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Aham
03-25-2017, 11:37 PM
I thought it would be interesting for us to share what our labs look like.

I believe we've all seen Axismundi's inverted lab pics :) (which he says show up right side up on his iPad) and ElixirMixer's ummm.... lab parts? Can't tell if his pics were before the hurricane or after... LOL Sorry, EM, I'm having fun at your expense :p

So after weeks of working stuff out with da wife, I have the final pieces of my new lab put together. Here's a pic:

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e39/helloworld18/IMG_6702_zpskack7rgm.jpg

The image is a bit staged as my previous version of the lab didn't look like this but I think the trick will be to keep it looking nice and clean so that it motivates me to do more work in the lab.

My fav lab is on this youtube video but you can only watch the video if you go to youtube.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9w6jbiLY8As

So let’s see your lab pics.

Kiorionis
03-26-2017, 01:43 AM
That's a clean looking setup! Sweet maps too.

I have a table with bottles on it at the moment. Nothing too impressive. Maybe I'll rearrange it and take some photos.

Axismundi000
03-26-2017, 08:59 AM
I will have some more wacky oriented lab pics presently. Your lab jack looks cool but I find them too expensive.

Just seen the video, wonderful stuff, I dream of a lab environment like that. I particularly like the safety aspect shown in many segments, respirator masks for example. Also the whole set up is nice and clean, do you think there are many worthy apprentices going around polishing and cleaning daily?

Aham
03-26-2017, 12:16 PM
Thanks Kiorionis. Yes problem is keeping it looking nice and organized. I purposely didn't take pics of the surrounding area where I have more of the mess :) Need to get shelves to put all this stuff up. Looking forward to your pics.

BTW, I cut out those pics from a 2012 calendar that I bought at a resale shop for $0.25. Have 7 more pics that my wife wants me to frame for her. Yes, love em.

Aham
03-26-2017, 12:38 PM
Hi AM,

Looking forward to the pics. :)

I found my lab jack on eBay. They generally run about $16 in aluminum but take about 3-6 weeks in shipping from Hong Kong or China. I bought a stainless steel version for double the price of the aluminum. I know/hope it will last me a long long time. :)

My guess is the guy in the video probably does most/all of the work himself. In one of his other videos he was making his own glass tubes. :eek:

Given the prevalence of inexpensive organic chemistry sets online and tons of recipe books, I would think that most initiates are probably not be interested in clean-up work. The rationale being, why spend time on cleaning-up someone else's lab when you can act/work like an adept for about $200 (the price of an organic chemistry set)... As always, there are exceptions.

Yes, my dream lab would be a 1500-2000 sq. ft. shed with restaurant style exhaust vents, 400 amp electric line, furnace(s), kilns, welders and a wood fired pizza oven ;)

Finally, my dream lab will have a couple of helpers to clean-up after me.

JDP
03-26-2017, 01:54 PM
Too neat and organized labs are not how alchemical & chymical labs should look like. A true alchemical & chymical lab has to have the sure signs of ongoing activity all over the place, which necessarily implies a certain degree of disorganization and "uncleanliness". These are more like it:

http://ionamiller.weebly.com/uploads/4/7/9/5/4795680/7478935.jpg?683

http://www.alchemywebsite.com/images/engraving_laboratory1698.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/37/7c/a5/377ca5d435c21eadbd172f3483464ed1.jpg

https://www.mauritshuis.nl/-/media/943dd08bbadd4bc69fa435f2d500a7c8.ashx?mh=500&mw=500

https://img.posterlounge.co.uk/images/wbig/poster-an-alchemist-1611-1470846.jpg


http://images.metmuseum.org/CRDImages/dp/web-large/DP826009.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_JmOhe-3opIc/TRQHUJgAU8I/AAAAAAAAAhs/2ZAH_FYJdJM/s1600/explosion.jpg

http://www.avancarga.com/4_interesante/polvora_negra/imagenes/monjealquimista.jpg

Andro
03-26-2017, 03:29 PM
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e39/helloworld18/IMG_6702_zpskack7rgm.jpg

Hi,

What's the 'monstrosity' to the left of the boiling flask? What book is it standing on? And what's to the right of the receiver?

It looks like a pretty basic distillation train, probably 5 liters? What are you distilling with it?

Have you considered to add a more 'classical' alembic to your setup? There are some things you cannot do with 'modern design' glassware.

