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elixirmixer
10-13-2016, 05:50 AM
Has anyone made a Spagyrics from Shrooms? (I'm looking at you Dev ;) )

I tried creating one from the reshi mushroom... i did try a new method and im not sure if it was because of this slight variation, but it did not work as well as usual... either because of a slightly different method which i dont think is the case, im just thinking and wondering..

Does the spagyrics process need modifications when working with fungi???

Awani
10-13-2016, 09:27 AM
You know my feeling on doing this, or making any elixir from Iboga root or Ayahuasca, is that it is only "weakening" the plant. They are already in their "finished" state. Especially Shrooms and Iboga root. Just open your mouth and eat, and eat a lot.

I think the biggest problem with psychedelics is that people take small doses, or making "other" things from them. The gold is already there distilled and fermented and coagulated by the organic laboratory of Nature. Only Ayahuasca needs to be "combined" really... and the most potent is Iboga and that is already complete as is, which means that Nature can cook up the best and most powerful "product" just fine without help from monkeys with glassware.

So I haven't done any spagyrics or elixir or anything from any psychedelic, nor would I ever waste my time doing that. ;)

But I am not opposed the idea, in that I think people can do what they want... although I strongly suggest that - rather than doing spagyrics/elixirs of these plants - they should just EAT or DRINK them... but it can be scary and maybe that is why there is a need to water it down.

Cannabis sounds like the best candidate for such things... although even here it is better to just eat a lot of it. I think that is still superior.

:cool:

Andro
10-13-2016, 09:38 AM
it can be scary and maybe that is why there is a need to water it down.

I would say it's rather a general process of 'watering up'. And by 'water', I mean the generous available content of Radical Humidity in FRESH Shrooms. I mean, see when/how they grow...

Who knows what can happen if you 'cook' them in their own 'water' :cool: ...


----------------------------------------------------------

Awani
10-13-2016, 09:55 AM
There are plenty of people who have dabbled in all sorts of ways with these substances. Combining, re-shaping, synthesizing, extracting, boiling, distilling... and it is not like these people haven't looked at all these experiments with alchemical minds. In the psychedelic scientific community alchemy is not an unknown art.

If there was anything useful in doing elixirs or spagyrics from these plants we would already know of it. But I am not saying don't do it. I am just saying: why bother when all you need to do is put your faith in the Lord! ;)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h18/deviadah/forum/shroom-christ_zpshdl1geoe.jpg

Allegory: you can make a vibrating super-enhanced dildo with built-in strobe lights, but ask any straight women (or passive gay guys) and they will tell you such a device can never replace a real organic throbbing cock of the highest quality. So I say (as those people would): open your mouth and swallow

:cool:

zoas23
10-13-2016, 10:15 AM
What Dev said makes sense.

So maybe the question can be: which one would be the SENSE of this Elixir of mushrooms?

If the sense is to enhance the "psychedelic effect", then it's not really something that needs to be "enhanced"... they work perfectly well as they are.

Though maybe you want to give the Elixir a different sense (indeed, you may not even be interested in the "psychedelic side" of it at all... and looking for something else). Which one would be the purpose of the Elixir/Stone/Etc?

Andro
10-13-2016, 10:18 AM
In the psychedelic scientific community alchemy is not an unknown art.

Maybe known of or heard of. Alchemy in general is an art/science that very few KNOW.


Allegory: you can make a vibrating super-enhanced dildo with built-in strobe lights, but ask any straight women (or passive gay guys) and they will tell you such a device can never replace a real organic throbbing cock of the highest quality.

This allegory is invalid and shows how little is really understood of Alchemy. It's not about 'replacing' the natural 'product' (the 'organic cock') with a fake/manufactured one (fancy 'dildo'), but rather about 'an improving of nature'. We start with the central nature of things and go from there.

Many are probably aware of the saying that "the work of the Alchemist starts where nature cannot go any further".

However, from what I have witnessed (since I don't use myself), the shrooms by themselves certainly already offer an experience without any alchemical improvement.

Awani
10-13-2016, 10:22 AM
Alchemy ends when complete seriosity begins.

As for the rest I agree to disagree.

:cool:

Andro
10-13-2016, 11:14 AM
Alchemy ends when complete seriosity begins.

Seriousness is not the same as attachment.

One can be 'serious' (pure focus/intention) in a detached and lighthearted manner.

I would say that excessive attachment is what can indeed be detrimental to Alchemy.


As for the rest I agree to disagree.

