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Bel Matina
05-08-2015, 08:08 AM
I've been looking for alchemical materials in Arabic for quite some time now, with limited success. If anyone can get me something, I'd be happy to share my translations. I'm particularly interested in Geber but anything's good.

JDP
05-08-2015, 10:53 AM
I've been looking for alchemical materials in Arabic for quite some time now, with limited success. If anyone can get me something, I'd be happy to share my translations. I'm particularly interested in Geber but anything's good.

I suppose that you mean the genuine "Geber" (i.e. Jabir ibn Hayyan), not the 13th century Latin author/s who took up his name and wrote 5 Latin treatises (all these have been translated into English already), the most famous one being the "Summa Perfectionis".

There's very little Jabir material translated into English. There is an incomplete published English translation of his "Book of Stones". There is a published English translation of a short Jabirian text "On the Properties of the Elixir of Gold". There is a somewhat faulty and not totally complete English translation of Jabir's "Book of the Discovery of Secrets" (I had this text translated into English by my own personal Arabic translator, who produced a more complete rendering than Steele's old 19th century translation.) There is also an unpublished English translation of Jabir's "Book of the Element of Foundation" (this was part of a university thesis by Zirnis.)

If you can read French: Berthelot, Houdas, Corbin and Lory have translated about a dozen of his texts into that language (except the "Book of the Seventy", which Lory did not finish translating, he only translated like 10 or so chapters from it.)

What translations do you have to share/exchange?

True Initiate
05-08-2015, 12:08 PM
Julius Ruska was a famous german translator of Arabic alchemical texts. Those are his works:
http://julius.ruska.de/frame.html

Bel Matina
05-08-2015, 02:13 PM
I'm looking for the primary language, or at least the most primary available. Thanks, though.

Ilos
05-08-2015, 03:05 PM
Hey Bel Matina
Go to archive.org and there you can search for books, look for something arabian, like for example arabian medicine or write the name of the arabian author than a bunch of links with full of random texts will apear, that might seem confusing but you look on the right side of the page, the collection section click on any of the lights there and check if you find anything writen in arabin.

Here this link directs you to a book which I think its a mixture of some arabian physicians. It is also in latin and arabic.
Trois traitÚs d'anatomie arabes par Muhammad ibn Zakariyya al-Razi, 'Ali ibn al-'Abbas, et 'Ali ibn Sina; text inÚdit de deux traitÚs. Traduction de P. de Koning (https://archive.org/details/troistraitsdan00rzabuoft)

Bel Matina
05-08-2015, 03:48 PM
I'm getting similar results as I've gotten with search engines - it's fairly easy to find early modern translations into European languages, but the source material is absent. The old translations are good enough for most European curiosity, and interest in the topic seems to have been stamped out or driven underground in the Arab world at some point - it's hard to pin down exactly when. In any case, while the materials exist in some libraries, they don't seem to have been digitized in any format and put on the internet. Unless someone has PDFs already available to them, some footwork may be required.

Ilos
05-08-2015, 04:57 PM
It depends on what your looking for, some are hard to find and some have already been translated, the older the manuscript the less you will find it on the internet, that is the original manuscripts.
Not all libraries allow the actual original peace to be scanned.
Lets not talk about the Vatican's secret archives, who knows what they might withhold.
Here is another website it has a modest library of the original manuscripts of the Arab world.
http://www.library.yale.edu/ysimg/img_med_mss.htm

Ghislain
05-08-2015, 07:56 PM
This may be a bit of a long winded way to go, but you can look at some Alchemical text in Arabic in Google Images then visit the pages and see what they have.

You may get lucky.

original alchemical text in Arabic (https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=original+alchemical+text+in+arabic&biw=1920&bih=973&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=ehNNVcvFK8eP7AbQhYLgDg&ved=0CFEQsAQ&dpr=1) Google Images.

Ghislain

JDP
05-08-2015, 09:15 PM
I'm looking for the primary language, or at least the most primary available. Thanks, though.

Oh, so what you are looking for is scans of Arabic alchemical manuscript texts. Heck, I got a whole bunch of those too. I got scans of Arabic alchemical texts by Agathodaimon, Zosimos, Asfidus, Aras Al-Hakim, Khalid ibn Yazzid, Jabir ibn Hayyan, Ibn Umail, Al-Majriti, Al-Marrakushi, Al-Muhtar, Al-Iraqi, etc. I have been collecting them for years from a bunch of different libraries (British Library, National Library of France, Gotha Library, Cairo National Library, Suleymaniye Library, etc.) I would definitely be willing to share some of these copies at no cost (most of these copies of Arabic manuscripts are not freely available anywhere, you need to purchase copies of them from the libraries that house these manuscripts, and they are usually EXPENSIVE, and sometimes getting some libraries to actually copy these manuscripts is a royal pain in the neck! For the manuscripts in Turkish libraries I sometimes had to actually hire a Turkish translator so that I could communicate with the staff because none of them spoke any English; other libraries ask you all sorts of impertinent questions as to what you intend to do with the copies and so forth. It is not always an easy task to secure copies of manuscripts), the only thing I want in return is a translation of any given text shared (if you understand Arabic, that is.) I got my own Arabic translator, but he still needs to be paid for his work (he doesn't charge much, only $0.02 per word translated; still it starts to get expensive for the longer texts), so if you can do it for free just for an exchange of a copy of any given Arabic alchemical text, then you got yourself a deal!

Bel Matina
05-09-2015, 02:36 AM
Excellent! I'll contact you privately presently.

Hellin Hermetist
05-10-2015, 11:27 PM
Oh, so what you are looking for is scans of Arabic alchemical manuscript texts. Heck, I got a whole bunch of those too. I got scans of Arabic alchemical texts by Agathodaimon, Zosimos, Asfidus, Aras Al-Hakim, Khalid ibn Yazzid, Jabir ibn Hayyan, Ibn Umail, Al-Majriti, Al-Marrakushi, Al-Muhtar, Al-Iraqi, etc.

Has Zosimos written some texts at the Arab language too? Not in ancient Greek only? Or you are referring to another Zosimos?

JDP
05-11-2015, 02:00 AM
Has Zosimos written some texts at the Arab language too? Not in ancient Greek only? Or you are referring to another Zosimos?

It is the same Alexandrian alchemist Zosimos of Panopolis. Some of his writings have only survived in Arabic versions. Some of these texts appear to be wholly authentic compositions by Zosimos that were translated into Arabic, while others are more like composites of several writings by Zosimos that were re-worked into new treatises by some early Arabic alchemists who assumed his identity. In both cases they are highly interesting since the Greek originals have now been "lost" and only survive in these Arabic versions. The same goes for several other originally Greek or Persian texts, like those attributed to Agathodaimon, Ostanes, Plato, Maria, Galen, Heraclius, Aras the Sage, etc. which have only survived in Arabic versions, the original Greek and Persian texts having apparently not survived to our times. The interest that the Arabs had for alchemy since they first became acquainted with the subject during the expansion of Islam into the Near East and North Africa saved many of these texts from complete oblivion.

guthrie
06-01-2015, 08:18 PM
The incomplete "Book of Stones" is published as "Names, Natures and Things" by Syed Nomanul Haq, as volume 158 in the Boston Studies in the Philosophy of Science.