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Saturneus
01-14-2020, 08:30 PM
G-d created Adam and Eve as perfect creatures possessing wisdom and intelligence beyond what we deformed wretched humans can even comprehend.
So if you thought they were "stupid"... flush it out, they weren't stupid.

However, he didn't give them the ability to know Good and Evil. He did, however, give them a crystal clear understanding of Truth and Falsehood, and the instinct to detect them.

But the Snake wasn't happy about it, he had his own agenda.

So he decided to crash the party and ruin it.

This is how he did it.

But first, let us recount G-d's commandment to Adam.


But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. (Genesis 2:17)

Alright, clear enough, don't eat of that fruit or you will die.

Next, we read about Eve's conversation with the Snake.


Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:

3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.

First, the Snake tests Eve's ability to recognize Truth from Falsehoods.
Did G-d say? or did he not say?

So Eve displays her mastery over the art of knowing truth and falsehood.
Yeah, G-d did say: "Eat of every tree, except this one tree or you will die" and this is my account of the truth as was revealed to me.

The Snake impressed with her mastery over the art, now challenges her with a new art, the art of knowing Good from Evil.


And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

The Snake told her: No no no... No need for baseless fear, don't worry, for you see... G-d is evil. G-d is so evil he put you in this golden cage to be his slaves, forever. He threatened you, so you will not eat and become like him and have the power to escape, and remove the yoke of his tyranny from over you.
So don't believe what he says is truth, it is not... and it is not BECAUSE HE IS BAD!
However... I am telling you the truth BECAUSE I AM GOOD, so trust me my child, I only want what is best for you... Yesssss I am good.

So Eve started thinking to herself.
Who should I trust? the Snake? Or should I trust G-d, maybe G-d is evil he is lying, but maybe this Snake is lying... How am I to know?

Remember what G-d told Adam?
He told him, Don't eat.

Remember what Eve told the Snake?
She told him, that G-d had said, don't eat AND DON'T TOUCH.

So the Talmud says the Snake then pushed Eve, so she touched the fruit.

She touched the fruit and nothing bad happened, so her calculating mind kicked in.

"No no what are you doing don't make me touch it I will die!"

But he was too powerful, he forced her to touch.

"Wait... Nothing happened. I am still alive, and I am still alive, this means I was allowed to touch it, which means G-d lied to me, which means G-d is evil and he is afraid of us and we are in a golden cage trapped as slaves, and this means the Snake is told the truth, which means he is good, and I can trust him. I can trust him and I can eat."


And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

Did you ever ask yourself how it was possible she saw the tree was good BEFORE she even ate of its fruit that was supposed to grant her the ability to see good and evil in the first place?

The virus is a thought pattern.

It is the thought pattern that causes us to buy into philosophies, ideologies, religions, and systems, which we convince ourselves are true because really they seem good to us.
Or we reject certain things, even if they are true, because we convince ourselves they false because really, they seem bad to us.

So look around you, take a good look at our dysfunctional delusional way of life we call civilization.
We got here by convincing ourselves the truth is a lie because it is bad, and the lie is truth because it is good.

"Woe unto them who put good for evil and evil for good.."

So now you might ask, why did Eve add the extra detail regarding touching if G-d never said it?

Well, it was Adam who added that detail when he recounted to her what G-d had told him.

Oh... And Adam was the Snake.
But that's another story.

Florius Frammel
01-15-2020, 07:46 AM
The connection of Lucifer and Adam can also be alchemically interesting.

First, nowhere in Genesis was written when the angels were created. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm only familiar with the OT in this regard.

Therefore it can make sense that Adam was the devil, which can also be supported by his attributed iconography:

At least since Levi there is the pentagram, also a symbol for man.

In the oldest Tarots he has claws on his feet buried deep inside the earth. Some claim that also the card XIV Temperance is not presenting Michael but Lucifer. The foot on the ground, the pentacle-like flower on the forehead, the wings. That triangles on the chest (Marseille version).

Adamah in Hebrew relates to red earth, which often is interpreted as red clay that contains iron oxide.

In pre iron age the only elemental iron known came from meteorites from the sky/heaven.

