the internet is actually gold hydroxide, or some other gold salt. These are quite toxic, and most often will result in a form of heavy metal poisoning from gold. The theory is ORME style white gold is not processed by the body in the same manner as gold salts, and thus will not result in heavy metal poisoning.

I would be weary of this substance if you did not make it yourself.

Also, if you try to prepare the high spin state ORME style monatomic elements from the patent instructions, you will be unsuccessful in the end. You will need to impregnate the white gold/iridium/etc in some form of temperature resistant matrix. This maintains the monatomic state, which would normally be lost if processed in the normal manner.

I got 3 different sources to try it. One was from whitepowdergold.com another from zptech.com and another from a alchemist acquaintance I met.

I wanted to see if anyone here had tried ormus but apparently not. I would like to learn more alchemy and try making some or something myself. I honestly am not really confident this is real alchemic ormus but it is something and it does have some effects.

sorry i just saw this reply just now.
What are the effects? Does it make you sweat? Does it feel slightly "psychoactive?"

I'd like to compare the results of say, an ormus preparation, with something like the aurum potabile.
A friend of mine wanted wanted me to ask BeautifulEvil: if he has taken some of the newly available strong mono-atomic gold?

Hi deviadah, tell your friend this:

I have not taken any commercial available m-state preparations. When dealing with commercial products, it's difficult to determine whether or not what you're ingesting is safe, or dangerous. When we're dealing with metallic salts (gold salts, silver salts, etc) it becomes very dangerous because these are often highly toxic. Of course, when we're dealing with pure colloidal metals, or m-state metals, this is a different situation all together.

I would be very weary of commercial products or preparations. Unless you know what you're getting is the real deal.

So in short, no I have not tried any of the newly available strong m-state gold, and truthfully, any commercially available m-state product.
Thanks!


I would be very weary of commercial products or preparations...So would I...


Even making this oneself is no guarantee. I've known lots of people who made crap m-state.
If making from the salt waters, you mustn't use polluted water.
When precipitating you must stir vigorously to avoid areas of high pH concentration.
You must also add your lye solution slowly and patiently, for the same reason.
You must wash your precipitate well so it has no taste of salt.
To get a really good product you must eliminate the hydroxides and anneal the m-state.

Also, I wouldn't advise taking m-state gold first.
You should prepare your body, physical and energy body, by first taking m-11, ocean water m-state.
After a month you can go to m-3, Great Salt lake which is iridium, rhodium and gold.
This will heal any chronic diseases and injured cells. This has a fair portion of gold in it.

David Hudson said after giving m-state iridium and rhodium to someone @ 250 mgs each,
after four or five days you will here the ringing sound of your aura/meisner field. He gave this dose for 40 days.
Then the dose was increased to 2500 mgs, and after a few days the person started having spontaneous
kundalini several times a day.

The gold m-state, say both David Hudson and the Essene, is not medicinal, but for psychic and elevation of
consciousness. But it doesn't GIVE you a spiritual consciousness; it elevates and fixates whatever you are,
so you don't want to take this without some preperation and training your mind.
Imagine that your thoughts will start to manifest... are you ready for that? Will your thoughts injure yourself
or others?
Read "The Red Lion" by Maria Szepes.

http://www.amazon.com/Red-Lion-Elixir-Eternal-Life/dp/0965262170/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1218668695&sr=1-1

Aleilius
01-06-2009, 09:47 PM
Even making this oneself is no guarantee. I've known lots of people who made crap m-state.
If making from the salt waters, you mustn't use polluted water.
When precipitating you must stir vigorously to avoid areas of high pH concentration.
You must also add your lye solution slowly and patiently, for the same reason.
You must wash your precipitate well so it has no taste of salt.
To get a really good product you must eliminate the hydroxides and anneal the m-state.
Ah, just the person to help me!

I purchased some Dead Sea salt a week or two ago, and finally got it in yesterday. I've had a chance to play with the procedure some, only using small quantities of salt (merely for testing purposes). Supposedly the thing about using Dead Sea salt is the absence of a Gilcrest precipitate. Now I'm not sure of this, but if this is the case, then overshooting pH shouldn't be too much of an issue. I've also been thinking about using sodium carbonate instead of sodium hydroxide. It's a weaker base, and in this case it should be better since the pH shouldn't rise above 11.

