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Breemar
08-29-2014, 03:31 PM
I used to read several reports of people who successfully turned small amounts of Graphite into a special kind of Steel. They simply used an electrical Arc or Spark that flashes trough some Graphite powder, where the two Electrodes are also graphite (blocks).
Some did it under water, some in air.

Can somebody around here confirm this?

We know that in nuclear power plants some transmutation happens all the time, as a tiny byproduct of the immense power generation. So, maybe this is a small scale model of it.

I wonder what happens when the experiment is done in helium instead of air...
Right now I have no links, but google may certainly find it.

theFool
08-29-2014, 05:02 PM
I have experimented with it. Part of the graphite dust became magnetic. This can be explained by possible contamination from the electrodes used (I used needles).
Trying to explain the result as a transmutation of C to Fe is just outlandish and impossible.

Breemar
08-31-2014, 04:23 AM
Yeah, but those reports tell of graphite electrodes, so no metals were involved.

I did this too and obtained a tiny piece of steel, although I was not certain if it may have been a contamination of the saw that I used to cut the graphite...

BTW. graphite powder is very diamagnetic and sporadicly jumps around on a paper when a magnet is held against it from under the paper. That is no ferromagnetism, but natural diamagnetism, don't confuse the two.

theFool
08-31-2014, 08:40 AM
I did this too and obtained a tiny piece of steel, How can you know that it is steel?
You say you got only one piece. If transmutation was the cause, probably steel particles would be scattered around the graphite powder. It is very suspicious that you got only one piece.

Andro
08-31-2014, 09:44 AM
I once (maybe 3 years ago) did some work with pure Antimony in a Graphite crucible. There's nothing ferromagnetic in Antimony and Graphite, there were no other matters involved, but I ended up obtaining a subtle gray powder (I had to scratch it off the surface and separate it with a magnet) that is demonstrably ferromagnetic (after repeated cycles of varying degrees of fire, various melting and cooling times).

As for now, I have no 'scientific' explanation for this.

theFool
08-31-2014, 10:26 AM
Sometimes even tiny iron impurities can be blamed for the magnetic behaviour of a substance. I was working once with zinc powder which contained ~0.01% iron impurities (according to label). The magnetic behaviour of the dust was not detectable, but after working with it, it seems that the iron impurities were concentrated and whatever dust remained, behaved magnetically.

I don't know if this is the explanation in the case of antimony, but I know that commercial antimony metal has iron impurities in it (of course if antimony ore was used, it has lot more iron impurities).

Another explanation could be the formation of novel magnetic compounds, not known to mainstream science. Numerous times I have observed a magnetic behaviour where it should not exist. For example, in some scientific publications, nanoparticles of non-magnetic elements have been observed to be magnetic. Here a report on gold nanoparticles (http://pubs.rsc.org/en/content/articlelanding/2012/nr/c2nr30640a#!divAbstract)

So, whatever attracts to a magnet may be not iron but something more interesting...

Andro
08-31-2014, 11:12 AM
I know that commercial antimony metal has iron impurities in it (of course if antimony ore was used, it has lot more iron impurities).

I used the purest Antimony I could find, not ore. And a Graphite crucible :)

And the quantity of the 'magnetic dust/powder' was not huge - but not negligible either.


So, whatever attracts to a magnet may be not iron but something more interesting...

This is what I would very much like to think, as well :)

Dendritic Xylem
09-02-2014, 09:18 AM
Here's the info on graphite transmutation...
http://www.rexresearch.com/adept/aa3car~1.htm

Electrical discharges can cause transmutation.
It has been done by many reputable people, and not just with graphite...

Hantaro Nagaoka
Adolf Miethe
Domenico Cirillo
Mitsubishi
Toyota

Here's 5 different patents from Siemens Corporation, for goldmaking with electricity.
GB 250890
GB 248314
GB 247508
GB 243670
GB 233715

Anyone who is skeptical about lenr with plasma discharge should take a look at the Widom-Larsen Theory. It provides a purely scientific explanation of low energy transmutation by utilizing low-momentum neutrons created by surface plasmon polariton dynamics.

Dendritic Xylem
09-02-2014, 10:24 AM
Based on Widom-Larsen Theory, as well as experimental results, the use of electrical discharge through tungsten seems to be an efficient way to produce Au. There is also evidence that this idea is not necessarily new.

From The Morning of the Magicians

Dutt, whose antecedents had been looked into by Helbronner, was an Indian who claimed to have had access to some very ancient manuscripts. He declared that he had learned from them certain methods for the transmutation of metals, and that he had, by means of a condenser discharge across a conductor of boride of tungsten, obtained traces of gold in the resulting deposit. Similar results were later to be obtained by the Russians, but this time by using powerful particle accelerators.

theFool
09-02-2014, 11:20 AM
My main concern with those LENR transmutation theories applied to the carbon to iron transmutation is the enormous excess energy that should have been produced if a nuclear reaction was taking place. Even few milligrams of iron, would emmit a lot of energy during production.

Here, a quote from the document ( http://www.rexresearch.com/adept/aa3car~1.htm ) Dentritic Xylem offered:

Those results suggest that at least some of the reported yields of iron might be due to the arc coagulating ORMEs (Orbitally Rearranged Monoatomic Elements) existing in the Earth's atmosphere. ORMEs are virtually undetectable by all conventional methods except infrared analysis, which can distinguish a certain characteristic doublet. As David Hudson discovered in the 1980s, ORMEs can be converted to metallic form by certain processes involving carbon or nitrogen, ... The document also describes how the "transmutation" is stopped when no air is allowed to enter the reaction vessel. They explain this by the need of oxygen, but...

They describe also the the appearence of Si, Al, Ni together with Fe in the product when performing spectroscopic analysis.

The Fe in the C residue was also analyzed by mass spectroscopy for the abundance of various isotopes... Besides Fe, the presence of other elements like Si, Ni, Al, and Cr was also determined in the C residue, and it was found that the variation of their concentrations followed the same pattern as that of Fe.This reminds me of ORMEs behaviour in spectroscopic analysis.
Given the fact that ORMEs can attract to a magnet too, here we have one more possible explanation for the experiment.

A relevant thread dealing with LENR theories can be found here:
http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?3950-Is-transmutation-of-elements-possible-outside-of-a-star-or-a-nuclear-reactor

guthrie
11-20-2014, 10:54 AM
Graphite itself can contain a fair amount of iron, 0.01% or more. It is actually a natural product, dug out of the ground and processed according to what it is required for. Removing the many impurities within it is hard work and takes time, they often total half a percent or more by mass.