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12-25-2017, 07:53 AM
I'm the light. Hypnosis and ascetism seem to have a grand relationship to eachother, both being a manipulation of trance states.
Ascetism is focused more on the self.
Hypnosis usually has someone assisting.
Self hypnosis is hypothetically ascetism.
As such I wish to start a topic on self hypnosis.

The two being relatively the same, western method may assist in delivering quicker results when delving into eastern principles.
Hypnosis itself seems a bit difficult to research. There is much convoluted information.
The idea the a person cannot by hypnotized agienst their will is itself a hypnotic suggestion.

The goal of this thread is not what is and isn't hypnosis.
Hypnosis is obviously manipulation of Trance states.
The goal of this thread is how to utilize known methods in order to increase efficiency of self hypnosis.
To increase efficiency through understanding of western methods.
Self hypnosis is much more difficult than hypnosis of another.
Hypnosis of self through self hypothetically can lead to mastery of self on all aspects of self.
Why? Because in short it is the bypassing of the analytical self an influence of the believing self.
Yet if brought deeper it can hypothetically influence the physiologicy of the self as well.
Arts like avishkara are based off of this.
Anyway. Comments and opinions are highly welcome.

elixirmixer
12-25-2017, 09:43 AM
From what I remember of my early day attempts, one way into a self hypnotic state is to use calm deep breathing and visualise yourself walking down a flight of stairs into your inner cave. With each step you tell yourself you are becoming more and more relaxed until you finally reach a state of inner relaxation and in this state the mind is more suggest able to autosuggestion. "I am a non smoker" for example.

When using self hypnotic techniques it is especially important to speak in the affirmative, and not in the negative, such as 'don't' 'can't 'won't'. Apparently these words do not serve the purposes of the subconscious mind and can have unwanted effects. Statements suggested to the subconscious should be forceful positive commands. I Will Purify Myself, in fact, that last statement reminded me of another important point relative to trance state auto-suggestions which is that the commands should be in the present tense. I AM Purifying Myself. So scratch the last one. Always present tense, so as not to give the subconscious any TIME to mess you around and procrastinate your actions.

Thank you for bringing this up, I might give this a go tonight I hadn't thought about this in a long time. Cheers.

Axismundi000
12-25-2017, 10:27 AM
The basic relaxation technique of: Differential relaxation briefly tensing muscle groups and relaxing them, then comparing the difference in these to the same muscle group on the other side of the body. Doing each pair of muscle groups alternately until when you compare them they are are not different, they are both fully relaxed all nervous ticks etc gone. Once completed suggesting to yourself you are hypnotised and X is the suggestion. Understanding there is no discreet border between hypnotic and fully conscious state and not to be discouraged by a sudden startlement the first few times you enter a hypnotic state.

These are generally things a reputable hypnotherapist will train the client in doing for themselves. The objective being for the client to eventually not require the hypnotherapist because the client can do it fully for themselves.

elixirmixer
12-25-2017, 10:37 AM
I was going to mention that a pre-relaxation workout would assist in the effects. Also an actual physical workout before the relaxation will also greatly increase the depth and speed at which you relax.

Warmheart
12-26-2017, 04:33 AM
According to Eastern teachings, there are 4 states of consciousness, one of which is the defected perception of ordinary men, the other one - is perception in dreams, third one - is perception in mind (crudely speaking, languages of western people have proper words for this), fourth one is totally unknown to western people.

That's if we speak about states of consciousness.

However, whatever is being called as hypnosis in West is simply a lower forms of Mohana practice in the East, it is practice of casting delusion on other people (so they see things which aren't actually there). So, acts of self-hypnosis or "self-Mohana" might lead to nothing else but self-delusion...

When hypnosis is done in order to control people - it is actually totally different series of practices, which captivates person, so he'd do the will of the operator.