I washed/decanted the precipitate three times, so this should remove most of the soluble salts. Now for removing the insoluble hydroxides. If I add diluted hydrochloric acid, this should change the hydroxides to soluble chloride salts. The acid shouldn't have much of an effect on the m-state if the pH doesn't drop below 2 (I think it goes back into solution at this point). I also thought about using a "weaker" acid for this, something like diluted acetic acid. However, it doesn't matter at this point, but if you're worried about contaminates in the hcl, then I think store bought acetic acid would be the way to go.

I've been thinking about the annealing process. I know some say this isn't needed, but I would like to give it a try. I know the Essene recommended using a matrix of clay before annealing, otherwise the m-state would clump together and lose their properties. Now he mentioned this in regards to iridium, but I wonder if this is needed for all the m-state elements. Anyway, how do you anneal your m-state?


Also, I wouldn't advise taking m-state gold first.
You should prepare your body, physical and energy body, by first taking m-11, ocean water m-state.
After a month you can go to m-3, Great Salt lake which is iridium, rhodium and gold.
This will heal any chronic diseases and injured cells. This has a fair portion of gold in it.
Actually, this is probably what I'm planning on doing. I feel pretty confident regarding my current state of health and my spiritual/mental development. I believe it should be fine to start with m-state gold in my situation, but if you feel otherwise, please do let me know!
After washing, I like to part the gold from the MgOH by raising the pH to 12 with the lye solution
which "dissolves" the m-state and leaves the MgOH, so I just filter this, then the filtrate pH is lowered
to 8.5 with HCl or vinegar to retrieve a congealed m-state. To this add lye solution back up to 10.78.
Now wash several times to get a pH of 8 or 9.
That's my preferred method, but there are others.

The dried, powdered m-state can be annealed in an oven, or for higher temps, which may produce higher energy,
you can use a torch - put the m-state in a stainless steel vessel or a large spoon.
But you may want to anneal a small portion at a time just prior to ingestion.
I'm not sure how long the annealing effects last.
I haven't used the clay matrix.

This annealed high-spin m-state is what you want to be concerned/prepared about - what I said about manifesting thoughts.
here's another report on m-state Gold consumption and its effects:

http://www.subtleenergies.com/ormus/tw/realthing.htm

Most people aren't prepared for this. If you've done quite a bit of work on self (not-self?), then you may be
familiar with this and prepared. For anyone that thinks of enlightenment as something glamorous, you'll be in for
a real heavy disappointment.
Non-duality (advaita) is a proper preparation IMO.
If you are experientially familiar with the fact of your own non-existence and are
prepared to have what is normally thought of as reality pulled out from under you, not just for the duration of
a drug trip, but for good.... then you may want to try some real good annealed m-state.
Hi solomon levi, I haven't had internet for the past few weeks, but I would like to give you an update on my work.

I've consumed a small amount of liquid Dead Sea salt m-state precipitate. It was prepared by gently titrating the salt solution with sodium hydroxide. I didn't remove any of the impure hydroxides though. Either way, I'm having trouble noticing the effects so far, but there is something present. The reasons behind this? Simply not enough m-state is in my system, and not only that, but what I have been taking is not annealed. It's m-state, but still in a low spin state. So anyway, I've been thinking about how to improve things.

Before I go any further, I want to say I do not have a pH meter to check the pH levels of the solution. In this situation I think it is fine, because of the lack of a gilcrest precipitate. I haven't tested this yet, but it's something I need to check before I proceed further.

Now, I believe I will anneal my m-state material to achieve the maximum benefits. First I should remove the hydroxides by either your method, or another method. This shouldn't prove to be difficult, but I know I will still have some impurities in the precipitate. After this I believe I will make a quartz chamber for annealing process. The chamber will have a gas intake (helium as an inert gas), and an exhaust outlet. The proper annealing temperature is around 300C. I will probably use a small coal fire for this. Also, I believe after this process there will be sodium in the m-state, and this can be removed by dissolving in nitric acid.
Greetings!
I haven't had internet access either. But I've moved and have my laboratory now.
I have a lot of processes going at once:

I've been dissolving salts in vinegar and evaporating to re-crystalise.
The ones I've experimented with are oyster shell (calcium carbonate), copper carbonate
and sea salt. I didn't know that the sea salt as an acetate crystalises into pyramids!
They're so cool - and the little baby ones too. I'm preparing the fixed spirit of salt, but the sodium
acetate can also be used for the acetone work.
Besides those I'm ready to do a dry fusion with antimony trisulphate and potassium carbonate.
I understand that after fusing these together for 1/2 hour, you can extract the red oil of antimony with alcohol/
spirit of wine. I just got my Everclear tonight, so I'm ready to try that (they don't sell it in Washington - I have to
go to Oregon to buy Everclear).
I'm also gonna make the essence of honey by digesting honey and alcohol for 2 weeks or a month.
I'm excited about that one - they say it smeels amazing and a couple drops revives a person on their death bed!
But you know how alchemist boasts... we'll see.
And I also began a wet potassium carbonate fusion with steel to create the spirit of steel.
I just need to evaporate it down to a syrup now.
I also tried to improve some old m-state.
I was really busy this past weekend! I can't sleep when there's alchemy to do!