Iron has a strong connection to the archetypical male figure Mars, who is also called the "fiery warrior".

The alchemical symbol for fire may be interpreted as a penis.

Lucifer is the bringer of light (fire), the son of the morning. Interestingly the morning star is Venus. But this makes actually sense if Eve (Venus) is made from Adam (Mars).

Some even go so far to say that the way of enlightenment must lead through the body (Caput Mortum, Terra Damnata, fixed salt, most dense, luciferan aspect) and that therein lies the most important light, which lucifer is the bringer of.

Of course Adam and Eve, among others, can also be interpreted as sun & moon, solve & coagula, fix & volatile.

As some might know, all these symbols were also used for the most important matter that is used in alchemy.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 08:05 AM
Lucifer being Satan is a purely Christian invention that has no basis in Judaism whatsoever.

The bane of the occult world is mixing different systems together, thus it becomes impossible to understand anything at all.
I would advise you not to do such mixing... Because then, how is your mind different than Babel? All one does is compare one correspondence to another without ever being able to fully grasp any of them.

The Serpent, however, is a representation of Satan, (I don't use this term 'devil', it does great injustice to Satan who is not at all a devil).

I already explained humans can't create the Stone.

Satan causes the Luciferian urge/inclination to rise and ferment within a person, but he himself is not that inclination/urge.

Yes... The greatest light is in the darkness. But don't be mistaken to think that you should allow your body to lead the way, or you will go all Shabtai Zvi on us.

That's the problem with Saturnalia, they rewarded themselves with pleasures of the body. But it wasn't Sabbath yet, and they didn't rectify their souls and bodies yet.
So they only caused harm to themselves and their communities.

I will explain what it means for Adam to be the Snake, later today or tomorrow.
Already explained Lucifer in the 'egoless?' thread.
I would revisit him once I explain the Tower of Babel.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 08:37 AM
Now that I think about it, there might be a connection between Lucifer and Satan.
But still, I recommend not to interpret the OT through NT lense.

So even though Christianity got some things right, perhaps, it did so with giving things a spin which directed them off course, and thus it is harmful to interpret them according to that spin.

I will make it clear once I explain Adam being the Snake. Tower of Babel, and the connection between Jacob's ladder and the 10 commandments.

Florius Frammel
01-15-2020, 09:40 AM
Lucifer being Satan is a purely Christian invention that has no basis in Judaism whatsoever.

The bane of the occult world is mixing different systems together, thus it becomes impossible to understand anything at all.
I would advise you not to do such mixing...

I don't care whether some concepts have a basis in Judaism. Do you think that it - or your interpretation of it - is the only legit view/path then?

If your standpoint is based on the problem of a chronology-based dilution, or change of an original concept then one could state that Judaism already is a concept that can confuse the original underlying message. Whatever that should be.

The tower of Babel, if you want to see it as an actual historical event instead of an allegory, was built before Judaism surfaced on earth.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 12:30 PM
First, nowhere in Genesis was written when the angels were created. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm only familiar with the OT in this regard.
Adamah in Hebrew relates to red earth, which often is interpreted as red clay that contains iron oxide.
Of course Adam and Eve, among others, can also be interpreted as sun & moon, solve & coagula, fix & volatile.

And of course, Genesis is an abridged version of older sumerian/babylonian myths. In these, man is created from something that is translated as "blood clots" in "clay". This becomes the "red earth" in Genesis. Clay is very interesting in a chemistry and biological sense.

"Clay is a finely-grained natural rock or soil material that combines one or more clay minerals with possible traces of quartz (SiO2), metal oxides (Al2O3 , MgO etc.) and organic matter. Geologic clay deposits are mostly composed of phyllosilicate minerals containing variable amounts of water trapped in the mineral structure. Clays are plastic due to particle size and geometry as well as water content, and become hard, brittle and non–plastic upon drying or firing.[1][2][3] Depending on the soil's content in which it is found, clay can appear in various colours from white to dull grey or brown to deep orange-red."
"Traditional uses of clay as medicine goes back to prehistoric times. "

