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Ghislain
03-12-2015, 09:14 AM
Is it possible that the manufacture of gold through alchemy was nothing more than making gold alloys and hence multiplication by addition of impurities?

For example...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e7/Ag-Au-Cu-colours-english.svg/350px-Ag-Au-Cu-colours-english.svg.png

Ghislain

Salazius
03-12-2015, 01:46 PM
It is not an alloy, alloys are for archemy and the imitations of metals (in "secrets of arts and crafts" it is sometime question of that, it was published under Louis XIV), which was common in the old times.

In the graduation of metals, here is the "order".

Copper => Silver = > Gold.

The triangle of the colours is very interesting.

JDP
03-12-2015, 07:50 PM
Is it possible that the manufacture of gold through alchemy was nothing more than making gold alloys and hence multiplication by addition of impurities?

For example...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e7/Ag-Au-Cu-colours-english.svg/350px-Ag-Au-Cu-colours-english.svg.png

Ghislain

Hardly. Even as far back as the Alexandrian and Byzantine literature on the subject you can already find passages that denote an awareness that there is a difference between simple alloys or things that appear to be gold and silver and real gold and silver. With the later Arabic and Latin literature we have even more specific remarks on the subject, and the increasing popularization of such assaying methods as cupellation, cimentation, fusion with sulfur/sulfides, "aqua fortis", differences in density, etc. makes it even less possible that they were confusing any alloys with the real thing. This whole "alchemists accepted as gold and silver anything that was shiny, malleable and golden or silvery in color" thing is rather a convenient generalization made up by modern "critics" of alchemy, like Arthur John Hopkins or Frank Sherwood Taylor, to try to "explain" the alchemists' adamant defense of transmutation, and not something universally supported by the literature on the subject.

True Initiate
03-12-2015, 08:03 PM
the graduation of metals, here is the "order".

Copper => Silver = > Gold.

Something is missing in this equation. Where is Iron?

In nature the equation appears to be:

Quartz + Iron = > Gold

crestind
03-12-2015, 09:15 PM
I think it could be said that...

Any element(s) + electromagnetism -> Sol

Perhaps sol is a particularly stable element or something. I don't think iron has to be present, but I think it helps greatly due to its highly magnetic properties.

I was thinking about this last night and I realized... the Schneider process... is backed up exactly by Walter Russell's claims that transmutilation is "easy" with pulsed electrostatic fields and magnetic fields... quartz is piezoelectric and pyroelectric. When heated up, it generates an electric field, but there is no magnetic field. But the electric current provided by the electrodes does provide a magnetic field. So we now have both. If we substitute common chemicals like alkalis instead of a geo, all chemicals have electric and magnetic fields... but they would naturally be weaker.


Electromagnetism must be the prime mover in alchemy.

So maybe we should get two gigantic iron plates separated by an airgap. Place a mix of substances in between (use your imagination, maybe Cu and Ag with a bit of Au, or Ag and Hg or Hg and Pb). Then on the other axis we have two magnets separated by an airgap, both pointing north. The plates pulse the voltage back and forth like an electrostatic speaker does, and the magnets rotate.

Result: Mad profit? "Accidental" drone strike to your house?

True Initiate
03-12-2015, 09:43 PM
I was thinking about this last night and I realized... the Schneider process... is backed up exactly by Walter Russell's claims that transmutilation is "easy" with pulsed electrostatic fields and magnetic fields... quartz is piezoelectric and pyroelectric. When heated up, it generates an electric field, but there is no magnetic field.

Don't forget that Gold bearing quartz is always stained with iron. I heartily recommend this short film which shows gold mother load within an actual gold mine (the mother load is shown at 11:30 min):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgHdg3SdcoM

Of course they try to explain why the Gold is always found within quartz veins but they don't mention a word about piezoelectricity or electromagnetism. In fact they use the word somehow as explanation which i find pretty funny.

Or if you type Gold bearing quartz in google photos you will always find the presence of iron in those quartz veins.


I think it could be said that...

Any element(s) + electromagnetism -> Sol


This is exactly what i am researching right now. I am looking at the Gold bearing ore and except Gold and quartz there are rarely other elements mixed in which makes me think that Gold grows out of itself in such a matrix instead of transmutaing lower metals into Gold. Think of chemical garden experiments in chemistry. I think quartz is the mother, iron is the father and electromagnetism is the spirit. I have a feeling that all 3 are required for the manifestation of Gold. I think rather of manifestation out of nothing instead of transmutation in a chemical sense.

crestind
03-12-2015, 10:04 PM
I would agree. In nature iron is probably the only source of any significant magnetism in the form of magnetites and such, and the ground is filled with all sorts of silicates so this mix of substances is likely the main source of sol in nature.

I hate to say it, but I admit the old alchemists are kind of right... metals do "grow" in the dirt. I gets watered and fertilized by magnetism and voltage.

The question is how can we replicate this in a beaker :(

As far as Ghislain's question, I think it might apply to some puffers, but in general people in the olden days did seem to know how to purify Au chemically so when they say they made sol I am inclined in general to believe it's possible. There was even a funny university research paper that had a graph of the multiplication level of the stone and the claimed yields lol.

True Initiate
03-12-2015, 10:16 PM
The question is how can we replicate this in a beaker :(


How about taking crushed quartz, hematite powder (or magnetic black sand that is always found with the Gold in the rivers) and adding 1 gram of Gold mixing all together into a beaker and then applying external electricity. We could also add some electrolyte to this mixture to increase conductivity in the beaker like sodium hydroxide for example and see if the nature increases our 1 gram of Gold to 2 gram. Or instead of a beaker we use old apothecary iron mortar and we manually apply presure on quartz with a pestle.

Salazius
04-02-2015, 06:11 PM
Something is missing in this equation. Where is Iron?

In nature the equation appears to be:

Quartz + Iron = > Gold

I don't desagree with this of course, but gold also appear in other conditions than only with "iron + quartz".
My sentence above is not an equation but the succession of maturations of the metals.

Like "childhood => teenagehood" => "adulthood" so to speak. Not "dad + mum = child".

So, Iron, is a bit before copper if we follow the ancient teachings about the metal formations.

Mercury => lead => tin => iron