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Astarte
10-21-2013, 08:42 PM
I noticed there is an 84 year or so cycle to US history seemingly corresponding to the Uranus cycle. 1777 (height of the American revolution) 1861 (outbreak of the civil war) 1945 (end of world war ii) 2029 (???) - as you can see, every 84 years or so the USA seems to be involved in some definitive war which identifies and shapes its national character for the proceeding historical period.

Also note, 1776 + 248 (one full pluto cycle) = 2024.

The decade will start off in 2020/21 with a triple conjunction of Jupiter/Saturn/Pluto.

Some who are not even astrologers have said this about the 2020s http://www.livescience.com/22109-cycles-violence-2020.html

Thoughts?

Awani
10-21-2013, 09:24 PM
I think patterns can be found in anything. Not saying your theory is invalid... but I am saying trying to map things like this might make you go insane. Time are waves crashing on the shores of the unknown. In the infinite span of time that has so far elapsed US history is but a microdot... so not sure it is even important. :)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9vkoDkeaVM

BUT if it is true what you say then great. Violent upheaval (as they predict might occur in the 2020s) is probably what is needed! All part of the new age...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFUX46NiOqw

:cool:

Astarte
10-21-2013, 10:15 PM
In the infinite span of time that has so far elapsed US history is but a microdot... so not sure it is even important. :)


Indeed, though, human existence is not unlimited - we get a certain amount of time in matter reality to cultivate ourselves - to transmutate the lapis or fail. Surely material conditions play a role in attaining heightened consciousness in so far as if people have the leisure time and their material needs met they will have time to devote to the pursuit of enlightenment and metaphysics and thus will be more likely to triumph over the stage of putrefaction if they even get that far in the first place. Of course, there have been the ascetics who have used deprivation of material want in an effort to destroy attachment, but starvation, pestilence and war - the obliteration of human needs - rather than wants, rarely yields ascendancy. I see your point, of course, that the rise and fall of nation states are quantitative blinks on the quality of macrocosm, but then the process of individual ascendancy is also trifle in the grand scheme of things. To me civilization is a benefactor of the quest for enlightenment.

Awani
10-21-2013, 10:21 PM
but then the process of individual ascendancy is also trifle in the grand scheme of things. To me civilization is a benefactor of the quest for enlightenment.

Is it? IMO it is probably much greater. What is civil about civilization? Perhaps a future civilization... we can hope and work for that goal.

Everyone has their way to format an image of time and space and no path is invalid... but can we ever do that? There will never be, in my mind, a theory of everything... and if we ever find it then it will probably be a silly one. The universe is a prankster! Just look at Earth... what a joke. And I say that in a well-meaning way.

:cool:

Awani
10-21-2013, 10:28 PM
But numbers is the language of science so dabbling in numerology can be interesting and fun. I was just making a point. :)

:cool:

Astarte
10-21-2013, 10:42 PM
Is it? IMO it is probably much greater. What is civil about civilization? Perhaps a future civilization... we can hope and work for that goal.
Well, of course the advent of the state and classes has yielded much coercion - but this is the mass putrefaction of humanity that has been taking place since the dawn of the Neolithic - the putrefaction is already yielding the benefits of the peacock's tail as far as the boons civilization has given to man in the form of knowledge unheard of before the advent of the civilization, medical extension of the lifespan by leaps and bounds, the explosion of human population, increasing ability to control natural material processes, etc all in spite of the "melancholy" of class coercion and the state. Indeed the process is not complete - the "albedo" of society, when the state and coercion is no more, but the gains in knowledge remains can only take place with the continuation of human civilization. You meantioned US history does not matter so much, my very point is it does matter because civilization matters, and civilization in turn matters because it is made up of the billions of souls struggling for ascendancy who would not have that opportunity if civilization did not exist.


Everyone has their way to format an image of time and space and no path is invalid... but can we ever do that? There will never be, in my mind, a theory of everything... and if we ever find it then it will probably be a silly one. The universe is a prankster! Just look at Earth... what a joke. And I say that in a well-meaning way.

:cool:
Indeed, reality is like an onion.

Krisztian
10-21-2013, 11:35 PM
. . . . (end of world war ii) 2029 (???) - as you can see, every 84 years or so the USA seems to be involved in some definitively war which identifies and shapes its national character for the proceeding historical period.

American John Houge maintains that 2020s will see much continental upheaval more specifically in US. . . . When I viewed the near future I saw civil war interior of States, Canada serving as refuge for wounded civilians. For whatever that's worth, just saying.

Illen A. Cluf
10-22-2013, 12:12 AM
I don't think we have to wait until the 2020's to see some incredibly significant changes. China is in the process of calling in the immense debt owed by the US. It is also in the process of removing the US dollar as the world standard. The US is bankrupt, has been bankrupt since the gold standard was tossed out and banks allowed to take over the finances of the country - rather to milk it for all it could take) and the world has seen the American dream (as practiced by many countries) for what it is - as corrupt, immoral and subject to abuse (despite the so-called built-in checks and balances) as any government. When that happens... and soon... you will see changes like the world has not seen in centuries. This is not based on numerology or psychic prediction. It's based on observation and common sense. It's already beginning...

III
10-22-2013, 02:36 AM
I don't think we have to wait until the 2020's to see some incredibly significant changes. China is in the process of calling in the immense debt owed by the US. It is also in the process of removing the US dollar as the world standard. The US is bankrupt, has been bankrupt since the gold standard was tossed out and banks allowed to take over the finances of the country - rather to milk it for all it could take) and the world has seen the American dream (as practiced by many countries) for what it is - as corrupt, immoral and subject to abuse (despite the so-called built-in checks and balances) as any government. When that happens... and soon... you will see changes like the world has not seen in centuries. This is not based on numerology or psychic prediction. It's based on observation and common sense. It's already beginning...