'Agreeing' and 'disagreeing' apply to the circumference/periphery/"The Ten Thousand Things".

The Center/Dao is not subject to such.

The forms that Nature assumes (such as shrooms, etc) appear to the senses on the circumference.

Except for convenience, it doesn't really matter that much where we start 'digging' to approach the Center of Nature.

Back on topic, I am merely suggesting that, considering their birth, shrooms may contain good and readily available shovels within themselves, for this 'digging' endeavor :)

zoas23
10-13-2016, 11:17 AM
However, from what I have witnessed (since I don't use myself), the shrooms by themselves certainly already offer an experience without any alchemical improvement.

I don't like to use psychedelics myself either (I used to like it when I was 16 to 18 years old)... nowadays, I'm simply not interested in them for me, but I understand that they can be VERY valuable to others (I completely get why Dev likes them and that's fine for me).

I agree with your ideas here... and having used psychedelics myself (something that included mushrooms of many different types) in the past, I don't really see any need of "improving" or "enhancing" the effect.

A better metaphor would be that it's like wanting to commit suicide with a 45 caliber gun aiming at your head (which will blow your brain all over the room) and trying to "improve" the suicide by using a bazooka. You won't get a different result. Thus my question of which one would be the sense of this Stone/Elixir/etc???

If the sense if to make the shrooms "even more psychedelic", then that's for sure a waste of time... if there is a second intention, then it can be interesting, but I ask myself which one can be this second intention (???).

Andro
10-13-2016, 11:19 AM
If the sense is to make the shrooms "even more psychedelic"

It is not for the purpose of making them "even more psychedelic".

Awani
10-13-2016, 11:33 AM
I think spagyrics with other powerful non-psychedelic mushrooms would be a more valid path (valid as in possibility of success).


...readily available shovels within themselves, for this 'digging' endeavor...

Psychedelic mushrooms do have these shovels for sure, without the need to do anything with them other than chew well.


Seriousness is not the same as attachment.

Whatever "is" = attachment. So I agree to disagree, again... without any regard for circumference... because if this aspect has to be taken into account then it makes the very act of even being present here in the forums irrelevant (or even opening my mouth to express any "words"). The "center" only exist where there is solitude and silence. As I see it.

And I certainly disagree that "natural" psychedelics appear at the circumference... they might start there, but if a proper strong dose is ingested you will find yourself at the center in a few moments. But just because you take psychedelics doesn't mean you will end up there... and when you do you might not want to take it ever again. LOL!

Smoke-able DMT is "man-made" and IMO much weaker than for instance "nature-made" Iboga, which is not called Holy Wood by accident. ;)

Shroom Stone (as this thread is called)... in a sense The Stone is the Shroom. Done deal.

:cool:

Andro
10-13-2016, 11:41 AM
Psychedelic mushrooms do have these shovels for sure, as they are.

I am not contesting this. However, such 'shovels' can be improved to 'dig' even deeper with the help of Alchemy.

Andro
10-13-2016, 11:43 AM
Does the spagyrics process need modifications when working with fungi?

Personally, I would suggest an approach that is different from what is generally defined as 'spagyrics'.

For one, I would avoid calcination of the matter in common fire/heat, but rather let it be 'calcined' in its own good water.

zoas23
10-13-2016, 11:48 AM
It is not for the purpose of making them "even more psychedelic".

O.K... that's the sense of my question.

If the intention is to make a "very psychedelic elixir"... or if the sense is to create "The Stone" in a more traditional sense of the word... or find in them the "Centrum Naturae" as you said and as I understood after reading Ali Puli after you brought that genius to the forum.
You discarded the first intention, so my guess is that the intention could be the second one.

Andro
10-13-2016, 11:49 AM
A better metaphor would be that it's like wanting to commit suicide with a 45 caliber gun aiming at your head (which will blow your brain all over the room) and trying to "improve" the suicide by using a bazooka. You won't get a different result.

Life is independent of birth and death. Using the same metaphor, the 'caliber' & 'firepower' (or 'detonation') will determine the ingress of the catapult, the extent of the trajectory and the quality (orbit) of where the 'next stop' takes place, after the current form/orbit is discarded.

Salazius
10-13-2016, 11:51 AM
Personally

I would avoid calcination of the matter in common fire/heat, but rather let it be 'calcined' in its own good water.

Absolutely, and everybody is missing this point.