Axismundi000
03-26-2017, 06:54 PM
This is a fairly cheap dessicator which I got from Cole-Palmer. I have seen glass one for over £100 this one is plastic and less than £50, it has a manual operated vacuum pump built in. So you can put drying agent in with the material and then have a partial pressure inside as well.

http://i67.tinypic.com/f6ofn.jpg

It is definately upright on my iPad so if incorrect orientation my apologies.

Aham
03-27-2017, 12:23 AM
Hi,

What's the 'monstrosity' to the left of the boiling flask? What book is it standing on? And what's to the right of the receiver?

It looks like a pretty basic distillation train, probably 5 liters? What are you distilling with it?

Have you considered to add a more 'classical' alembic to your setup? There are some things you cannot do with 'modern design' glassware.

Hi Andro,

The "monstrosity" is a lamp with old style filament bulbs. It's there to reminds me of an Edison quote about him having learned thousands of ways on how NOT to make a light bulb which then lead him to discover how to actually make a functional light bulb (it lasted 13+ hours). The idea being that I should expect to fail thousands of times :o

The book underneath has been in my family for generations on how to make a secret red sauce, like an elixir... concept seems fake to me so I'm using the book as a stand... :p

Actually 2L flask and 1L receiver. Just messing around and getting ready to try some basic processes from the Golden Chain.

Yes, have thought about buying an alembic but not sure if I'm ready for that just yet. Baby steps.

So, now it's your turn to show and tell. :)

Aham
03-27-2017, 12:31 AM
JDP,

I try to keep my chaos either inside or outside my head... Right now, it's inside my head. When I have internal clarity, the chaos will manifest in the lab :D

I love the pics with the implosions/explosions. Gotta have some excitement. LOL

Aham
03-27-2017, 12:35 AM
It is definately upright on my iPad so if incorrect orientation my apologies.

Hi Axis, I don't know what you did but the pics are right side up. Maybe an OS update from Apple fixed it!!!

BTW, where did you get those stackable shelves/tables? They look awesome and very functional. Please let me know.

TIA

zoas23
03-27-2017, 06:51 AM
Too neat and organized labs are not how alchemical & chymical labs should look like. A true alchemical & chymical lab has to have the sure signs of ongoing activity all over the place, which necessarily implies a certain degree of disorganization and "uncleanliness".

I used to have a Dr. Frankenstein type of lab, but not anymore. I got a long time ago an insane amount of equipment from an Alchemist (who is not my friend, he was threatened by his wife who said "The lab goes away or I do!"... so he offered it in a web similar to eBay for almost nothing and I arrived first). Some of it doesn't even make sense to ME (like a 100 liters borosilicate vessel -huge and pointless to me).

With time and patience I built wooden boxes with polystyrene inside and a thick fabric glued to the polystyrene (I think I can even drop one of them to the floor with a fragile equipment and it won't even have a minor scratch)...

Axis said/asked: "do you think there are many worthy apprentices going around polishing and cleaning daily?".

in my own case such thing WAS a problem... I had so MUCH equipment that it was always "dirty" even if I was not using it (just like the furniture or everything in the house gets "dirty").

This is just an example:

http://s22.postimg.org/pge3nizk1/12286165_10208205789370229_2075903042_n.jpg
http://s22.postimg.org/p66l46kxt/12272984_10208205789730238_1224493484_n.jpg

So my lab is quite "clean" because I ONLY use what I use, the rest is stored... and sometimes there are things going on outside the lab too (I have a circulation going on since some months ago in a hot place in the room where my computer is and it's not in "the lab")... whilst 2 vessels are outside in the balcony.

But I enjoy a lot NOT to have a lab that looks like the pictures you sent. I prefer to have everything stored and use only what I need to use. It is somehow my answer to the question that Axis asked... before the wooden boxes, it was a nightmare to clean everything. Some of the BIG stuff that is not suitable for boxes is in a closed closet... But that's how I like it.

Very nice lab, Aham... I have the weirdest question: Why do you have so many maps? They look truly nice, but my guess is that there is a story behind them and I love stories!

Axismundi000
03-27-2017, 08:06 AM
Hi Axis, I don't know what you did but the pics are right side up. Maybe an OS update from Apple fixed it!!!

BTW, where did you get those stackable shelves/tables? They look awesome and very functional. Please let me know.

TIA

I got them as 'flatpacks' self assembly from a shop called ARGOS but I think you can get similar on-line. One is not so good it has spring steel rods in the pillars and is designed to be wobbly unless fixed to a wall, maybe a more useful feature if you live in an earthquake zone. Once you have enough gear that it can get dusty I just keep the glassware in those padded parcel envelope things in cupboards and draws. It's a very good idea to write on the outside in clear bold print what it contains or you will never find anything. I resist the anal retentive urge to label the cupboards and drawers in the same way by just keeping say 24/40 in one storage place and say the kjeldhal stuff in another. You will gradually accumulate all manner of stuff Aham so localised and labelled is a good idea. It contributes positively to domestic harmony I have found.

zoas23
03-27-2017, 08:43 AM
It's a very good idea to write on the outside in clear bold print what it contains or you will never find anything. I resist the anal retentive urge to label the cupboards and drawers in the same way by just keeping say 24/40 in one storage place and say the kjeldhal stuff in another. You will gradually accumulate all manner of stuff Aham so localised and labelled is a good idea. It contributes positively to domestic harmony I have found.

I completely agree with this idea.
Unless you are a hermit, you usually want to invite friends to your house... and having the equipment properly stored saves you from answering a lot of questions and it also saves you from breaking something in an accident.... and what you are not using does not get dirty.

AND I doubt that anyone needs to use ALL his equipment ALL the time...

And "The lab of Dr. Frankenstein" (as I call it) looks nice for a while, but eventually you get tired of it and I like the word that Axis used: it is more "harmonic" to keep things organized.
As for the labelling things... yes! I write what it contains, the size and the measure of the joints (i.e, "3 liters round flask 24/40")... I write it very big and I often draw it on the outside too (i.e, if a box contains a round vessel, I draw a round vessel)...

Besides from contributing to the "domestic harmony" (I completely agree with the idea), it actually makes it EASIER to work in the lab too... simply because you have there ONLY what you are using, so you don't need to be cautious all the time with the fragile glass equipment that you are NOT using.

It is similar to having a bibliotheque... you probably read your books in your favorite chair or table... but if you have ALL your books on top of the table, it becomes a mess and it's probably less pleasant to read the book you are reading.

JDP
03-27-2017, 02:03 PM
I used to have a Dr. Frankenstein type of lab, but not anymore. I got a long time ago an insane amount of equipment from an Alchemist (who is not my friend, he was threatened by his wife who said "The lab goes away or I do!"... so he offered it in a web similar to eBay for almost nothing and I arrived first). Some of it doesn't even make sense to ME (like a 100 liters borosilicate vessel -huge and pointless to me).

With time and patience I built wooden boxes with polystyrene inside and a thick fabric glued to the polystyrene (I think I can even drop one of them to the floor with a fragile equipment and it won't even have a minor scratch)...

Axis said/asked: "do you think there are many worthy apprentices going around polishing and cleaning daily?".

in my own case such thing WAS a problem... I had so MUCH equipment that it was always "dirty" even if I was not using it (just like the furniture or everything in the house gets "dirty").

This is just an example:

http://s22.postimg.org/pge3nizk1/12286165_10208205789370229_2075903042_n.jpg
http://s22.postimg.org/p66l46kxt/12272984_10208205789730238_1224493484_n.jpg

So my lab is quite "clean" because I ONLY use what I use, the rest is stored... and sometimes there are things going on outside the lab too (I have a circulation going on since some months ago in a hot place in the room where my computer is and it's not in "the lab")... whilst 2 vessels are outside in the balcony.

But I enjoy a lot NOT to have a lab that looks like the pictures you sent. I prefer to have everything stored and use only what I need to use. It is somehow my answer to the question that Axis asked... before the wooden boxes, it was a nightmare to clean everything. Some of the BIG stuff that is not suitable for boxes is in a closed closet... But that's how I like it.

Very nice lab, Aham... I have the weirdest question: Why do you have so many maps? They look truly nice, but my guess is that there is a story behind them and I love stories!

A 100 liter vessel can be quite useful if you have the space to use it.

The point is to keep most of the stuff you need handy & ready for use, and conduct as many experiments as possible. Besides money, investigating this subject also demands a lot of time. Since most of your experiments will end up in failure to achieve any of the desired goals, you will eventually realize that carrying out multiple experiments at a time is a good thing, if you have the space and equipment to do it. Thus why the drawings/paintings of old alchemical/chymical labs look like a "chaos" of all sorts of vessels & furnaces/forges and, in many cases, even assistants going around carrying out all sorts of operations.

zoas23
03-27-2017, 09:28 PM
A 100 liter vessel can be quite useful if you have the space to use it.