"New toxicity results show that foams would be safer than the currently used clays as materials to stem blood flow in open wounds. Blood loss is one of the leading causes of death in both military and civilian casualties. Currently, aluminosilicate layered clays, such as kaolin clay, are used as haemostatic agents (agents that encourage the blood to clot)" COAGULATE

"Changes in clay minerals and potassium fixation capacity as a result of release and fixation of potassium in long-term field experiments"


Iron has a strong connection to the archetypical male figure Mars, who is also called the "fiery warrior".
Some even go so far to say that the way of enlightenment

And Mars' higher aspect is enlightenment.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 12:38 PM
I will make it clear once I explain Adam being the Snake. Tower of Babel, and the connection between Jacob's ladder and the 10 commandments.

https://i.imgur.com/P9UL5wd.jpg



It's not really comparing "Messiah", which is a greek work, but "Moshiach/Maschiach". Which itself has some similarities to "Nachash", the serrpent/snake.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 02:43 PM
I don't care whether some concepts have a basis in Judaism. Do you think that it - or your interpretation of it - is the only legit view/path then?

If your standpoint is based on the problem of a chronology-based dilution, or change of an original concept then one could state that Judaism already is a concept that can confuse the original underlying message. Whatever that should be.

The tower of Babel, if you want to see it as an actual historical event instead of an allegory, was built before Judaism surfaced on earth.

If one wants to understand the Scriptures, one needs to understand the SCRIPTURES.
It seems to me you are not interested in understanding The alchemy of scriptures, but rather you wish to display your knowledge of the correspondences, by trying to show me how you manage to make connections between Scriptures and other systems.

Yes, I know Babel predates Sinai, you didn't have to tell me that.
But your mind is Babel'ed, you know correspondences, but it seems to me you don't fully grasp a single thing.

This is the bane of the occult, constantly mixing mixing mixing mixing, trying to understand one system by the correspondences of another.
This is confusion, which is translated to BABEL.

If you don't want to understand the alchemy of the scriptures, then I have nothing to offer you and wish you good luck in your path.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 02:52 PM
I don't even know if I should even explain how Adam was the Snake.

Because... Look, the main message of this thread was exposing the depths of the meaning of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil and how it manifests as an alchemical thought pattern that alchemically controls and molds the reality around us.

But you ignore it, and you much rather talk about the damn properties of clay for heaven's sake...

Florius Frammel
01-15-2020, 03:06 PM
Maybe you should have first defined your understanding of "an alchemy of scriptures".

Even the term "alchemy" is especially nowadays used for all kinds of different things that don't have anything to do with a pre 19th century definition.

As I understand it, this forum covers "all kinds of alchemy". There may be enough room for your and for my version. But I more and more get the impression that this diversty is nothing that interests you. Which is okay for me, your kinds of dogmas are certainly nothing that I'm interested in too.

Thanks for wishing me good luck, I wish you the same!

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 03:11 PM
https://i.imgur.com/P9UL5wd.jpg



It's not really comparing "Messiah", which is a greek work, but "Moshiach/Maschiach". Which itself has some similarities to "Nachash", the serrpent/snake.

There is a good Snake, and there is a bad Snake.

Adam assumed the role of the Bad Snake.
Messiah would assume the role of the Good Snake.

I teach Kabbalah, but not through Gematrias and the workings of the Kabbalistic Spheres, which are codes, and even if one knows them, and can recite all the interactions of the Spheres, one doesn't really understand it yet.

So I explain the coded principles of the Kabbalah by way of explaining the true meaning of the Biblical stories.

I trust that once you understand what I have to show you, you'd be able to use it on your path of understanding technical Kabbalah, and maybe also use it in your alchemy.
But don't rush towards comparing the elements of the Scriptures with elements of other systems before you understand the meaning and message of the elements of the Scriptures.

This is why occultism is dead. These retard magicians and whatnot, have no idea what they are talking about, all they know is to make connections and equate between elements of one system and between the elements of another... This is ok, but they still don't understand either of the systems, yet they think themselves wise.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 03:11 PM
Would it happen to be spring where you are? You people tend to get all manic when the Sun starts to strengthen again, and show up to correct and save us with your super-special secret knowledge. Maybe you should broadcast less and receive more.