Awani
10-13-2016, 11:52 AM
However, such 'shovels' can be improved to 'dig' even deeper with the help of Alchemy.

Theoretically everything is possible, but the only way to improve the psychedelic substance is to improve the "state" of the user. You got to learn to swim before you can surf. Personally I've just managed to stand up, with both feet on the board... before I tumble into the abyss of the intergalactic infinite ocean.

"I admonish thee, whosoever thou art, that desirest to dive into the innermost parts of Nature, if that thou seekest thou findeth not within thee, thou wilt never find it without thee." - Ali Puli ;)

:cool:

Kiorionis
10-13-2016, 11:53 AM
if there is a second intention, then it can be interesting, but I ask myself which one can be this second intention (???).

The most useful second intentions of "processing" mushrooms that I can think of is for better preservation, and to have a "cleaner" burn, so to say.

But when I have mushrooms they never lay around long enough to spoil ha...

Andro
10-13-2016, 12:02 PM
the only way to improve the psychedelic substance is to improve the "state" of the user.

Sure. Which doesn't rule out using an 'improved' tool to improve the state of the user.


"I admonish thee, whosoever thou art, that desirest to dive into the innermost parts of Nature, if that thou seekest thou findeth not within thee, thou wilt never find it without thee." - Ali Puli ;)

Yes, it's always within ourselves that we ultimately dig. Alchemy merely offers us great tools for this.


You got to learn to swim before you can surf.

Indeed.

http://resources.bplondon.org/images/antiinspiration/unfiltered/alchemy.jpg

zoas23
10-13-2016, 12:18 PM
Life is independent of birth and death. Using the same metaphor, the 'caliber' & 'firepower' (or 'detonation') will determine the ingress of the catapult, the extent of the trajectory and the quality (orbit) of where the 'next stop' takes place, after the current form/orbit is discarded.

Yes, my metaphor willingly didn't make sense, it was simply a reductio ad absurdum (i.e, that a magnum 45 and a bazooka will produce the same effect when it comes to blowing anyone's brain all over a room)... the idea that life is independent of birth and death is something I agree with. The metaphor wasn't a demonstration of anything... just a way to express that "improving the psychedelic effect" didn't make sense to me.

Thus my question about the original intention... since "improving the psychedelic effect" isn't an interesting aim, then a second aim can be interesting.
Which reminded me of something I liked a lot and that was written by Salazius:
http://dartigne.blogspot.com.ar/2012/04/lhyle-mysterieuse.html <--- French at Salazius blog
http://salonarcano.com.ar/galeria/contenidos/literatura/ensayos/salazius/tintin/index.html <---- Spanish at my web (translated by a good friend of mine).

(I don't know if an English version exists, but google translate and 2 versions will make the text more or less easy to follow in English... with the clarification that Salazius is playing with two words that sound similar in French "Hyle" and "Island" -"Óle" in French).

It would be interesting, at least for me, if this thread sails to Salazius' "island"... though I am checking if that's the intention.

Andro
10-13-2016, 12:23 PM
Whatever "is" = attachment.

One can only be attached to what isn't (Maya). One cannot be 'attached' to what one already IS.


if this aspect has to be taken into account then it makes the very act of even being present here in the forums irrelevant (or even opening my mouth to express any "words"). The "center" only exist where there is solitude and silence. As I see it.

Yes.


The Stone is the Shroom. Done deal.

The Stone is at the Center of everything, shrooms included. So the above statement is (technically) not incorrect :)

elixirmixer
10-13-2016, 02:24 PM
The most useful second intentions of "processing" mushrooms that I can think of is for better preservation, and to have a "cleaner" burn, so to say.

But when I have mushrooms they never lay around long enough to spoil ha...

Yes this is why I tried to create a tincture of the Reshi mushroom, because of its well reported longevity reports. It contains a molecule not found anywhere else on earth called gandermic acid *i think* which is a type of steroid... what it does, who is to say, but at the very least acts as a signal between cells, aswell as other things no doubt.

In china it was illegal to eat this mushroom, of which the punishment was death, because only the Empiror was permitted to consume the shroom...

I have been shroom havesting and taken them a few times, but always limited my dosage to about 4 - 8 shrroms... while i have seen friends eat them in the handfuls with only intermediatly adverse 'crazy talk' syndrome emitting from there 'supposedly' super in tune vibration...