The point is to keep most of the stuff you need handy & ready for use, and conduct as many experiments as possible. Besides money, investigating this subject also demands a lot of time. Since most of your experiments will end up in failure to achieve any of the desired goals, you will eventually realize that carrying out multiple experiments at a time is a good thing, if you have the space and equipment to do it. Thus why the drawings/paintings of old alchemical/chymical labs look like a "chaos" of all sorts of vessels & furnaces/forges and, in many cases, even assistants going around carrying out all sorts of operations.

I would need to hire a blacksmith to build a tripod for it first... because it is VERY heavy... I have no idea of what the other alchemist was doing with it.

I often have one MAIN experiment going on and a few side-experiments going on (I blame my lab partner for such thing, his way of thinking is quite similar to yours in this sense).

I do prefer to focus on ONE thing at the time, but your view has its advantages too, so I keep a balance between these two extremes.... though I certainly know that I do not want to return to "Dr. Frankenstein's lab". Even if Axis and I have a tendency to "fight" a lot, this time I agree with him and I totally get what he means.

Andro
03-27-2017, 09:42 PM
Axis and I have a tendency to "fight" a lot

Just don't "fight" in the equipment section - have mercy on all the fragile glassware around here :p

zoas23
03-27-2017, 10:31 PM
Just don't "fight" in the equipment section - have mercy on all the fragile glassware around here :p

LOL... I doubt you'll see any fight here. I often disagree with Axis, but this time we both seem to have arrived to almost IDENTICAL ideas (even if our practice can be quite different, but such thing doesn't matter), but his simple ideas are the same ones I have. I liked how he used the expression "domestic harmony" and I couldn't agree more with that expression.

Aham
03-28-2017, 02:15 AM
Very nice lab, Aham... I have the weirdest question: Why do you have so many maps? They look truly nice, but my guess is that there is a story behind them and I love stories!

Thanks Z :) Here's my dull story... A couple of months ago I had bought a 2012 Italian calendar for $0.25 because of the amazing quality of paper the calendar was printed on. While negotiating the placement of the lab, the goddess of "domestic harmony" expressed her wish to use the pics from the calendar for the lab and also for other parts of the house. So I took the 5 pics I liked and put them in frames to hang over the wall by the lab area and I made 7 more frames with the art deco pics for her to use in other parts of the house.

BTW, I completely agree that even if I have 100% clean equipment, dust will eventually cover the glass and the glass will have to be washed again. Your wooden box with styrofoam is probably too much for me but just styrofoam might do the trick for what I need. I'm definitely going to steal that idea. Thanks.

So, let's see what you lab looks like, inside and outside :)

Aham
03-28-2017, 02:21 AM
I got them as 'flatpacks' self assembly from a shop called ARGOS but I think you can get similar on-line.

Thanks Axis. Will check that out.


You will gradually accumulate all manner of stuff Aham so localised and labelled is a good idea. It contributes positively to domestic harmony I have found.

Yes, 100% agree on labeling and keeping glass in things like padded boxes or envelopes. I'll have to start saving those Amazon 'air pockets' for use in storing my glass.

Thanks again :)

JDP
03-28-2017, 03:22 AM
I would need to hire a blacksmith to build a tripod for it first... because it is VERY heavy... I have no idea of what the other alchemist was doing with it.

I often have one MAIN experiment going on and a few side-experiments going on (I blame my lab partner for such thing, his way of thinking is quite similar to yours in this sense).

I do prefer to focus on ONE thing at the time, but your view has its advantages too, so I keep a balance between these two extremes.... though I certainly know that I do not want to return to "Dr. Frankenstein's lab". Even if Axis and I have a tendency to "fight" a lot, this time I agree with him and I totally get what he means.

Is the 100 liter vessel a distillation flask or something else?