This is the bane of the occult, constantly mixing mixing mixing mixing, trying to understand one system by the correspondences of another.

I think you are confused. The Sefer Yetsirah, after the first few chapters, is basically comprised of lists of correspondences. It's part of the art, one of the mental exercises. Later, corrupt versions of the Yetsirah actually add these lists to the text, compiled from the earlier chapters. I guess you don't like Abulafia and his "combining" either. I think the later "Ars combinatoria" like Lull's "Great Art" are derived from here.


I don't even know if I should even explain how Adam was the Snake.

Because... Look, the main message of this thread was exposing the depths of the meaning of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil and how it manifests as an alchemical thought pattern that alchemically controls and molds the reality around us.

But you ignore it, and you much rather talk about the damn properties of clay for heaven's sake...

I responded to you, and I responded to Florius. I think it's interesting how "red earth" goes back to "coagulated" blood (clots), and clay, and how clay relates to coagulation and how it "Fixes" certain minerals. This is "Alchemy Forums" after all, and not "Saturneus' Mystery School". You aren't a superior being holding court for us mere mortals.

I did respond to you. If you don't know how Adam relates to Adam Kadmon, and the totality of the tree of life, and how that relates to the concept of Messiah/Mashiach, then I don't know what to say.

Kiorionis
01-15-2020, 03:18 PM
But you ignore it, and you much rather talk about the damn properties of clay for heaven's sake...

so you’ve uncovered the clay fetish a few of us have at last! :p

If you take the time to look around the forums, you’ll notice that Adam, Eve, the Garden, the Snake, the Tree, and occasionally Lucifer are talked about A LOT round here. So if your thread isn’t drawing a lot of OMGs, that might be why.

But if you talk more about clay :rolleyes:


As for the OP, I find the most interesting comment to be the one on how Luciferian “energy” causes a rising and fermenting. This metaphor/theory has been a guide in the lab work as of late.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 03:19 PM
Maybe you should have first defined your understanding of "an alchemy of scriptures".

Even the term "alchemy" is especially nowadays used for all kinds of different things that don't have anything to do with a pre 19th century definition.

As I understand it, this forum covers "all kinds of alchemy". There may be enough room for your and for my version. But I more and more get the impression that this diversty is nothing that interests you. Which is okay for me, your kinds of dogmas are certainly nothing that I'm interested in too.

Thanks for wishing me good luck, I wish you the same!

I truly do want you to use what I am giving you in other fields you study and pursue.
But to use them, you must first grasp them.

So what tool have I given you today?
I have given you the knowledge that Truth and Falshood is a different scale completely detached from the scale of Good and Evil.
I have shown you how and why the human brain confuses between the two.

I have given you an immensely powerful and important key to your "SPIRITUAL" alchemy.

Now with this key, you are able to scour the libraries of the world and be able to detect when an author is pushing a "truth" only because it seems good for him, or he rejects a "truth" because it seems bad for him.

Surely you see it's a powerful spiritual alchemical tool, that is certain to help you in your Work.

You also understand it's a vulnerable tool, easy to lose sight of, due to one's own inner battle between what he perceives as good and what he perceives as bad... for him.

Now, is Scripture just allegories?
Perhaps, but it doesn't mean we shouldn't understand their message... AS IT WAS MEANT TO BE UNDERSTOOD.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 03:23 PM
I teach Kabbalah

And yet you still take time out from that busy schedule to linger on Alchemy Forums to teach us as well? What did we do to deserve this honour? You are truly a scholar and a gentleman.


but not through Gematrias and the workings of the Kabbalistic Spheres

Bully for you?


I trust that once you understand what I have to show you, you'd be able to use it on your path of understanding technical Kabbalah, and maybe also use it in your alchemy.

Oh god here we go again.


This is why occultism is dead. These retard magicians and whatnot, have no idea what they are talking about, all they know is to make connections and equate between elements of one system and between the elements of another... This is ok, but they still don't understand either of the systems, yet they think themselves wise.

Oh, the "r" word. You just jumped the shark. If you really could read my mind, you'd know what I think about the occult.

If you were really wise, you could explain yourself to people in THEIR terms, in context that they would understand, not insist they learn your terminology and understand it your way.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 03:29 PM
I think you are confused. The Sefer Yetsirah, after the first few chapters, is basically comprised of lists of correspondences. It's part of the art, one of the mental exercises. Later, corrupt versions of the Yetsirah actually add these lists to the text, compiled from the earlier chapters. I guess you don't like Abulafia and his "combining" either. I think the later "Ars combinatoria" like Lull's "Great Art" are derived from here.



I know.
However Sefer Yetzira's correspondences are correspondences WITHIN the greater system of Judaism, so they are perfectly valid and operatable.

Also, there is nothing wrong with correspondences, they are useful, but only once a system and its elements are fully grasped, then it becomes valuable to make the jump and compare it with another system.

But beforehand, they only confuse the mind.

I'll give an example.
People try to understand the 'goat' so they start spewing the correspondences of the goat.
There is Pan, there are the goat sacrifices, there is Baphomet, there is the goat the masons ride on, there is Capricorn blah blah blah.

Do they understand and grasp any of the correspondences they just spewed? Of course not. They only further confuse themselves, drowning deeper into Babel.

But were they to fully grasp and understand one correspondence and then compare ith with another, it would surely aid them.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 03:34 PM
If you take the time to look around the forums, you’ll notice that Adam, Eve, the Garden, the Snake, the Tree, and occasionally Lucifer are talked about A LOT round here. So if your thread isn’t drawing a lot of OMGs, that might be why.

.. and it's the same with "Jewish" alchemy. I admit in these forums, the only place it's really come up is in terms of Flamel/Book of Abraham the Jew. But I don't see greek or egyptian alchemy come up much, either.

But the topic of Jewish alchemy is nothing new, there are even books about it, like Raphael Patai's 'The Jewish Alchemists - A History and Source Book'. Here's the ToC in case anyone is interested:

https://i.imgur.com/iwwlCkY.jpg

Kibric
01-15-2020, 03:35 PM
This becomes the "red earth" in Genesis. Clay is very interesting in a chemistry and biological sense.
This right here is a treasure. Animals eat it from instinct.

The ground was also cursed by God. Changed the minerals in the earth ?.
I can't find a Sumerian counter part for that story.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 03:39 PM
This right here is a treasure. Animals eat it from instinct.

The ground was also cursed by God. Changed the minerals in the earth ?.
I can't find a Sumerian counter part for that story.

Isn't it the Epic of Gilgamesh? It's been awhile, that's whats coming to mind.. I'd have to look it up.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 03:39 PM
The ground was also cursed by God.


I will explain how and why in my explanation regarding Adam being the Snake.

I am terrified of such a task, it is holographic and branches into many directions, I want to incapsulate them all in one coherent explanation. I pray I will manage to do it.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 03:44 PM
Adama, simply means earth or soil.

Adom means red.

So there is a connection, between the two, but Adama is not red earth, it is simply earth.

Adama is also Adam'eh, same spelling. It means 'I shall be like' or 'I shall equate myself and be like'.

The purpose of the earth is to be like the heavens. As above so below.

So the purpose of man is to be like G-d.

But not in a Lucifer kind of way, which is I shall replace G-d and be a god among men.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 03:49 PM
Wikipedia:


Adam (אדם) literally means "red", and there is an etymological connection between adam and adamah, adamah designating "red clay" or "red ground" in a non-theological context.[7] In traditional Jewish theology, a strong etymological connection between the two words is often assumed. Maimonides believed the word adam to be derived from the word adamah, analogous to the way in which mankind was created from the ground.[8] In contemporary biblical scholarship there is a general consensus that the words have an etymological relationship, but the exact nature of it is disputed. The word adam has no feminine form in Hebrew, but if it did, it would be adamah.[6] However, it is considered unlikely that the word adamah is a feminization of "adam", and the prevailing hypothesis is that both words originate from the verbal stem "adam" (to be red) and were chosen by the author of Genesis to convey the relationship between man and the adamah.[7][9]

