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Awani
06-17-2016, 09:57 PM
Just started reading People of the Ucayali by Eakin, Lauriault and Boonstra. A book that describe the culture of the Shipibo-Conibo people...

Two things instantly caught my eye. First is this:


Most Shipibo today speak of man's soul (caya) as being his heart during life and as going to God (or the gods) upon death...another non corporeal entity is man's shadow (bei), a spirit which accompanies man until death. After death this spirit, now called the death-spirit (mahua yoshin), assumes a wandering existence... The Shipibo also recognize one or two spirits which reside in the eye (bero-yoshin). These also apparently leave the body upon death.

And then this, which I really love:


...many of a person's possessions are destroyed at his death...house was burned... bow and arrows, canoe, and clothing are... burned or thrown into the river... when a woman dies... pottery made by her is broken; her clothes, pieces of cloth she wove, and even her weaving equipment are thrown out or burned...

This sync with the Gnostic text The Gospel of Philip which states:

"Those who are heirs to the dead are themselves dead, and they inherit the dead."

I think it is a beautiful concept to not only burn the body, but also everything that person ever made or owned. As if the dead is forever gone, wiped out. Instead of this hording of tombstones and memorabilia and crap.

Cycle of life in all its glory!

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h18/deviadah/forum/11b753ab5dc3600b2ca3e0ef8461fc8c_zpszkvjxzew.jpg (http://www.naturalbornalchemist.com/no-possessions/)

:cool:

Kiorionis
03-16-2017, 12:36 AM
I have mixed feelings about this. On one side, I agree that letting go of a 'personality' is a great way to move on for both parties.

On the other side, I feel that keeping a genuine created thing from a 'personality' -- especially if they're a relative -- is a good way to connect with ancestry.


Curious things :)

Aham
03-16-2017, 02:40 AM
I think it is a beautiful concept to not only burn the body, but also everything that person ever made or owned. As if the dead is forever gone, wiped out. Instead of this hording of tombstones and memorabilia and crap.


You're in luck!!! We're already living this way... The US government will take everything away from the dead in the form of estate taxes :D I would venture to guess that most governments are similar.

Awani
03-16-2017, 07:08 AM
LOL. Not really. We still cling to material crap.

No thing has any value. The reason we have so many issues and conflict is because we cling to crap. When a person dies, that persons things die as well.

We are born thanks to the flames of passion. And we dissolve in fire at the end of life. Perfection.

:cool:

Quarrox
03-16-2017, 05:59 PM
This sync with the Gnostic text The Gospel of Philip which states:

"Those who are heirs to the dead are themselves dead, and they inherit the dead."

I think it is a beautiful concept to not only burn the body, but also everything that person ever made or owned. As if the dead is forever gone, wiped out. Instead of this hording of tombstones and memorabilia and crap.

Cycle of life in all its glory!


:cool:

This is it! Since several years, i wanted to be burned in my backyard the same day i die, maybe of a cottage, somewhere outside in nature. Why not do it soundly and rigorous like the people of the Ucayali. If everything material is destroyed, then there is nothing material to adhere after death (except other people or habits / unfulfilled desires).

Andro
03-16-2017, 06:49 PM
Why not do it soundly and rigorous like the people of the Ucayali.

Or like the Vikings...

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/FQJOs8rm6xM/hqdefault.jpg

https://www.historyanswers.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/xtumblr_mzcyw3ihGw1ststkmo3_500.gif.pagespeed.ic.r _CXpQibHe.jpg

Awani
03-16-2017, 10:31 PM
This is it! Since several years, i wanted to be burned in my backyard the same day i die, maybe of a cottage, somewhere outside in nature. Why not do it soundly and rigorous like the people of the Ucayali. If everything material is destroyed, then there is nothing material to adhere after death (except other people or habits / unfulfilled desires).

What is interesting is that in recent times the only thing they don't burn is if they have a chainsaw or some other piece of "modern" equipment, because it is so very expensive for them to get those things. So it gets passed down. Basically, to me, this is a perfect symbol of the main problem with Western Culture. This fucking hording of "wealth". As soon as cultures who live in a relatively pure way touch our poison it infects them. It's a shame.

Normally everything they own (all tools, instruments, pottery, clothes) is stuff they have MADE THEMSELVES. It is a perfect ecosystem.

I understand that technological advancement is good, and I support such things... but it is a double edged sword.

Inheritance is evil.

When everything you own is what you have made each new person born has to start from scratch and MAKE his/her LIFE. But we lazy cunts in the West, we just collect as much garbage as possible and pass it on to our kids... and the more the kids get the less they understand of "making it" on their own. That is why in the RICH countries we now have generations of people who are weak, passive, lazy, over sensitive morons. :)

:cool:

Andro
03-16-2017, 11:12 PM
That is why in the RICH countries we now have [...] people who are weak, passive, lazy, over sensitive morons.

Along with strong, hyperactive, insensitive, emotionally damaged, backstabbing and predatory psychopaths.

Awani
03-17-2017, 12:30 AM
Along with strong, hyperactive, insensitive, emotionally damaged, backstabbing and predatory psychopaths.

Yes, that leave large inheritances to their offspring.

Although this type you mention are more rare, at least as far as I have not met any that have ALL those traits... but the list I mentioned, well I meet those daily. But it is actually fine with me that these people exist. It would be strange if they did not exist. Cause and effect after all. I think the cure is to stop inheritance. This is part of the Way.

Like this: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/music/rockandpopmusic/10917900/Sting-my-children-wont-inherit-my-wealth.html

:cool:

Aham
03-17-2017, 02:47 AM
Does this concept only apply to people or would you include trusts, corporations, etc? Would we have countries, states, cities or do they have a shelf-life as well? :)

Awani
03-17-2017, 06:38 AM
Does this concept only apply to people or would you include trusts, corporations, etc? Would we have countries, states, cities or do they have a shelf-life as well? :)

That is good idea. Why not?

:cool:

zoas23
03-17-2017, 07:28 AM
Just started reading People of the Ucayali by Eakin, Lauriault and Boonstra. A book that describe the culture of the Shipibo-Conibo people...

(...)

And then this, which I really love:


...many of a person's possessions are destroyed at his death...house was burned... bow and arrows, canoe, and clothing are... burned or thrown into the river... when a woman dies... pottery made by her is broken; her clothes, pieces of cloth she wove, and even her weaving equipment are thrown out or burned...

Are you sure that it's the RIGHT interpretation?

I mean it because there are lots of culture that do similar things, but the SENSE is quite different. I.e, quite often it is the idea of giving the person some things to take to the afterlife rather than "destroying" something.

Awani
03-17-2017, 10:03 AM
The Egyptians buried the dead with the stuff to take with... and maybe you are right... however this group of people of the Ucayali are in relationship with Ayahuasca. So they would "know" that there is no reason to bring a bow and arrow.

Also even if valuable, if they wanted to bring stuff with them to the other side, then why not burn the chainsaw? The Egyptians brought gold even. Basically it does not fit, I don't think-

So I am pretty sure. :) And even if I am wrong it does not matter.

I still support the concept that I put forth.

:cool:

Quarrox
03-17-2017, 02:19 PM
In matters of the destruction of the body: The old Zoroastrians had "towers of silence". Those were places, where they exposed the corpses of the dead to scavenging birds, in order to prevent contact between the cadaver and earth as well as fire (which were considered sacred).

A very sustainable way to get rid of biological waste matter and feed other creatures. An optimal system.