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crestind
12-28-2015, 04:23 AM
Physical Effects
http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2008/17apr_magnetotail/

Biological Effects
http://science.time.com/2013/07/25/how-the-moon-messes-with-your-sleep/

http://news.health.com/2014/08/08/4-strange-ways-the-moon-might-affect-our-bodies/

http://www.permies.com/t/34288/biodynamic/Wood-cutting-moon

http://www.thejump.net/fishingarticles/Great-Moon-Phase-Debate.htm

https://aeon.co/essays/do-the-phases-of-the-moon-affect-human-behaviour

Goal is to gather enough data from all the various effects to understand what is happening, and then make an "as below" scale model with technology so one is no longer dependent on it for alchemical processes.

Kiorionis
12-28-2015, 06:02 AM
Interesting stuuf. However, the 'full' moon is only half of the equation.

I'd be interested in seeing the 'new' side of things.

True Initiate
02-01-2016, 03:32 AM
The terms that stick out for me the most are:

Earth's Magnetic Field Does Strange Things to the Moon

NASA-supported scientists have realized that something does happen every month when the Moon gets a lashing from Earth's magnetic tail, this can have consequences ranging from lunar 'dust storms' to electrostatic discharges.

Our entire planet is enveloped in a bubble of magnetism, which springs from a molten dynamo in Earth's core. Out in space, the solar wind presses against this bubble and stretches it, creating a long "magnetotail" in the downwind direction.

Anyone can tell when the Moon is inside the magnetotail. Just look: "If the Moon is full, it is inside the magnetotail," says Stubbs. "The Moon enters the magnetotail three days before it is full and takes about six days to cross and exit on the other side."

During the crossing, the Moon comes in contact with a gigantic "plasma sheet" of hot charged particles trapped in the tail. The lightest and most mobile of these particles, electrons, pepper the Moon's surface and give the Moon a negative charge.

It is during those six days that strange things can happen.

On the Moon's dayside this effect is counteracted to a degree by sunlight: UV photons knock electrons back off the surface, keeping the build-up of charge at relatively low levels. But on the nightside, in the cold lunar dark, electrons accumulate and voltages can climb to hundreds or thousands of volts.

Arrakis
02-01-2016, 05:52 AM
...so then the moonlight drives all that towards the Earth's surface, and that's when alchemy gets it's role.

zoas23
02-01-2016, 07:28 PM
Interesting stuuf. However, the 'full' moon is only half of the equation.

I'd be interested in seeing the 'new' side of things.

If you see it from an astrological point of view:

Full Luna = the maximum point of Solve. (180 in a zodiacal chart between Sol and Luna)

New Luna = Coagula (0 in a zodiacal chart between Sol and Luna).

Ghislain
02-02-2016, 04:47 AM
Zoas23

Wouldn't a 180 angle put the earth between the sun and the moon?

Ghislain

zoas23
02-02-2016, 06:11 AM
Zoas23

Wouldn't a 180 angle put the earth between the sun and the moon?

Ghislain

Yes and no! :D

I am assuming you don't know much about astrology, but I will explain it in a very easy way and you'll understand it.

I made this drawing:

http://s17.postimg.org/wdawa4b8f/phases.jpg

The first thing you must have in mind is that Western Astrology uses a Geocentric model. Does this mean that the Astrologers ignore that the Earth spins around the Sun and not the other way? No... but our point of view is the point of view we have from the Earth.

Thus let's place the sun in Aries, and the position of the Sun will be our 0...

What happens when the Moon is in 0?

The "dark side" of the moon looks like a full moon.... but, of course, we do not see that side, the side that we get to see is completely dark... thus we see a "New Moon".

What happens when the Moon is in 90?

The moon is in its "crescent" phase... or on its way to becoming a "full moon", but when it reaches 90 (in the zodiac) we see the first quarter... or a the reflection of the sunlight in exactly the half part of the visible moon.

What happens when the Moon is in 180?

This is the full moon....

http://staging.timeanddate.com/gfx/moonphases/pos-full.png

The "dark side" of the moon is completely dark, whilst the visible side of the moon is completely illuminated by the sun.