There is additional relationship between the words adam and adamah and the word dam (דם), meaning blood.[10] This justifies the presence in the Kashrut of the prohibition of the consumption of blood: the blood of a slaughtered animal must be returned to the ground, and covered with earth.[11] The concept could also date back to primitive woman's "birth magic," or the making of clay manikins and anointing them with menstrual blood—the sacred "blood of life"—in order to conceive real children. Women were still making clay manikins to represent people by sympathetic magic through such manikins, in the Middle Ages when such pursuits were redefined as witchcraft. Clay was always a "feminine" material, sacred to women because it was their substance earth. Pottery was a woman's art because of this time-honored association of ideas.[12]

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 03:53 PM
If you want to trust someone's lack of understanding of Biblical Hebrew... Go ahead.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 03:56 PM
If you want to trust someone's lack of understanding of Biblical Hebrew... Go ahead.

Isn't that convenient. It's well sourced, you can check the article and the citations for yourself. Wikipedia wasn't around when I "picked" up this information. This isn't political or pop culture content. These types of wikipedia articles are well maintained, by people that know.

I could pull it from "books", but I am quite certain it wouldn't matter the source I quoted if it disagreed with your opinions.

Kibric
01-15-2020, 03:57 PM
Isn't it the Epic of Gilgamesh? It's been awhile, that's whats coming to mind.. I'd have to look it up.
If like the world flood, there are repeated references to a cursing or changing the soil of the earth from different creation myths,
I'd bet somewhere in the geological record there is a sign corroborating a change.

Any proto Sumerian stuff you have would be great for this topic. What i'm sure of is that the demonising of the snake in creation happened much later.
From Gilgamesh's story the snake takes immortality away from a rapist. It was a mistake for Ziusudra's wife to help him.
Karma and the snake had other plans.


This justifies the presence in the Kashrut of the prohibition of the consumption of blood: the blood of a slaughtered animal must be returned to the ground, and covered with earth
what does blood chemically do to the earth. The origin of the practice could be a way to try and chemically change the earth back to before Gods curse.

I can't believe the creation myths are so cut and dry as whats being presented in the OP.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 04:01 PM
Isn't that convenient. It's well sourced, you can check the article and the citations for yourself. Wikipedia wasn't around when I "picked" up this information. This isn't political or pop culture content. These types of wikipedia articles are well maintained, by people that know.

I could pull it from "books", but I am quite certain it wouldn't matter the source I quoted if it disagreed with your opinions.

You will never find a single Orthodox Jewish source that says Adam = red, and Adama = red earth/soil.

You will find that AdOm means red, thus there is a connection between red, Adam and Adama. But Adam means Adam the name for man, and Adama means soil.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 04:04 PM
You will never find a single Orthodox Jewish source that says Adam = red, and Adama = red earth/soil.

I don't single-source anything. Do you think the same holds true for Jewish sources in general? These ideas aren't new or modern, they go back centuries.

Florius Frammel
01-15-2020, 04:08 PM
If like the world flood, there are repeated references to a cursing or changing the soil of the earth from different creation myths.

You could read the end of Fulcanelli's cathedrales (about the cross of hendaye). There he writes about the ends of ages. If there is a flood on the northern hemisphere, there is a fire on the southern. If there is a flood on the southern hemisphere, there is a fire on the northern.

And that's what is supposed to happen to the northern hemisphere next. It's also another hidden meaning of INRI: Igne Natura Renoventur Integra

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 04:11 PM
I don't single-source anything. Do you think the same holds true for Jewish sources in general? These ideas aren't new or modern, they go back centuries.

And G-d ceased from all his work and rested.

Ceased is Shavat.
Same spelling as Shabbat.

But Shabbat is the name of the seventh day.
Shabbat doesn't mean "ceased". It is the name for the seventh day.

But, there is a huge connection between Shabbat and Shavat. Still not the same word not the same meaning.

Save'ah means satisfied, as in the sensation of being full after being hungry.

Sheva and Save'ah has the same exact spelling, but Sheva means seven.
So there is a HUGE connection between Shabbat, the seventh day and satisfaction.

What you are doing is claiming Sheva and Save'ah, Shabbat and Shavat have the same meaning.

