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Andro
03-18-2016, 05:27 PM
How much attention/intention do we assign to the spelling, grammar and syntax/phrasing of the messages we post on forums? Or anywhere else, for that matter?

To what extent are we able to put ourselves in the 'shoes' of those who are reading our posts/messages?

How much does it matter to us to write intelligibly and to get our points across in a clear and coherent manner?

Interesting article:

Yes, Turns Out Everyone Really Is Judging Your Typos (http://blog.allpsych.com/yes-turns-out-everyone-really-is-judging-your-typos/)

zoas23
03-18-2016, 09:20 PM
I pay a lot of attention to it in Spanish, whilst in English I know I am often stretching the limits of grammar and I have a tendency to be repetitive as to make things more clear.

Other than that, I often have an excessive use of some words (i.e, "mostly")... whilst some other English words, I always write them with a typo unconsciously (i.e, "avoind" instead of "avoid".. I don't know why I subconsciously keep on adding the "n" there... though it's an issue that it certainly not related to a confusion with my own language -Spanish).

Some days ago I talked to Dev because of his podcasts (we did a Podcast, mostly about art and the Occult)... and then we talked about this famous lingua franca (English) and how in many cases we see a situation in which two persons who don't speak English as their first language are using it to communicate (i.e, Dev and I in that podcast, but you are neither a "natural" English speaker).

Sooooo... I have different standards depending on the situation. If I am reading Spanish from a natural Spanish speaker and I see an attempt to write something that tries to sound very philosophical, but it's a nightmare of typos... I often take it less seriously.

But when I see someone using a second language and making a lot of mistakes, I do not judge them at all because of that (i.e, Salazius doesn't have many typos, but often has an incredibly strange choice of words... but I pay a lot of attention to his posts and I have a lot of respect for him.... and he's one of the most coherent posters, even if his English is not incredibly perfect.... and I don't have any problems with "broken English", which is also the same language I use here on this forum).

The language of the birds manages to survive when we write or read in broken English.

Andro
03-18-2016, 09:44 PM
Personally, I'm 'perfectly' OK with 'less than perfect' grammar/syntax/orthography, especially as I am not a 'native' English speaker myself.

However, some messaging or posting 'styles' just don't 'cut it' for me, because they often tempt the barrier of intelligibility: Words 'glued' together, lack of periods/differentiation between sentences, no paragraphs at all, overuse of texting style abbreviations, vague one-liners --- almost like the person writing doesn't really care if he/she is understood or not.

Awani
03-19-2016, 12:48 AM
u mean when pepl write like this kind of or...

:cool:

Andro
03-19-2016, 07:31 AM
[QUOTE=dev;41086]u mean when pepl write like this kind of or... /QUOTE]

imean when ppl wriet lk this i. shoudof nown lol BTW.whatsyur point??????!!??

Salazius
03-19-2016, 10:59 AM
(i.e, Salazius doesn't have many typos, but often has an incredibly strange choice of words... and he's one of the most coherent posters, even if his English is not incredibly perfect....).

LOL ... "incredibly strange choice of words", really ? What is so strange ?

zoas23
03-19-2016, 08:41 PM
LOL ... "incredibly strange choice of words", really ? What is so strange ?
LOL... We are all quite blind to our own strangeness, but often able to see it in others who are similar. We both speak Latin-based languages (French and Spanish)... so I sometimes see in your posts a "strange" use of the nouns and verbs which doesn't destroy the sense (I never have problems understanding you), but they are often not the nouns or verbs that a native English speaker would have used.

I.e, in the thread created by the person who was having problems "calcinating the honey", you suddenly said "cook the syrup"... which made me think of une crêpe avec un sirop délicieux... and yet your *tips* in that thread were the best ones that the person who was asking received.

Probably it is because we both speak languages that come from the Latin family of languages that I can see in your posts the typical "strange" use of nouns and verbs that we, the "Latin-based language speakers", often use when we write English (I do not see it in my own posts, but that's because I am unconscious of my own "strangeness"... but our writing styles are probably very similar for an English speaker when we write in this modern lingua franca).

Mod Note: Off-Topic ("crêpe avec un sirop délicieux") continued HERE (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthread.php?922-Alchemy-and-Cooking&p=41133#post41133)

Ghislain
03-20-2016, 09:55 AM
I don't see a problem, I'm a native English speaker and you lot have far better grammar than I.

You can pull that last sentence apart if you like ;)

Ghislain

Andro
05-31-2016, 11:35 PM
A simple request:

Please respect yourselves and other readers by paying just a little more attention to your spelling and syntax.

I don't think I'm being unnecessarily 'picky', but some posts are SO filled with typos and lack or punctuation (or over-punctuation), that it often makes them (at least for me) quite challenging to read and comprehend the intended line of thought.

Some tips:

-Double-check your spelling before submitting a post.
-Capitalize the first letter of every sentence and finish sentences with a period/dot.
-Insert a space between the period finishing one sentence and the first letter of the following sentence.
-Insert a space after commas
-Use paragraphs.
-Don't be shy to use apostrophes where required. It improves intelligibility.

nut maybe im just oversensitive 2 this coz i dont have a smartphone amd i'm not use to texting style thats why

Kiorionis
06-01-2016, 06:18 AM
nut maybe im just oversensitive 2 this coz i dont have a smartphone amd i'm not use to texting style thats why

No, you're quite right. Spelling, grammar, etc, shows off your intelligence.
We're artists; not only of matter, but of language. The two are one and the same.