.... in the grade 181 the moon begins its "decreasing path" on its way to becoming a new moon.

What happens when the Moon is in 270?

We see the third quarter... or half of the visible side of the moon illuminated by the sun.

_______

Thus when you look at an astrological chart you can always know which one is the phase of the moon.

But your question isn't silly... Wouldn't a 180 angle put the earth between the sun and the moon?

Not always, in most cases the answer is NO... but in some cases the answer is YES.

Look at this picture:

http://clivebest.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Moon-inclination.png

The Ecliptic plane of the Earth is the "path" that the Earth uses to surround the Sun. The Orbital plane of the moon has some 5 of difference with the Earth's ecliptic... as if they were two "ovals" that have 2 points of intersection.

So when the Moon is in 180 in the Zodiac AND its orbit also intersects the Ecliptic... you don't have a "new moon", but a complete Moon Eclypse... a total moon Eclypse can only happen when there's a "Full Moon".

A similar situation happens with the moon in 0... if the moon is in that position (remember that our 0 is the position of the Sun) AND the orbit of the moon also intersects the ecliptic, then you have the opposite: a Sun Eclypse... they can ONLY happen when we have a "new moon" (i.e, a Sun Eclypse with a "full moon" would be absolutely impossible).

Thus the answer to your question is: only in special circumstances a 180 means a Moon Eclypse (though NEVER a "New Moon")... but a second factor is involved there, which is the intersection between the orbit of the moon and the Earth's ecliptic. So for an eclypse you need 2 factors... these angles are only ONE of those two factors (the other one is obviously the intersection between the orbit of the moon and the ecliptic of the Earth).

Ghislain
02-02-2016, 09:18 AM
Hi Zoa23,

You are absolutely right, I do not have any knowledge of Astrology, or Astronomy :(

I am still confused as I see 180 as a straight line intersecting a circle through its midpoint, and this midpoint in our case would have to be the center of the earth.

Are you assuming a two dimensional representation when you talk of this being 180?

For as I see it there would always be a degree of variance from this 180 if the moons orbital position did not intersect the earth's ecliptic plane.

http://thealchemyforum.com/Images/Moon-inclination-with%20sun

If it did wouldn't there be an eclipse?

Ghislain

zoas23
02-02-2016, 01:26 PM
Hi Zoa23,

You are absolutely right, I do not have any knowledge of Astrology, or Astronomy :(

I am still confused as I see 180 as a straight line intersecting a circle through its midpoint, and this midpoint in our case would have to be the center of the earth.

Are you assuming a two dimensional representation when you talk of this being 180?

For as I see it there would always be a degree of variance from this 180 if the moons orbital position did not intersect the earth's ecliptic plane.

http://thealchemyforum.com/Images/Moon-inclination-with%20sun

If it did wouldn't there be an eclipse?

Ghislain

Ghislain, yes:

Astrology works with:

a) a Geocentric point of view (this does not mean that the astrologers ignored that the Earth spins aound the sun... the Heliocentric idea can be found in pre-ptolomeic astrological texts, which used a Geocentric model anyway, since "our" interest is to see how the planets are placed in relation to the constellations from the point of view of Earth).

b) A bidimensianal or two dimensional view of the solar system... as if we were seeing it from "above".

So... when it comes to the angle of the moon, our grade 0 is the SUN.

Let's work with a simplified model of the Solar System:
-We are seeing it from above.
-We are going to pretend that the Earth is "transparent"... we are going to fix this issue later.


http://s11.postimg.org/568ferwv7/phases1.jpg

So this is a view from "above"...

When the moon is in the grade 0 the sun will illuminate the side of the moon that we can't see from our planet, thus we see a "new moon". In astrology this is called a "conjunction"

When the moon is either in 90 or 270 grades, we see only 1/2 of the moon illuminatedby the sun... when it is is 90 the moon is "traveling" to become a "full moon".... when the moon it is in 270, the moon is "traveling" to become a "new moon"... whilst 180 is the full moon.