Ascetism is a defected Western word, which initially meant "spiritual practice", which in itself is somewhat defected combination of words. There are special highly dangerous and forbidden practices of "ascetism", when you try to combine totally opposite things (like, in example, washing young girls, while being extremely full of lust and... controlling yourself just to push your mind far beyond the insanity) to provoke "explosion" for some specific purposes.

There are also ascetic practices of eating feces and drinking urine, which serve somewhat different goal - recognizing how deluded are everyone in this world, attaching labels on what is "good", what is "bad", what is "disgusting", and that there are actually no such divisions in actual world: recognition through practice, which in itself leads to very interesting things.

So when people start throwing around word "ascetism", I feel very uneasy about it. Words like "occult practices" seem to be much better suiting.

In conclusion: "Ascetism", Self-Delusion (not sure why someone would do something like that, only if out of ignorance), Control of others or different states of consciousness - are all totally different things. If we speak about states of consciousness (probably the most relevant thing to Original Post), it starts from becoming aware in dream and has many phases, various shortcuts, etc. But initial step is pretty much: becoming aware in dream.

Andro
12-26-2017, 05:44 AM
However, whatever is being called as hypnosis in West is simply a lower forms of Mohana practice in the East, it is practice of casting delusion on other people (so they see things which aren't actually there). So, acts of self-hypnosis or "self-Mohana" might lead to nothing else but self-delusion...

There is SO much more to hypnotic states than this. The above example sounds like stage hypnosis, and even good stage hypnosis can go beyond "creating delusions" (like for example, people seeing what actually IS there, even if it is hidden from their direct view/line of sight).


washing young girls, while being extremely full of lust

Sounds like those spiritual practices are reserved exclusively for hetero male pedophiles :)


But initial step is pretty much: becoming aware in dream.

Becoming aware in a dream, IMO, is quite interesting, but not very useful from the perspective of Spiritual Liberation. One merely switches awareness/wakefulness from one dream to another, while still remaining anchored in Dream-Land. The key, as I see it, is to "Lift the Anchor" completely and to wake up in the "In-Between" (between states, between dreams, "between the pixels", so to speak) and STAY "there". Over the last 20 years, I have had only a handful of experiences in this state. It is truly astonishing. Gotta go now, but perhaps I will share some of them at a later time... Disclaimer: My experiences are not Randy-Verified.

Warmheart
12-26-2017, 07:33 AM
Edited: deleted some off-topic.

I can recommend Vijnanabhairava with comments of Singh, which can give lifetimes worth of experience, which far surpass most of other similar books on the subject. Book might be hard to read, but once its concepts are grasped, you will find yourself with tons of highly valuable practices. I think this is as close and relevant material to what is being sought by OP.

Andro
12-26-2017, 10:09 AM
Edited: deleted some off-topic.

Your "off-topics" are rarely actually "off-topic", and even if there's only a tangential connection, IMO it can serve to broaden the scope of the original topic.

Thanks, your input is always appreciated!

Warmheart
12-26-2017, 03:06 PM
Your "off-topics" are rarely actually "off-topic", and even if there's only a tangential connection, IMO it can serve to broaden the scope of the original topic.

I wrote something that I'm afraid I shouldn't write, so I quickly deleted it :)
Your experience will be very interesting to read, and I think it has connection to 3rd state of consciousness out of aforementioned 4.

Andro
12-26-2017, 03:20 PM
I wrote something that I'm afraid I shouldn't write, so I quickly deleted it :)
Your experience will be very interesting to read, and I think it has connection to 3rd state of consciousness out of aforementioned 4.

Would you please elaborate your definition of those 4 states?

If you feel it's off-topic, you can always create a new thread such as "The Four States of Consciousness", where we can discuss this further :)

Warmheart
12-26-2017, 06:31 PM
Would you please elaborate your definition of those 4 states?