When you start seeing that most of your experiments will come quite short of your expectations and that "hitting the mark" is not as easy as you once imagined, you will learn the value of carrying out more than one experiment at a time in order to more quickly discard erroneous theories/conjectures/suspicions/conclusions and move on to the next ones that might or might not be correct. Time is more precious than money. If I had more working space, I would carry out as many as a dozen experiments at the same time. You will find out the hard way that alchemy is pretty much a time-vampire: it will end up sucking up most of your spare time, and you will wish you had more to spare. Things would be great if you could figure out the secret in just a few trials, but rest assured that just ain't going to happen. You have to "wrest" the secret through your labors, there is no other way. Forget about the fairy tales of "Divine Revelations/Permissions/Gifts/Interventions" and such nonsense concocted by the alchemists to make you waste your time wishing and waiting for things that are just not going to happen even if you lived to be 1000 years old. No little "angel" is magically going to come down from the clouds above while in your sleep and whisper any "formula" for the Stone in your ear. The only way to figure out the alchemical secret is through trial & error and comparisons with/of the true clues/hints given in the old texts. This is a very time-consuming task, though, as it requires for the seeker to gain a lot of empirical experience to be able to recognize/identify the correct reactions, and the substances that enter into play for them to happen.

Kiorionis
03-28-2017, 04:01 AM
At least your neighbors seem chill ;)

zoas23
03-28-2017, 04:31 AM
Is the 100 liter vessel a distillation flask or something else?

It's a flask with 2 mouths which can be used for lots of different things... but it's big in an absurd way for me and thus less "practical" than smaller vessels (i.e, I have several 10 liters and 5 liters flasks and those are the "bigger" ones I use).


When you start seeing that most of your experiments will come quite short of your expectations and that "hitting the mark" is not as easy as you once imagined,

I never imagined that it is easy. I actually think that it's incredibly complicated.
Other than that, so far I've surpassed my expectations...


you will learn the value of carrying out more than one experiment at a time in order to more quickly discard erroneous theories/conjectures/suspicions/conclusions and move on to the next ones that might or might not be correct.

I work with a friend very much as a team. My friend is very much into "Let's do 1,000 experiments" and I am more into "Let's do 1"... so the interaction creates a balance between these two opposites. There's currently 4 experiments going on at my house (with 4 absolutely different paths)... whilst my partner is doing some others at his house.
I also like to experiment with "variations" of the same thing (same method, but with slightly different technical approaches).


Time is more precious than money. If I had more working space, I would carry out as many as a dozen experiments at the same time. You will find out the hard way that alchemy is pretty much a time-vampire: it will end up sucking up most of your spare time, and you will wish you had more to spare.

We have different mentalities, JDP. If one day I find myself in desperation, I will completely give up alchemy. Thankfully such thing has never happened.
Time is more precious than money, that's right. Enjoying what you do is more precious than time.


Things would be great if you could figure out the secret in just a few trials, but rest assured that just ain't going to happen.

Never expected such thing to happen. Due to private conversations with you I understood that our paths are VERY different, though I do not think that it is "easy" at all. Maybe some of the things I've told you lead you to BELIEVE that I think it's easy... I don't!
And take it for granted that I've had hundreds and hundreds of failures in many different ways. Though I simply take it easy and use them to think.


You have to "wrest" the secret through your labors, there is no other way. Forget about the fairy tales of "Divine Revelations/Permissions/Gifts/Interventions" and such nonsense concocted by the alchemists to make you waste your time wishing and waiting for things that are just not going to happen even if you lived to be 1000 years old. No little "angel" is magically going to come down from the clouds above while in your sleep and whisper any "formula" for the Stone in your ear.

O.K... but I never had such idea.
I do BELIEVE in inspiration though... but it only comes after reading and experimenting a lot... and it's not really an "angel" whispering something, but sometimes it's simply an idea that arrives quite naturally. BUT I do not believe in a "let's throw all the books to the trashcan and let's pray to God, because He is the only source of truth". approach.
LOL... I think you believe that I believe in many things that I actually don't believe (and I am not 100% sure if the grammar of this sentence makes sense in English, but I hope that it does!).
But I mostly mean that you are warning me against a lot of things that I already know... I mean that I do not disagree with the general concept that you are expressing here.
Other than that, I am certainly BETTER when I do one thing at the time... but that kind ruffian who is my lab partner won't let me do it (and I apreciate it).


The only way to figure out the alchemical secret is through trial & error and comparisons with/of the true clues/hints given in the old texts.

Absolutely no objections to this statement, JDP.


This is a very time-consuming task, though, as it requires for the seeker to gain a lot of empirical experience to be able to recognize/identify the correct reactions, and the substances that enter into play for them to happen.