Shrooms have for the most part made me feel quite good, with random, sudden feelings of complete mental collapse which are both scary and.... well scary... but im a rough rider. been in some dark holes in my time ;)

Just on the topic of shrooms because i probably wont have a chance to post this again, i did, while mushy hunting and finding 3000 golden tops, found 1 very special, metalic royal purple mushroom with nice plump shape, and when underturned, the "spore bits" were of a metalic gold. It was propable the most bizarre and amazing little piece of God's creation i had ever seen. I kept it in a jar for ages but at the growing fear of it being extremely poisonious, and with the fermentation process kicking in, i had to get rid of it.

Nevertheless, purple and gold metallic mushroom... beat that Dev ;)

zoas23
10-13-2016, 02:58 PM
Oh.... I finally get your intentions. I have something on the subject, but I can't share it in public (no secrecy involved, but it's from a publishing house that will sue me if I post it). If you are patient, I will translate the important parts and send them your way.

... Nothing incredibly amazing, but a few useful tips on the subject.

Kiorionis
10-13-2016, 05:24 PM
I'd be interested in that as well, zoas

elixirmixer
10-13-2016, 09:22 PM
Yes, any fungi fun would be much appreciated :)

Awani
10-13-2016, 10:28 PM
One can only be attached to what isn't (Maya). One cannot be 'attached' to what one already IS.

This depends on what the "is" is that you are talking about. Any statement can be flipped. Proves nothing.

:cool:

Andro
10-13-2016, 10:44 PM
Any statement can be flipped.

There are exceptions.


Proves nothing.

Nor is it intended to, even if it would be possible.

Awani
10-13-2016, 10:50 PM
The Stone is at the Center of everything, shrooms included. So the above statement is (technically) not incorrect :)

Well if you put it like that it is incorrect on my part, because that is not what I meant. So what I said was technically incorrect from your perspective.


Nor is it intended to, even if it would be possible.

The reason I wrote "proves nothing", was to prove this "flipped answer/reply" concept (see quote above). Ad infinitum and so on and so forth. For me, personally, there is a fine line between being cryptic knowing and being cryptic and not... and since it is impossible to "know" (unless I am looking at myself, and I always fall in the former category although it often involves the idea that I know that I don't know), which is which I have nothing more to say - which is something to say = flipped etc etc.


Nevertheless, purple and gold metallic mushroom... beat that Dev ;)

Beat how/what? You mean seeing such a specimen in the wild? It does sound like a beauty that you found.

Although the real gold is inside it. ;)


Yes this is why I tried to create a tincture of the Reshi mushroom, because of its well reported longevity reports.

If I would do any tincture or anything with Shrooms then Reshi is the one to go after IMO. I actually have some myself... but didn't make it.

:cool:

elixirmixer
10-13-2016, 11:45 PM
Beat how/what?



Its just an Australian expression meaning 'check this out'




You mean seeing such a specimen in the wild? It does sound like a beauty that you found.



T'was beautiful. One day I will return in the late summer and see if i can find this mushroom again.

Reshi for the win. Actually edible if you grind it up and put a 15% ratio in your coffee. All other ways of attempted consumption have proven to be quite torturous. Its a very very bitter little critter but well worth the pain i think.

elixirmixer
10-13-2016, 11:51 PM
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/192/497808809_4b78a50aaa_b.jpg

Schmuldvich
10-14-2016, 12:09 AM
Reshi for the win. Actually edible if you grind it up and put a 15% ratio in your coffee. All other ways of attempted consumption have proven to be quite torturous. Its a very very bitter little critter but well worth the pain i think.

Those are some wild pictures, elixirmixer! You sure those are reishi though? Every reishi I have ever seen in the wild or in person has looked like this



http://i.imgur.com/qCyz1mU.jpg



Reishi is indeed bitter! My preferred method of consumption is to put powdered reishi into fresh brewed yerba mate. Both tastes compliment each other very well.

Mixing reishi with guayusa is another one of my go-to's. Excellent combination!

elixirmixer
10-14-2016, 12:18 AM
Yes yours is indeed the Reshi, these purple bastards are just from a little story i was telling the others. I found a purple one, but would never consume such a thing. Going to use Dev as the guinea pig ;)

Awani
10-14-2016, 11:04 AM
Nice pics... and I get you now regarding Aussie slang. Wasn't aware. ;)

:cool:

elixirmixer
10-22-2016, 11:03 AM
Just because i can... : My Salt; about to be mixed with sulfur and mercury.

(It failed in a perfect union) ((Dam fungus))

http://forum.alchemyforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=951&d=1477134192