If you feel it's off-topic, you can always create a new thread such as "The Four States of Consciousness", where we can discuss this further :)
4 states of consciousness:
1. Consciousness of ordinary man.
2. Awareness of what is called as "Astral" in the West.
3. Awareness of Mind (roughly speaking, it is also had a crude name "Mental" in the West).
4. Awareness on Procreation Level.
Third state of awareness has such perks as recognizing the fact that thoughts don't actually belong to you, it is illusion, you are just bystander, while thoughts are forming on their own. Most people are heavily deluded thinking that they think. Thoughts formed as Primal Words from Primal Sound. Then Primal Thoughts go through Primal Word state to Pure Energy, which forms "Astral" (perceivable in 2nd State), and condensated, I'd say - Highly Darkened and heavily Obscured, Form of that "Astral" is Matter (perceivable by 1st state, the lowest of 4).

4th State of Awareness is the most clean state of existence, recognition of Ultimate Reality, the other 3 states are like 3 Veils of Obscuration of Primal State. In this Dark Epoch most people are totally blind, so they can only perceive Matter and produce malefic enthrophic emanations into higher spheres, basically marking this world as what can be named as highest Hell Sphere (there are also Lower Spheres, even more Darkened than this world). Current people have only slight glimpses of 2nd state of awareness in the dreams, but even that is a luxury for most people.

Andro
12-26-2017, 06:57 PM
Thank you!

I guess, if we ever continue this conversation, it will be on more 'private' channels :)

Warmheart
12-26-2017, 09:56 PM
Thank you!

I guess, if we ever continue this conversation, it will be on more 'private' channels :)
For some reason I feel as if I managed to derail this thread or that I probably made someone upset, which never was my goal. ...My "private" channels here are open for any questions/conversations:)

Avatar
12-27-2017, 11:08 PM
Warmheart.

You did not derail the conversation.
You offered your understanding on the subject.
An that is appreciated by me greatly.
I am a corrupt dying ascetic. Often ignored. So! Your contribution is highly loved by me.

To continue.
From what I understand of legitimate hypnosis.
It is manipulation of trance states.
'Trance' in itself is an interesting concept.
One which I havnt medically researched yet.
From my understanding and what I am able to see the mind constantly fluctuates between trance states.
In the simplest of terms a trance is a fixation of attention.
Do you have a busy routine job? Ever zone out while doing your job? Zone out while driving home?
(Zoning out and zoning in) are cliche words that describe a trance.
I personally know what a trance feels like an can enter it at will.
Hypnosis as I understand, in its legitimate form is the manipulation of trance states.
Trance is a synonym for focused attention.
More correctly fixed attention.
*locked attention*.
I once knew a professional skate bored individual.
He said during big events, all else would drown out, an there would be nothing else but himself and the bored. ( in the zone).
He fucked up one time and broke his back, he said he has not been able to enter that zone again.
Take me I used to paint houses, pure routine. I would prep and paint houses while barley paying attention. That is also the zone of hypnosis.
It is a trance state. If you know what a trance is, if you know the mind fluctuates through locked attention constantly. Fluctuating. You will be able to see other people enter and leave trances all day long.
It is like a person who so focused on reading a book or watching a movie, they do not hear you call them the first time.

Now, how deep can a trance go?
Well in short sleep is a trance.
The yogic method of Samadhi is nothing but a deep trance.
Through steadying and focusing, the trance is deepened, until a pseudo sleep is attain. By pseudo sleep I mean all the senses come to one place. The entire sensory mind is coalesced. This is actually not very hard to do, it is very simple. Like leading a horse to a familiar water stream.

There was talk about delusion.
I will read the former posts a couple days ago so I do not remember.
Yet. Hypnosis is not delusion.
Well, it is in a sense.
The mind in itself is pure delusion.
For the mind only exists due to sensory experience.
An through that self identification an many other things are had.
When I speak of self hypnosis I am talking about efficient control of self and manipulation of self.
Like I said, through simple focus you can make all sensory experience vanish an coalesced into one. That is easy!
Yet there are many other ways to take advantage of yourself.