O.K... I think you have too many fantasies about how I think and what I believe and how I behave with the alchemical praxis.
Probably if you could visit me and could see what I do, you would be unsurprised and find out that our ways are not really very different.
I am probably more mystical than you are, but such thing doesn't mean what you think it means.
If you believe that I put a piece of lead on the table and pray to God asking "Him" to transmute it, then that's not what I do at all.
If you believe that I do not think that empirical experiences are the best teacher, then you are wrong.
If you believe that I do not think that the alchemical experience should be based in the worthy classics, then you are wrong.
We are not really VERY different in this sense, JDP... even if for some reason you seem to believe that we are.

Other than that, I can confess that I am quite neurotic and I prefer to refine a method when I see some results rather than diversify myself too much (though that's how my mind works... i.e, I read ONE book per time... my girlfriend has a tendency to read some 10 books simultaneously -I would be unable to do such thing-... but give us the same 10 books to the two of us and the time that it takes us to read the 10 of them is the same, even if our approach at reading them can be different).

elixirmixer
03-28-2017, 09:15 AM
Well done Aham!

Much neater than I've ever had my lab...

I imagine that a triple neck 2ltr flask wasn't very cheap.

Avoid playing with cold water near your flask.

Also! Not all glassware is equal, to avoid upsetting any micro-fractures, and cracking your glassware, raise the heat of your flask slowly :)

This may all seem like common sense, but if your starting small and don't have a lot of glassware, or if your in the middle of something epic, the worst case scenario is that your flask breaks :cool: so remember! :)

black
03-28-2017, 10:02 AM
Lab in a wardrobe.

http://i1371.photobucket.com/albums/ag282/blackbecomeswhite/eb075416-3def-4d16-b1bc-36e459f367dc_zps3r5mpiu4.jpg

http://i1371.photobucket.com/albums/ag282/blackbecomeswhite/ff152212-807a-4ee0-b777-e1468f366e0b_zpsmvozebsp.jpg

http://i1371.photobucket.com/albums/ag282/blackbecomeswhite/dc0e1257-7557-4280-9f37-cac832f3b472_zpsu0lljabl.jpg

Sometimes it's hard to keep the neighbors out.

JDP
03-28-2017, 02:10 PM
It's a flask with 2 mouths which can be used for lots of different things... but it's big in an absurd way for me and thus less "practical" than smaller vessels (i.e, I have several 10 liters and 5 liters flasks and those are the "bigger" ones I use).



I never imagined that it is easy. I actually think that it's incredibly complicated.
Other than that, so far I've surpassed my expectations...



I work with a friend very much as a team. My friend is very much into "Let's do 1,000 experiments" and I am more into "Let's do 1"... so the interaction creates a balance between these two opposites. There's currently 4 experiments going on at my house (with 4 absolutely different paths)... whilst my partner is doing some others at his house.
I also like to experiment with "variations" of the same thing (same method, but with slightly different technical approaches).



We have different mentalities, JDP. If one day I find myself in desperation, I will completely give up alchemy. Thankfully such thing has never happened.
Time is more precious than money, that's right. Enjoying what you do is more precious than time.



Never expected such thing to happen. Due to private conversations with you I understood that our paths are VERY different, though I do not think that it is "easy" at all. Maybe some of the things I've told you lead you to BELIEVE that I think it's easy... I don't!
And take it for granted that I've had hundreds and hundreds of failures in many different ways. Though I simply take it easy and use them to think.



O.K... but I never had such idea.
I do BELIEVE in inspiration though... but it only comes after reading and experimenting a lot... and it's not really an "angel" whispering something, but sometimes it's simply an idea that arrives quite naturally. BUT I do not believe in a "let's throw all the books to the trashcan and let's pray to God, because He is the only source of truth". approach.
LOL... I think you believe that I believe in many things that I actually don't believe (and I am not 100% sure if the grammar of this sentence makes sense in English, but I hope that it does!).
But I mostly mean that you are warning me against a lot of things that I already know... I mean that I do not disagree with the general concept that you are expressing here.
Other than that, I am certainly BETTER when I do one thing at the time... but that kind ruffian who is my lab partner won't let me do it (and I apreciate it).



Absolutely no objections to this statement, JDP.