Awani
06-01-2016, 09:01 AM
nut maybe im just oversensitive 2 this coz i dont have a smartphone amd i'm not use to texting style thats why

More than 50% of my posts are done on an iPhone and I think I do all those things you demand (and rightly so). So it is no excuse. Also I always read my post after it has been posted, which often makes me have to click the "edit" button and correct my mistakes.

Edit: I had to correct this post after it was posted due to writing "Sp" instead of "So".

:cool:

Awani
06-01-2016, 09:06 AM
Also I must admit that I tend to read sloppily written posts in a sloppy way, so if someone wants to be heard fully write your posts "fully". ;)

:cool:

Andro
06-01-2016, 09:12 AM
More than 50% of my posts are done on an iPhone and I think I do all those things you demand (and rightly so). So it is no excuse. Also I always read my post after it has been posted, which often makes me have to click the "edit" button and correct my mistakes.

Edit: I had to correct this post after it was posted due to writing "Sp" instead of "So".

Agreed. The phone is not to blame, it's the mentality/attitude.

If I continue to see posts that are bordering on grammatically unintelligible, I just might soft delete them and you'll have to write them again, this time with PROPER spelling, grammar, syntax, etc...

Nobody is expecting anyone to write 'perfectly', but at least RESPECT YOURSELVES and type in a way that you and others can actually follow without trying to figure out what a misspelled word means or where phrases begin and end (for example).

Also consider this well, please:


Also I must admit that I tend to read sloppily written posts in a sloppy way, so if someone wants to be heard fully write your posts "fully".

Awani
06-01-2016, 09:16 AM
If I continue to see posts that are bordering on grammatically unintelligible, I just might soft delete them and you'll have to write them again, this time with PROPER spelling, grammar, syntax, etc...

Good idea. The final solution ;)

And if English is not a language you are skilled in you can still use capital letter at the start of a sentence and punctuation at the end, because those things are universal.

Although current active users have not shown a lack in English skill, so no excuse there either. He he.

:cool:

Andro
06-01-2016, 09:57 AM
Note: An Amendment has been added to our Rules & Guidelines (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/announcement.php?a=3), regarding posting intelligibility.

Please observe this 'amendment' if you enjoy interacting here and if you want others to enjoy your contributions as well.

Thanks!

elixirmixer
06-09-2016, 01:52 PM
While I agree, that good writing makes for a better read, are we being a little judgmental here on some of the points used against our forum guests. For example, I was in gifted and talented education at school, while simultaneously being in remedial English for my poor spelling skills. Not everyone can master everything.

However, being the mediators, as you are, I can imagine you guys being much more susceptible to the frustrations of poorly constructed posts, after all, you guys probably do read ALL of them...

Please let me give you some examples of why it shouldn't be too frowned upon.

1: my phone, and for the next month until I build my new computer, is actually even smaller and shutter than an iPhone, you'll notice that it just decided for no reason at all to changed the word 'shitter' to 'shutter'. The effort it takes for me to shrink the screen down, drag back up through the text box, zoom back in again, fumble around trying to get the text bar into the right position (grow another Grey hair in the process ) and then zoom out, re-scroll back down... you see where I'm going with this point.. alot of effort for little return.

And then there also are the general life circumstances that lead to poor grammer. I want to get my post done quickly so I can attend to a nagging wife or crying baby.

Sometimes I'm excited and on a rave, and lose all interest in grammer, for want of greater gifts like knowledge and self expression.

I was just typing away to zoas 'help my friend's thread, which seemed quite urgent, and so through my hastiness, I made many errors.

But if you just blur over these poorly constructed posts, or set high standards of linguistic acumen, then you might miss something important or useful just because you were focused on less important things like "this guy doesn't expect himself because he doesn't take the ridiculous amount of time required to create a near perfect post". Which IMO just doesn't make dance HOWEVER I do acknowledge that a large portion of the world's population do take spelling and hammer quite seriously, yet I would just like to remind that there is the other portion, for which this does not come so naturally.

Just saying... perhaps against my best interests.
#MESSINGWITHMODS

Kiorionis
06-09-2016, 02:06 PM
I see where you're coming from, elixirmixer, but the intention isn't just perfection and haughtiness (kidding :) ). While this is an English language forum some of our members are not native English speakers, and any grammatical or spelling errors, or jargoned syntax, are easily misinterpreted -- which in the past has lead to miscommunication and sometimes arguments.

Given the fact that our area of study is already subject to numerous interpretations, it's nice to keep things as clear and concise as possible.

Personally, I understand most typos rather well and am able to ignore them. Not so much for someone speaking English as a second or even third language.

Andro
06-09-2016, 07:52 PM
#MESSINGWITHMODS

Mods come and go. Don't 'mess' with anyone. It might be seen as trolling.

Mods have better things to do with their lives than cleaning up posts every day and splitting threads gone off-topic. And it's all done on a voluntary basis.

So please (everyone) stay on topic, think of other readers as well and compose your posts as clearly as you can and in the most grammatically intelligible and coherent manner you are truly capable of.


"this guy doesn't expect himself because he doesn't take the ridiculous amount of time required to create a near perfect post"

Doesn't 'expect' himself? 'Ridiculous' amount of time?

Anyway, to wrap things up: The request to post as intelligibly as possible (grammar, spelling, syntax, etc) is an administrative decision and is therefore not up for debate. (in this case further debate)

See Rules & Guidelines (http://forum.alchemyforums.com/announcement.php?f=2&a=3) and please consider we are all guests here.

Awani
06-09-2016, 09:06 PM
...is an administrative decision and is therefore not up for debate. (in this case further debate)

Thank you. I'll make this a "sticky" thread.

Thread closed.

:cool: