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Aham
03-15-2017, 02:35 AM
Hi Everyone,

I was wondering if there are others interested in getting an English translation of the book recommended by Green Lion



Finally, it exists a very rare manuscript writes by Naxagoras which is a theoretical and practical analysis of the Golden Chain of Homer". There is a French handwritten version in the library of the University of Glasgow there.

I don't know anyone that can translate this book so looking for your connections that do this type of work in a professional manner. Obviously I'm willing to pay but would prefer to crowd fund if possible.

TIA

Kiorionis
03-15-2017, 03:09 AM
I would be interested, though I'm quite a ways away from Glasgow.

theFool
03-15-2017, 11:46 AM
This is interesting for me too.

Illen A. Cluf
03-15-2017, 12:50 PM
I might be interested as well.

This is not his Clavicule de la Philosophie Hermetique is it?

Illen A. Cluf
03-15-2017, 02:18 PM
Is the work you are referring to the abridged version of Experientia Naxagorae secundum Annulos Platonicos et Catenam auream Homeri?

Entitled: La Toison d'Or. Contenant la vraye Concordances des Philosophes, avec les Opérations de l'Art Philosophical

Aham
03-16-2017, 02:15 AM
IAC, based on a different thread in the forum (see below), it's the Experientia Naxagorae secundum Annulos Platonicos et Catenam auream Homeri. Image below:

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e39/helloworld18/Naxagora_zps2nrymmff.png




Here are some works of Naxagoras:
- Alchymia Denvdata Revisa Et Avcta
- Chymischer und alchymistischer particularzeiger
- Experientia Naxagorae, secundum annulos platonicos et Catenam auream Homeri (It is this work which is a comment of the "Golden Chain of Homer")
- Ausführliche Beschreibung der unweit Zwickau in Meissen zu Niederhohendorff und anderer umliegenden Orten gefundene boldischen Sande
- Chymischer oder Alchymistischer Particular Zeiger
- Sancta veritas hermetica, seu, Concordantia philosophorum consistens in sale et sole vel Mercurio et Sulphure
- Aureum vellus oder güldenes Vließ
- Abgetrungende und abgezwungene Urthels-Frage, welche er der gantzen ehrbaren Welt zu einer rechtlichen Erkändtnüs zu Rettung seiner Ehren darlegt und fürträgt
Regrettably, I know no web site which allows to read them.
Furthermore, there is almost no translation …
It would be from the very big interest that somebody can all translate them.

Maybe GL can chime in to confirm.

There are only 8 books listed. It would be amazing if we could all chip in to get one book translated every year.

Illen A. Cluf
03-16-2017, 02:39 AM
IAC, based on a different thread in the forum (see below), it's the Experientia Naxagorae secundum Annulos Platonicos et Catenam auream Homeri. Image below:


Maybe GL can chime in to confirm.

There are only 8 books listed. It would be amazing if we could all chip in to get one book translated every year.

But this is the German edition. I thought you were talking about translating the abridged French version.

Aham
03-16-2017, 02:43 AM
IAC, you're probably right. I think GL first referenced the French version and then referenced the original version. Personally, I can't tell the difference between French and German... They are all Greek to me :)

Here's an embarrassing fun fact - I originally thought that the German version was the Latin version until you mentioned that it was German... LOL.

Kiorionis
03-16-2017, 02:59 AM
You've just confused me, Aham ;)

Aham
03-16-2017, 03:03 AM
hahaha. Mission accomplished. At least we'll save you a trip to Glasgow :)

JDP
03-16-2017, 05:50 AM
IAC, based on a different thread in the forum (see below), it's the Experientia Naxagorae secundum Annulos Platonicos et Catenam auream Homeri. Image below:

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e39/helloworld18/Naxagora_zps2nrymmff.png


Yes, it is.