O.K... I think you have too many fantasies about how I think and what I believe and how I behave with the alchemical praxis.
Probably if you could visit me and could see what I do, you would be unsurprised and find out that our ways are not really very different.
I am probably more mystical than you are, but such thing doesn't mean what you think it means.
If you believe that I put a piece of lead on the table and pray to God asking "Him" to transmute it, then that's not what I do at all.
If you believe that I do not think that empirical experiences are the best teacher, then you are wrong.
If you believe that I do not think that the alchemical experience should be based in the worthy classics, then you are wrong.
We are not really VERY different in this sense, JDP... even if for some reason you seem to believe that we are.

Other than that, I can confess that I am quite neurotic and I prefer to refine a method when I see some results rather than diversify myself too much (though that's how my mind works... i.e, I read ONE book per time... my girlfriend has a tendency to read some 10 books simultaneously -I would be unable to do such thing-... but give us the same 10 books to the two of us and the time that it takes us to read the 10 of them is the same, even if our approach at reading them can be different).

That huge two-necked flask would make a very good receiver for large-scale distillations.

My comments regarding the value of time and the necessity of so much empirical experience, experimenting and confronting of repeated failure before being able to reap some success were aimed not necessarily at you specifically, but in general to what many people in this day and age surprisingly still naively believe. It's amazing how well some of the "traps" of the alchemists have worked that people are still falling for them centuries later. We still find people naively "praying", and "meditating", and "wishing", and "concentrating", and what have you except actually experimenting and eliminating dead-ends, thinking that this way the "formula" for the Stone/Elixir will somehow miraculously present itself to them. Keep wishing, kids. It just ain't gonna happen. You might as well keep on "praying/wishing" for the winning lottery numbers. You are all falling for one of the most malicious alchemical gimmicks designed to guarantee your failure in discovering anything, not success.

Malicious alchemist in the open: "Yes, dear seekers, keep on praying and asking God for this knowledge, and leave all the experimenting with all manner of substances to those pesky puffers. If thy heart is good and honest, thou wilt receive this gift, but if thou doth not receive it, then thou art a wicked sinner and should be ashamed of thyself, and never attempt to gain this knowledge again because God simply doesn't want thee to know it. Even if we wrote the whole process clearly for thee, thou would still fail. Accept thy miserable fate and move on to other things, this knowledge is not for thee!"

The same malicious alchemist behind closed doors, where no one can see or hear him: "There you go, I have fooled a bunch of unworthy seekers into a guaranteed failure. Let them keep waiting for some miracle that will never come, tee-hee! As if God had nothing better to do all day than to capriciously decide who can acquire this empirical knowledge LOL! Delusional simpletons, they actually swallowed the bait."

Rest assured that nobody or nothing is going to "magically/miraculously" help you figure this out. The only one who can do it is you, through your actual research and trial & error. In other words, the much maligned "puffers" were on the right track (the very same one the alchemists themselves followed to make their discoveries) but unfortunately the majority of them would either give up too soon after many failures, or would not understand the real clues/hints given in alchemical sources very well and thus never succeed in discovering the secret, or some of the more ingenious and hard-working ones would in fact discover their own methods to make gold and silver that had nothing to do with the Philosophers' Stone (much to the chagrin of the alchemists, who kept stubbornly denying that such a thing was possible.)

pierre
03-28-2017, 02:17 PM
Lab in a wardrobe.

http://i1371.photobucket.com/albums/ag282/blackbecomeswhite/eb075416-3def-4d16-b1bc-36e459f367dc_zps3r5mpiu4.jpg

http://i1371.photobucket.com/albums/ag282/blackbecomeswhite/ff152212-807a-4ee0-b777-e1468f366e0b_zpsmvozebsp.jpg

http://i1371.photobucket.com/albums/ag282/blackbecomeswhite/dc0e1257-7557-4280-9f37-cac832f3b472_zpsu0lljabl.jpg

Sometimes it's hard to keep the neighbors out.

Watch out,, black!!! He take no prsioners and won´t spare no lives!!!! For those about to rock, we salute, Angus...

Aham
03-28-2017, 04:49 PM
Awesome pics, Mr. Black. Very ingenious and an amazing way to hide the work when there are visitors.

I have to ask:
- what are those 2 cylindrical objects on the top left? There also seems to be one on the far right.
- what is that stainless steel container to the left?
- I'm guessing the yellow bucket is a stand?
- How do you use the wooden box with the opening in the middle?
- I see two exhaust fans. Is one pulling in the other pushing out? Tremendous idea, BTW. I now realize I could do something similar.