Many scholars are dumb.

Kibric
01-15-2020, 04:13 PM
That's gotta be the weakening of the earths Em fields. I'l give it a read.:)

vigilance
01-15-2020, 04:23 PM
That's gotta be the weakening of the earths Em fields. I'l give it a read.:)

Which is thought to coincide with.. a pole shift.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 04:31 PM
Many scholars are dumb.

I didn't claim anything. What you have described is the exact sort of word play Kabbalists engage in during their exegesis on the Torah. Which is something you just said you deny/dismiss. If memory serves, this level of interpretation, "Sod", is the only form of Kabbalah that's actually permitted according to Orthodox authorities, or am I confused?

I guess I should remind you of the very first verse in the Yetsirah. I like Saadia's version as he adds the interpretation of each:


By means of thirty-two wondrous paths of wisdom Yah, the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, the Living God, God Almighty, holy and terrible is his name, dwelling for ever, carved out. He created his universe with three types of things (whose names derive from the same root letters - s-p-r): with writing (seper) and numbers (s'par) and speech (sippur).

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 04:36 PM
Never said I deny or reject this method of Sod.

I said I am revealing the Sod in the text itself, without having to teach the Kabbalistic tree, the spheres, the paths, and engage in Gematrias.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 04:47 PM
Never said I deny or reject this method of Sod.

I said I am revealing the Sod in the text itself, without having to teach the Kabbalistic tree, the spheres, the paths, and engage in Gematrias.

Alright this is my last reply on this. The connection between Adam and red earth, at this point and for centuries, "by tradition". This tradition is not some creation of us goyim, it is a jewish tradition that has been transmitted. I am quite sure that you know this, and you're just acting dumb because it doesn't fit some point you are trying to make. Sure, most people who repeat "this tradition" don't understand where it comes from, but how is that different from anything else.


Adam was the first human being and the progenitor of the human race. The first chapter of Genesis states that God made man in the sixth day of the Creation, fashioning him in His own image and giving him dominion over the rest of creation. The etymology of the word Adam connects it with Adamah, “ground or soil,” and with Adom, “red.” This suggests that Adam was formed from red soil or clay.
https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/adam-and-eve/


The name Adam is therefore revealing. It describes our lower side, the tremendous downward pull and animal instinct within each of us. But it also alludes to our ability to become great -- not in spite of our physical side but because of it and through our resisting its desires. By confronting our lower aspects and overcoming them, we can accomplish things that no angel can. Through our earthy nature, we are planted and have the opportunity to produce fruits through rising from the decay and becoming more than we were beforehand. The choice is ours. We can be governed by our blood impulses, as was Eisav in the Torah who killed when he did not get what he wanted and was therefore called Edom, red, alluding to his being controlled by blood instinct, or we can become stronger and loftier, remaining in control of our destinies as we always subjugate the dam in Adam to the aleph that precedes it.
https://www.aish.com/sp/ph/48956911.html

Those are two quick examples from rudimentary googling, ignoring all the "bible study/tools" type links.

vigilance
01-15-2020, 04:55 PM
Any proto Sumerian stuff you have would be great for this topic. What i'm sure of is that the demonising of the snake in creation happened much later.
From Gilgamesh's story the snake takes immortality away from a rapist. It was a mistake for Ziusudra's wife to help him.
Karma and the snake had other plans.

If I could be of any help, I would. I just don't have very much on these topics saved. It's from an earlier period in my life when I browsed Graham Hancock and Zitchin. You could try 'Charles F. Horne - The Sacred Books Vol 01 Babylonia and Assyria' which I have saved somewhere and seems that sumerian content including at least a few texts.

Saturneus
01-15-2020, 05:20 PM
Greg please review our little exchange.

I admitted numerous times that such a connection exists.
I only insisted that you don't make error of thinking the words have the same meaning.
There is a connection between the words, but they still have different meanings.
Because the way in which you expressed yourself implied that the words Adam and Adom are the same and that Adama means red earth.
So again, the words are not the same, Adama doesn't mean red earth, it simply means earth/soil, but however there is indeed a connection with the color red, since Adom (red) has the same root.