I too have been thinking about the m-state (I just said that I guess) and came up with some improvements and realisations:
1. Why do some people work on actual expensive gold and dissolve it in aqua regia to a gold chloride
when you can by a 55 pound bag of dead sea salt for 80 something bucks and have a hell of a lot more gold chloride?!
I don't think there are any benefits - only to do it for experience. So everyone save your money and buy dead sea salts.
Nature has done the work for you - well, alot of it. I live in Washington state and found out that Salt Works is located here
and sells the Bokek dead sea salts that are supposed to be the best, and I got two 55 lb bags today (at a discounted price
of 74 bucks each)!! With that much mono-atomic gold, There'll be too much for just medicine - I'll try reverting some
back to metallic gold and see if i can't make a profit. Wouldn't that be something!
2. Never decant! I'm pretty sure that any decanting is pouring away the finest most subtle truly mono-atomic gold that we
can't really see. So do the boil down instead and you lose nothing, plus the heat helps break the gold into even smaller clusters.
3. I came across a process for calx of gold by Glauber (the book is called "A compendium of alchemical processes" by anonymous)
and he said he knows of no finer precipitate than that obtained by salt of tartar (the water, "oil"). He said it's much finer (the
precipitate) than with other lixiviums (referring to lye - NaOH) and it swims around for a long time and appears as tiny golden stars.
The fact that it swims because of its lightness is no problem if you do the boil down, 'cause you don't have to wait for everything to settle
like with decanting.
4. I think I said this before, but stir vigorously while adding the lye or tartar solution to avoid any areas of high concentration pH.
5. When you do dead sea, the precipitate gets really thick, like oatmeal consistency. So do it in a large enough container and leave
some room 'cause you'll most likely end up adding more water as you go in order to keep the consistency thin enough.
6. My next m-state experiments will be basically the Hudson method but using Dead sea salt instead of Gold. I think this is
neccessary in order to get the true, or nearest to true, MONO-atomics. If we just precipitate the gold and wash it, I don't think it's
near mono-atomic. So I'll do the boil-downs with HCl - the pH "swing" - and get rid of the hydroxides and chlorides and as much
as I can and see if I can get astral with this.

If you do get Bokek dead sea salt, there is a method for a "quick lye dump" here if you decide to use NaOH instead of potassium
carbonate:

http://www.ankhenatenlab.com/M_salt_quick.asp

Cool! Keep me updated with your work and I'll do the same.
Okay, I was confusing the two processes. With dead sea water there is no need for boil down as in metallic gold
method, no advantage.

The simplest way is to take your filter dead sea water, bring pH up to 10.78, then drop it with HCl or vinegar
to 9 and that will place the magnesium back into solution and leave you with gold m-state.
8.5 is really the product with least magnesium, but in that last .5 pH you will also lose a quantity of gold
with the magnesium, so it's best to stop at 9. Wash 3 times to eliminate salt and you're ready to go.
Dried is more powerful than wet.

Watch for the plateau around 9.10. Go slow and have patience. Keep going to 9.0

Dried is more powerful than wet.
I've heard various stories. As you well know, many gardeners/farmers have tested m-state on their vegetation. They mentioned the wet was better for plant life, as the dried m-state didn't provide the same intense growth as the wet m-state.

I'm not sure about human life, but I suppose the only way to confirm this is through experimentation. Is this what you have noticed?
Okay... I'm a scientist by nature. Qualitative social scientist, and I like to be fairly open minded, but still a scientist, still with strong skeptical inclinations. And this whole ORME thing is bugging the shit out of me. Does anyone know of any references to it in any reputable sources, such as peer-reviewed journals or the like that I could access with one of my academic accounts?

Aside from the fact that the words "orbitally rearranged" sound like hand-waving technobabble, the fact that the only website that seems to have much info on them suggests that possible applications include levitation and zero-point energy has my "bullshit" radar on the verge of exploding. I mean, come on... levitation? What?