Hi Illen,

And when hasn't great change been going on in the past 3000 years, especially when written by people anticipating the future in terms of the upheaval they are experiencing. Novelty theory speaks of these cycles via calculations based on I Ching cycles according to McKenna. I don't really know. In every life I remember I died, often in the middle of some upheaval or another.

Ghislain
10-22-2013, 02:43 AM
I am not very well versed in Astronomy or Astrology, more through a lazy aspect than a
lack of understanding or desire, but the future is fairly easy to predict as one thing that
can always be guaranteed is change, and ideas about the direction of that change
abound therefore whatever happens in the future has already been predicted by
someone, somewhere. If your prediction is wrong you just move on without giving it a
second thought, but should your prediction be right then it is milked for all its worth –
Nostrodamus (Michel de Nostredame 1503 – 1566) for example.

In the Bestseller “The Cloud Atlas” the future world power is proposed to be
Asia and with the economic growth in that area I think it is a fair bet.

The thing is that world power is not the most significant aspect in life, it is personal
development and achievement; and what is necessary for that development. This
climate is different from person to person, but, like in advertising, we can get a general
consensus as to what will fit most people.

Below are the steps in the pyramid that is known as Maslow’s Hierarchy of Human
Needs. This was formulated by Psycologist Abraham Maslow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_Maslow) (1908 – 1970)

He formulated it in levels of achievement.

http://thealchemyforum.com/Images/Maslow

Source: (http://www.gargasz.info/understanding-people-maslows-hierarchy-of-needs-and-claytons-erg-theory/)

Today there are probably eight levels and perhaps these will grow as information becomes evermore available.

1. Basic Needs or Physiological Needs - these are somewhat obvious and
necessary for basic human survival. Without food, air, drink, warmth and sleep,
the human body cannot continue to function.

2. Safety Needs - Once physical needs are somewhat satisfied, focus on safety
needs take precedence and dominate our behavior. These needs being satisfied
quell our need for an orderly predictable world where unfairness and
inconsistency are under control.

3. Belongingness and the Need for Love - Once basic and safety needs are met,
human needs become social and involve a need for acceptance and to love and
be loved. If these elements are absent, social anxiety and depression can arise.

4. Esteem Needs - This level is attained when individuals feel comfortable with
what they have accomplished from a success and status standpoint.

5. Cognitive Needs - At this point, we feel a need to increase our intelligence and
we chase knowledge to gain a better understanding of the world around us. We
now feel a need to explore and desire new experiences.

6. Aesthetic Needs - With the previous needs satisfied, we now find we need to
refresh ourselves with the presence of beauty, nature, art, music and the other
aesthetically beautiful things the world has to offer. This leads to a beautiful
feeling of intimacy and oneness with nature and everything beautiful.

7. Self-actualization - This is our instinctual need as humans to make the most of
our abilities and to strive to be the best we can be. Quoting Maslow "What a man
can be, he must be." It is also at this level that individuals experience
extraordinary moments called Peak Experiences which include transpersonal and
ecstatic states tinged with themes of euphoria, harmonization and
interconnectedness.

8. Transcendence - Having personally self-actualized, there is a desire to help
others self-actualize. In doing so, we connect with something beyond the ego and
we experience states beyond normal human consciousness and take things to
another level of being.

Source: Conscious Aging Institute (http://www.consciousaging.com/Transpersonal%20Psychology/Conscious%20Aging%20-%20Maslow's%20Hierarchy%20of%20Needs.aspx)

From Lead to Gold

In this thread it is evident there may be opposing views of what the future holds.

What I would like to see happen in 2020 is the abolition of all borders world-wide; a flow of the
world’s population into areas that most suit their needs, no one living in poverty and hunger
because of their birthplace legacy. I understand the chaos and confusion this would initially cause,
but like water it will find its natural level and we can become the one that we really all are.

In the words of Blue Mink... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAWn4FO1MOw)

What we need is a great big melting pot
Big enough to take the world and all it's got
And keep it stirring for a hundred years or more
And turn out coffee colored people by the score.

We can all transcend together!

Ghislain

Illen A. Cluf
10-23-2013, 02:14 AM
Hi Illen,

And when hasn't great change been going on in the past 3000 years, especially when written by people anticipating the future in terms of the upheaval they are experiencing. Novelty theory speaks of these cycles via calculations based on I Ching cycles according to McKenna. I don't really know. In every life I remember I died, often in the middle of some upheaval or another.


Yes, change occurs constantly, and is relative in terms of magnitude. There are many ways of measuring upheaval, and the death quota often seems the most common. The Bubonic plague was one such occurrence, and of course the Second World War is another.

I find it very interesting that you recall so many past lives. Have you ever tried to research the detail regarding some of your past selves?


Mod note: Off-topics answered and continued on a new thread: Remembering Other Lives/Selves/Incarnations (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?3748-Remembering-Other-Lives-Selves-Incarnations)

Illen A. Cluf
10-23-2013, 02:35 AM
Very interesting comments, Ghislain. I remember reading Maslow in University many decades ago and being quite impressed with his book. It sure would be nice if more borders were opened, as they did in Europe. But there will likely always be the terrorist mentality countries who like to destroy all that is good in other countries only because their beliefs are different. Would you open your borders to these people?

Mod Note: Off-topic continued on new thread: Embedding Graphics (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?3749-Embedding-Graphics)

Andro
10-23-2013, 04:39 AM
Upheavals accompanied by the rise and fall of centralized empires have occurred many times all over the wolrd during documented history.

This time around it appears as if it's happening on a global scale. I wonder it there are astrological indicators for this.
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Also, since the discussion appears to cover more than just the US, I've changed the title to Astrological Cycles & Global Events.