If the musical preferences are similar, let the neighbors in :cool:

black
03-29-2017, 04:52 AM
Thanks Aham

http://i1371.photobucket.com/albums/ag282/blackbecomeswhite/B_zpsaj0bruul.jpg (http://s1371.photobucket.com/user/blackbecomeswhite/media/B_zpsaj0bruul.jpg.html)

A temp. control for condenser coolant

B temp control for heater F

C temp. control for E

D condenser coolant tank

E temp. box for receiver

F heater

G dryers for condenser

H extraction fans (both out)

I hinged doors with opening ports (to work as fume cabinet)

Yes yellow bucket is a stand.

Aham
03-29-2017, 06:39 PM
Thanks Aham

http://i1371.photobucket.com/albums/ag282/blackbecomeswhite/B_zpsaj0bruul.jpg (http://s1371.photobucket.com/user/blackbecomeswhite/media/B_zpsaj0bruul.jpg.html)

A temp. control for condenser coolant

B temp control for heater F

C temp. control for E

D condenser coolant tank

E temp. box for receiver

F heater

G dryers for condenser

H extraction fans (both out)

I hinged doors with opening ports (to work as fume cabinet)

Yes yellow bucket is a stand.

Mr Black, we *had* lost the pictures :) but now they are back

Hopefully you can indulge a few more questions :)

I've known temp controllers to be fairly tiny (6cm x 3cm x 8cm) but the ones you have are fairly large. Are they special types of controllers?

For the condenser coolant tank, what coolant do you use?

What does a condenser dryer do? I've never heard of such a thing so am more than curious.

I was wondering why the 2nd set of doors were ummm... crafted together :P but yet again, a brilliant idea!!! Dang, you've thought through this.

TIA for your answers

Lux Natura
03-29-2017, 08:51 PM
At this point, my lab is in several places: the garden out front, the whole of the dining rooms (indoor greenhouse, brewing station, chemistry tables), kitchen (various experiments), reading room, broom closet with a heater to keep it around 40 degrees C for incubation experiments. I have more glass jars than I care to say, and nearly every corner of my place is littered with some sort of experiment in progress.

I see the lab as the externalization of the self - and the different lab types reflect on the different belief systems people have. I don't think there is any merit in one type of setup versus another - all that matters is that the mirror that reflects the internal to the external, and vice-versa, is kept clean.

A big part of my lab is the stove - currently running an essential oil distillation of cedar.

http://ibb.co/gpJUyv

black
03-30-2017, 02:10 AM
Hopefully you can indulge a few more questions :)

I've known temp controllers to be fairly tiny (6cm x 3cm x 8cm) but the ones you have are fairly large. Are they special types of controllers?

For the condenser coolant tank, what coolant do you use?

What does a condenser dryer do? I've never heard of such a thing so am more than curious.



I built these controllers about 12 years ago, with large high amp
realays in them. I also use the new small controllers with the
s/s realays, they are fantastic.

The old controllers cost me around $500 each just for parts, the
new ones are $10 to $20 depending on temp or amp level.

Drying tubes are often used with condensers to allow for expansion and
contraction of the gases and to prevent moisture from entering the
sysem. These are vey helpful if you are working with spirits that are
hygroscopic as in ethanol, etc.

Instead of the drying tubes I use 3 connected bottles with concentrated
sulphuric acid as a desiccant.

This condenser coolant is just water with a few drops of bleach, but I
have used methylated spirits, acetone, dry ice, for different types of
condensing.

Aham
03-30-2017, 03:05 AM
Thanks again Mr B.



...the new ones are $10 to $20 depending on temp or amp level


I agree the new ones are awesome and cheap.



Drying tubes are often used with condensers to allow for expansion and contraction of the gases and to prevent moisture from entering the system. These are vey helpful if you are working with spirits that are hygroscopic as in ethanol, etc.

Instead of the drying tubes I use 3 connected bottles with concentrated sulphuric acid as a desiccant


Dumb question - how do you prevent sulphuric acid fumes from entering the system?



This condenser coolant is just water with a few drops of bleach, but I have used methylated spirits, acetone, dry ice, for different types of condensing.


At first I thought that the pics of A, B and C looked like a compressor/chiller and then I was wondering if you were using freon or something similar (R410A) but now I get it.

Thanks again.