Now, thing is, I'm not a chemist. I don't really know either way, and I'm trying to keep an open mind here, but there are a lot of alarm bells going off with this stuff. So... help me out here. If you take this stuff seriously, could you please explain why? What convinced you?

Aleilius
01-06-2009, 09:52 PM
I too am a scientist by nature, but I consider and research everything, even if it sounds absurd. All information is good information - there is not a single shard of bad information.

I cannot explain it fully, because honestly I don't know how it works. We're alchemists, not super advanced quantum scientists or whatnot. Our path is one of experimentation, one of trial and error, we are not called "laborers" for mere fancy (verily do we labor, and time nips at our life with each passing moment). There are many forks in the road, and not all these lead to the end, there is only one path that leads to the end. Although there are some paths that are closer to the end than others, but yet, these paths also end short of the goal. Who knows, perhaps even this is a path close to the goal, but it may not be the goal itself.

Dig into the texts my friend. Search Google and behold everything it returns. Read until time no longer has a hold on your mind!
Googling around a bit, the best discussion on the topic I've found is here: http://www.scienceforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=7869

Principally from the side of skeptics, whose consensus is "what a load of crock." A couple people came in half way through the thread to say how ORME is real, etc, but did a piss poor job of it and just made it look even less likely.

The poster "insane alien" has the best summary of the data I can find:

monatomic gold IS possible, it is NOT possible to rearange the orbitals QM doesn't work like that.

it is not white, it is not superconductive(at room temperature, i think gold superconducts at low temperatures like most metals), it would probably give you heavymetal poisoning if anything.
Not trying to be a dick here or anything... if there's actually some good data on the subject which would indicate otherwise (and I mean good data, not poorly sourced anecdotes -- surely we as alchemists can hold ourselves to a higher standard than Crystal Healing?), I'd love to see it. But if there isn't, I'd caution against wasting money on it or risking your health by eating these substances. The extraction from sea-salt is definitely interesting, and sounds like a fun experiment, though. Has anyone tried it? What were the results?

It's my understanding that alchemy has always used the best science available to it at the time. In the 21st century we're pressed in upon by many pseudoscientists (new age and otherwise) who wish to sell us their fraudulent ideas, and on the other side we're ignored by the scientific community because they see our high opinion of the spiritual as indicative of poor methodology. It is the latter, not the former, to whom we should be going... as a social movement, our goal should be to reform science and remind it of what humanity has always known about the sanctity of matter and the importance of ritual. To do that, though, first we must legitimate ourselves in their eyes, by being legitimate. In other words, let's join with them in the rejection of pseudoscience, not become a pseudoscience ourselves!

As Geber said in The Sum of Perfection, "He who has no elementary knowledge of Nature is far from a proper appreciation of this Art." Likewise, Rosarius writes "I advise no one to approach this Art unless he knows the principle and regimen of Nature: if he be acquainted with these, little is wanting to him except one thing, nor need he put himself to great expense, since the stone is one, the medicine is one, the vessel one, the rule one, the disposition one." (my source for both quotes: The Golden Tract)

Stay skeptical. Understand Nature first, construct only metaphors which are true.
I would always suggest you ask yourself "Is it philosophic?" concerning anything passed on as alchemical. Our predecessors followed nature for good reason. The wisdom nature shows is far superior to anything I've learned from another man. Granted the initial insights I gained were from reading the true sages, but all their teachings stem from the open book of nature. In hindsight I saw that all they did was point...
WCH, it was not my intention to prove, or disprove anything. It was only my intention to post something of decent worth, perhaps almost even poetic.

While heavy metal poisoning does happen, especially when Gilcrest precipitates occur, normally I'm lead to believe instances of heavy metal poisoning just from m-states are rare. If you titrate with a hydroxide, and perhaps you get gold hydroxide, then even a small amount of it would cause individuals to become ill. I do not believe this has happened, since I've met many consumers of m-state products and they're quite astute. The Essene mentioned he's been taking it all his life, and this man is very quick - very smart!

I've tried some of it, and I have not succumbed to gold poisoning or any heavy metal poisoning. I suppose an experiment would be to test a small amount of gold hydroxide against the m-state precipitate from dead sea salt using test animals. Let's see if there's a difference, and I assure you - there's a difference.