Hm. I want more comments and opinions.
Yet to end I will say this: consciousness is a sustained trance.
It has two parts. Analytical and emotional.
Analytical if developed is a great guardian.
Yet how do you bypass a powerful guardian?
Parables. Metaphors, similes and stories.

That is why religion and cults are so influential.

Captain and commander. The captain is analytical seeing all and analysing. Yet no one gets to the commander.
Yet the commander has a weak spot for stories and parables and similies etc. He is a believer.
You think you are the captian of your ship. Yet it is the commander who orders the captian around.
You do not feel mad because you think you are mad.
The heart is always stronger than the analytical mind.
Yet the analytical mind guards the heart.
Yet it can by bypassed.
This is why religion works.

In hypnosis we bypass the analytical mind and directly influence the emotional mind.
I apologize I cannot think of the name for this part of the brain. It is the part connected to the vagus nerve.

For little known, the vagus nerve is the golden thread if the fates, of life. Break your back an you will live. Cut the vagus nerve an nothing but death awaites you.

Meditation is hypnosis.
Hypnosis often has an inductor in the West yes.
An used upon others is considered black magic.
Easily done but not the issue.
Self hypnosis, is simply control of trance of the own mind.
This is Samadhi.
This is avishkara and deity yoga.
Very powerful practices if done consciously.
Hell. To don't practice taiji. Yet I may create a thread on it, since it is so abused an practiced incorrectly so much.
It is simple yet easily practiced. It takes a tiny bit of focus. Yet oh so very few teach it correctly.
Anyway! My original point it. Occult practices and hypnosis have more in common than most know. Yet occult practices are so obscure. An hypnosis has been eh, studied and recognized to at least a minor degree. They are both in the same exact realm just used for different purposes.
One is connected to old traditions and practices, the other is a western understanding of similar phenomena yet not utilized efficiently.

Kibric
12-28-2017, 01:20 AM
as recognizing the fact that thoughts don't actually belong to you, it is illusion, you are just bystander, while thoughts are forming on their own. Most people are heavily deluded thinking that they think.
all mind is an illusion
thoughts cannot be created or destroyed because you the self/character who is creating the thought does not exist

they are deluded into thinking that they think
that thought itself exists

Avatar
01-05-2018, 07:36 PM
Well shit. I had written some good shit then was hit by spyware an had to exit out of my browser. SO.
I will explain nothing an try to be short. lol.

So, I will simply attempt to stimulate conversation.

Hypnosis is simply the western word for the physiological phenomena. This phenomena is the foundation of all tribal and eastern practices.

Questions comments?

Kibric. The mind is indeed an apparition. An impression.
Yet it is conscious of itself.
It sees itself, an it sees that others see themselves.
An that others see them in this same way.

Yet it is still an impression. Yet an impression of what?
Well the consciousness is made up of the 5 senses. On average the mind is made and created through reflection of the 5 senses.
A baby born without any of the 5 senses would be like a coma patient.
We experience all we do through the senses.
The senses are the medium between mind and the world.
We cannot experience the world directly. We only experience what the senses allow.
Extra sensory is being able to heighten, control, and mix the senses. Liberation from the world is simply cutting off all senses, so that only the created impression of the mind exists. Thus you experience the purity of yourself. Very few get to experience what it is like to exist purely without the world.
This isn't actually hard to do. An it is very basic.
In fact it is the very basic of basics.
For instance why cant we create artificial intelligence?
I am not pursuing engineering nor programming so I will give it away for free.
Yet due me the credit if you steal please. I wish no money. Just credit so I may influence such projects.
Now see. You cannot create a sentient independent consciousness through programming a mind.
No no, it is much simpler. Human brain is simply capacity.
Like a large capacitor.
Anyway. The senses. From an ant to a chipmunk to a dog to a human. The only difference is capacity. Yet what is the same?
They all have consciousness even though the capacity for it differs.
Awareness is what we are trying to produce yes?
Awareness is in the brain yes but not of it.
awareness is a product of reflection of the senses.