Let's use the Current Zodiacal chart that we have right now:

http://s22.postimg.org/gj41f02kx/phases2.jpg

I wrote the "absolute grades" in the chart... this means that Aries begins in 0, Taurus begins in 30... and so on. This is independent of the Sun and the Moon. They are absolute grades.

The position of the moon is 238 in "absolute grades"...
The position of the sun is 313 in "absolute grades"...

Thus we can calculate:

313 - 238 = 75

Since the moon is on its way to the sun (the planets move counter-clockwise in the zodiac), then the moon is in a position where it's leaving the Third Quarter (which happened when the distance was 90) and "traveling" to become a "New Moon"... which happens when the distance between the sun and the moon is 0 (a conjunction).

But, so far we are using a simplified model of the solar system and we "pretended" that the Eatch is transparent... which is obviously not the case.

So we'll see the same thing from a "side view" instead of seeing it from "above":

http://ottawa-rasc.ca/wiki/images/thumb/a/a6/Hamner_Articles_Moon_orbital_mechanics08.jpg/450px-Hamner_Articles_Moon_orbital_mechanics08.jpg

In the image above 2 lines are important for us:
The Ecliptic: this is the "imaginary line" that the Earth uses to spin around the sun.
The moon orbit (in red in that picture): this is the line that the moon uses to spin around the Earth.
[You can forget about the equator line, since it doesn't matter for eclypses]

Now... look at the following picture... the moon is in 180 (opposed to the sun)... but this 180 opposition can happen when the moon is spinning in different "parts" of its orbit:

http://www.astronomy.ohio-state.edu/~pogge/Ast161/Unit2/Images/lunar.gif

So the Sun and the moon CAN have a 180 opposition and we may not have an Eclypse, simple because the orbit of the moon is in a place where it is far from the ecliptic.

And this other picture will be helpful too:

http://www.tcaa.us/Images/EclipseNodes.jpg

This image shows the two eclypse nodes...
If the moon happens to be placed at 180 from the sun AND the position of the Moon Orbit matches the ecliptic, then you'll have a Moon Eclypse.

Same thing happens if the moon is placed at 0 and the Moon's orbit matches the ecliptic (except that you'll see a Sun eclypse instead of a moon eclypse).

And here's a side view of a "typical" fool moon (180 grades away from the sun in a zodiacal chart, but WITHOUT an eclypse, because the orbit doesn't match the ecliptic... so the earth doesn't "interfere" with the light of the sun that simply illuminates the whole side of the moon that we get to see):

http://s8.postimg.org/or0gpdj51/phases4.jpg

P.D: maybe this is redundant, but to have a moon eclypse you need 2 things happening at once:
1) The moon has to be in opposition to the sun in the zodiac.
2) The moon's orbit has to match the ecliptic of the Earth.

That's why we don't have eclypses every month.

Ghislain
02-02-2016, 03:01 PM
Thanks Zoas23,

Is it fair to say then that a full moon is actually not precisely full if we were to look at it carefully, as the sun would be shining on it at a different angle to our line of sight so you should be able to see a little of the dark side?

Or is this too small to perceive?

Ghislain

zoas23
02-02-2016, 09:48 PM
Thanks Zoas23,
Is it fair to say then that a full moon is actually not precisely full if we were to look at it carefully, as the sun would be shining on it at a different angle to our line of sight so you should be able to see a little of the dark side? Or is this too small to perceive?
Ghislain

The "dark side" of the moon is, by definition, the side of the moon that we do not get to see.
So the answer is obviously "no", you can't see the side that by definition we can't see...

HOWEVER your question makes sense and you are right.

The visible side of the moon and the "dark side" (or "hidden side") of the moon are not equal.
The visible side of the moon is 59% of the moon's surface and, as you've said, the part of the moon that we see depends on the angle of the moon and our location on planet earth.
The "dark side" of "non-visible" side is only a 41% of the surface of the moon... this 41% is the part of the surface of the moon that you can't see from any position of the Earth.
So, yes.... the two sides are not "equal".... and from the Earth we can see more than just a 50% of the moon (we are closer to a 60%.... it's more or less 59%).