Also, let's not forget the great important of magnesium. Magnesium contained in the precipitate is very healthy, and honestly - it's a universal medicine, and a cure all. I've got a pdf to prove it, and I believe it also has references.
Do you know for sure that this substance is, in fact, m-state gold? The chemist I quoted on the science board suggested that m-state gold would be black, not white -- although it seemed that he had not actually seen it firsthand, so he could easily be simply wrong. What colour is it?

The precipitate obtained from this process is indeed white. If you remove the insoluble hydroxides, which are also white, you will still be left with a white powder. What's this white powder? It's not one of the hydroxides! It might be Na-Au. Because you can perform a process on this white powder, using sulfur, to obtain elemental gold. The sulfur removes the sodium from the gold, and becomes sodium sulfate.

While I have not done the process myself, I remember reading about it from an interview featuring the Essene. He mentioned this was how King Solomon obtained his vast riches and gold.

EDIT: It's nearly impossible to detect m-state elements using conventional analysis. After you do the sulfur burn, you will be able to detect the elemental gold.
I was told very recently, by the Essene's main protege, that gold hydroxide is purple-ish.
So you can easily tell it apart from m-state.

I can affirm that m-state gold is a white powder. Also Hudson's lectures are about a white powder of gold.
The white is "convenient" in that if you stop taking it you will return to "normal", so you can have a taste
of what the red lion is like. If you take the red, there's no return - you are changed forever. Like a mushroom trip that won't stop,
if you're not prepared.
How do you know it was really m-state gold, though? I'm aware Hudson claims it is, but frankly I consider everything Hudson says to be highly suspect.
Hudson provides copious articles from other scientist in reputable scientific magazines that confirm his findings (at his lectures,
and in videos).
You should see if you can find one of the videos. They're amazing.
I've met the man. He's one of the least suspect people I've met. Very humble.

I do not care to convince either. People arrive at things when they're ready, not because of facts or knowledge.

I don't know that what I'm taking is mono-atomic. I haven't had it analysed. But I've taken various m-states off and on
for years an have no negative side effects. I've only recently started the gold and I had a kundalini experience yesterday.
In my experience, it does exacly what the Essene and Hudson say it will do. I really don't care if it's mono-atomic or not.
In alchemy, the subtlety of the materials is very much affected by thoughts, beliefs, states, attitudes. I have no doubt that
someone else who didn't believe or who hasn't done spiritual alchemical work on themselves - they could take the exact
same alchemical preparations I take and have nothing happen, or have something negative happen. That's how alchemy is.
It's not just consuming some substance that magically affects you. "You must make of yourselves living philosophical stones".
The alchemist is the main ingredient in alchemy. What levitates for one may not levitate for another. (quantum physics - observer
affects what s/he observes; double slit experiment... etc.)
I detect the presence of the m-state element by running a magnet under it. Usually the m-state dust attracts to it. And, of course this is not any proof that the m-state theory is correct but it is definately strange to find magnetic elements in great concentrations in places where they shouldn't be (like grape juice and sea salt). If you gonna try it, be sure that the m-state is well dried (raise fire above 100 C) and that it is purified from other impurities (like MgOH). I think this link (www.rexresearch.com/ormes/ormeprep.htm) explains a lot if someone is interested. (look at Method 4)
I have tried m-state powder in its low spin form. They are like microtubules of glass from a glance. Not under any magnification.
I noticed as soon as i took the white powder and put it under my tongue i felt a surge of energy throughout my body. It made me happier as i have had bipolar and manic episodes. It got me on a big spiritual kick. I couldn't get enough of it. It has a high effect to it. Like an overload of astral energy in the body and mind. It stopped my headaches which i had nearly everyday. It is a very interesting substance. I would like to try the High spin state. They say 5 grams can fill a bucket. They also say that if you had a 50 gram plate, and put high spin ormus on it then the plate with the ormus would weigh less together than just the plate originally. In high spin state it is said if you touch it it automatically soaks into your skin.
Scientists are calling this Exotic matter.
HMMMM.

Vlad
02-08-2009, 05:58 PM
Regarding annealing, I want to mention that during my research into m-state some years ago I picked up somewhere, I don't recall if it was in archives (probably) or a direct quote from Hudson, that the inert gas atmosphere is not necessary for annealing, and that doing it in plain air works just as well if not better, due to the helium otherwise imprinting.

Vlad
02-11-2009, 12:12 PM
The Essene also mentioned to me that the dried white powder of gold is about a thousand times stronger (than the wet undried powder).