Here are some works of Naxagoras:
- Alchymia Denvdata Revisa Et Avcta
- Chymischer und alchymistischer particularzeiger
- Experientia Naxagorae, secundum annulos platonicos et Catenam auream Homeri (It is this work which is a comment of the "Golden Chain of Homer")
- Ausführliche Beschreibung der unweit Zwickau in Meissen zu Niederhohendorff und anderer umliegenden Orten gefundene boldischen Sande
- Chymischer oder Alchymistischer Particular Zeiger
- Sancta veritas hermetica, seu, Concordantia philosophorum consistens in sale et sole vel Mercurio et Sulphure
- Aureum vellus oder güldenes Vließ
- Abgetrungende und abgezwungene Urthels-Frage, welche er der gantzen ehrbaren Welt zu einer rechtlichen Erkändtnüs zu Rettung seiner Ehren darlegt und fürträgt
Regrettably, I know no web site which allows to read them.
Furthermore, there is almost no translation …
It would be from the very big interest that somebody can all translate them.

Maybe GL can chime in to confirm.

There are only 8 books listed. It would be amazing if we could all chip in to get one book translated every year.

I have always had my doubts that all the above mentioned texts are really by the same author. I have not been able to examine the Chymischer und alchymistischer particularzeiger and the Chymischer oder Alchymistischer Particular Zeiger, but judging by the titles they could be by the same author of Alchymia Denudata, who was obviously a "chymist" much interested in the topic of "particulars" rather than the Philosophers' Stone.

Regarding Alchymia Denudata, for those who understand French, you will find large portions of it translated into that language in the work by a certain "Geron", entitled Clavicule de la Philosophie Hermétique:

http://www.massanne.com/index.php/2015-01-03-15-40-33/clavicule-de-la-philosophie-herm%C3%A9tique-detail.html

https://books.google.com/books?id=TF5AAAAAcAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=Clavicule+de+la+Philosophie+Herm%C3%A9tique&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi7naL-pdrSAhVH32MKHXAkCVEQ6AEIHzAA#v=onepage&q=Clavicule%20de%20la%20Philosophie%20Herm%C3%A9ti que&f=false

"Geron" freely plagiarized even entire chapters almost verbatim from Alchymia Denudata without giving his source credit. However, he still left quite a significant amount of material from that book without any translation into French. This is where I took matters into my own hands and had many of the missing parts translated into English several years ago. I am probably the only person who has English translations of parts of Alchymia Denudata.

Let me also clarify here what I already said about this book in another thread: it is not really about "alchemy" properly (i.e. making the Stone/Elixir), but mostly about transmutational "chymistry", and therefore it should rather have been called "Chymica Denudata". If you are interested in the subject of obtaining small amounts of gold from silver, small amounts of silver from lead, copper, bismuth, etc., and also in obtaining the alleged "mercuries" and "sulfurs" of metals, through various "chymical" processes, then this is definitely a book that will interest you. Beware, however, that like most of his fellow "chymists" who dealt with transmutation (ex: Eglinus, Kessler, Glauber, Becher, Kunckel, etc.) the author frequently lies through his teeth and inserts phony-baloney processes that lead nowhere but failure. That's why the book should more appropriately have been called "Chymica Semi-Denudata", because it is not free of shenanigans. It would make an interesting psychological study to more deeply explore the reasons why these old "chymists" liked to insert so many lies and exaggerations in their books. Many modern historians and chemists (like Vladimir Karpenko, for example; a very naive fellow) simply (and quite incorrectly) assume that it is because such authors did not know any better or themselves were fooled by such things as "impurities", but anyone who is more familiar with the literature and has more empirical experience in such matters will hardly accept this convenient "explanation" in most cases. These guys were excellent experimenters and were very well aware of what "impurities" are. The real answer is that they did not share our modern "egalitarian" views. Much like the alchemists, wasting the time and money of those whom they considered "unworthy" did not seem to bother these guys one bit either. Who knows how many unwary people they ended up sending to the poor-house with this most bothersome tactic! If there really is a "God", may "He" forgive them for all the trouble and suffering they caused to so many with their farrago of false (the majority) & true (the minority) processes.

Aham
03-17-2017, 02:32 AM
I have always had my doubts that all the above mentioned texts are really by the same author.

Hi JDP, if you have your doubts about these eight books being written by the same author, is it possible that maybe Experientia Naxagorae, secundum annulos platonicos et Catenam auream Homeri is not by the same author as Alchymia Denudata? Based on what GL has said to-date, I get the impression that he is a solid source of info and wouldn't have recommended this book just to mess with us. :)

I do agree that if the author of Alchymia Denudata is known for half-truths then it doesn't make as much sense to translate his books.

JDP
03-17-2017, 04:34 AM
Hi JDP, if you have your doubts about these eight books being written by the same author, is it possible that maybe Experientia Naxagorae, secundum annulos platonicos et Catenam auream Homeri is not by the same author as Alchymia Denudata?

Yes, indeed. I don't think the author of the "Golden Chain" is the same as that of "Alchymia Denudata".


I do agree that if the author of Alchymia Denudata is known for half-truths then it doesn't make as much sense to translate his books.

Most alchemical and chymical works are a "mixed bag": lots of rotten apples and a few good ones thrown in there. Since most texts were composed that way on purpose, there is no other choice but to patiently examine them and try to separate the wheat from the chaff. Unfortunately, this turns out to be a slow, tedious and expensive task. It requires many examinations, comparisons, translations and experiments, all of which cost time & money. Both alchemists and chymists plagued their texts with such "traps" to make it as difficult as possible for the seeker to get to the facts. In their minds, and under the guise of a supposed "Divine gift/permission/blessing/favor", this was a good way of establishing who was "worthy" of knowing such things. Only the most hard-working, persistent, courageous and smart people would finally get to the facts. Unfortunately, with this methodology they also ended up sending a lot of innocent people, whose only "fault" was to also want to find out the truth about this subject, straight to the poor-house.

Aham
03-17-2017, 11:16 PM
Thanks JDP.

Does anyone know of a German to English translator that could help provide an estimate on how much it would cost to translate this book? Looks like we might have 4-5 individuals interested.

TIA

lapisph
03-18-2017, 01:35 AM
Hi!
I have a pdf of Golden Chain of Homer (in english)... I dont know if this pdf is the original, or maybe is another book...
I want to share with you guys and you tell me if is the book that you mentioned...

I´m new in the forum, and i dont know how to share the pdf... Do i have to upload to some "mega" account and give you the link?

Regards

Aham
03-18-2017, 02:32 AM
Hi lapisph,

The book we're interested in translating is a theoretical and practical commentary in German, allegedly written by Naxagoras, on the Golden Chain of Homer. There are however quite a few translations available of the original Golden Chain of Homer available in English and they generally look like the following http://cista.net/share/Aurea%20Catena%20Homeri%20Vol.1.pdf

What we're trying to do is find enough people interested in translating the German commentary into English so we can get another perspective on the Golden Chain of Homer. Hope that helps.

Regards

Kiorionis
03-18-2017, 03:22 AM
in German, allegedly written by Naxagoras, on the Golden Chain of Homer.

Also, the fact that Green Lion is familiar with the text makes me interested in reading it. He is a very knowledgeable and respected alchemist, even if he dosent post here much anymore

;)

lapisph
03-18-2017, 06:17 AM
Hi lapisph,

The book we're interested in translating is a theoretical and practical commentary in German, allegedly written by Naxagoras, on the Golden Chain of Homer. There are however quite a few translations available of the original Golden Chain of Homer available in English and they generally look like the following http://cista.net/share/Aurea%20Catena%20Homeri%20Vol.1.pdf

What we're trying to do is find enough people interested in translating the German commentary into English so we can get another perspective on the Golden Chain of Homer. Hope that helps.

Regards

Oh I see...

Yes, thats the book that I would share...
Sorry, I misunderstood...

Aham
03-29-2017, 02:40 AM
Sorry, I misunderstood...

No worries, lapisph.

Does anyone know of a good German to English translator? I think sam was one (per Andro) but he hasn't logged in a while and Andro suggested in one of his posts that maybe there was a second person but yet to be proven.

Andro, if you're reading this (I'm sure you read every post) what do you think about getting this book translated by the other person you know?

As always, TIA.

Schmuldvich
03-29-2017, 03:21 AM
maybe there was a second person but yet to be proven.
Gunnar Kossatz?

Kiorionis
03-31-2017, 12:02 PM
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