PDA

View Full Version : I wonder....



solomon levi
06-02-2009, 06:27 PM
Did the ancient Hindu gods ingest alot of alchemical/colloidal elixirs
with silver in them?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Harihara.jpg

http://www.shaivam.org/gallery/image/shiva/shiva_mandala.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_97_l6w860KY/R7jD0_ek96I/AAAAAAAAACM/_jgqhkd-7v4/s1600-h/Blue+man+(fox).jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Argyria_2.jpg


I do understand that there is a symbolic reason to depict some
gods/godesses as blue, but it'd be cool if it's because of alchemy!

Seth-Ra
06-02-2009, 06:42 PM
ya know, i never thought about that, but i think youre onto something there... The one in the first picture holding a trident (water= moon= silver) and the second one having the moon on her/its head (moon = silver)... id say its highly likely.

nice find :)

solomon levi
06-02-2009, 07:23 PM
Good eye! I didn't even think of that!
:)

Play_Dough
06-02-2009, 07:54 PM
edited....



I do understand that there is a symbolic reason to depict some
gods/godesses as blue, but it'd be cool if it's because of alchemy!

I believe that it is (related to alchemy) because the color 'blue' is the chromatic opposite of 'yellow/gold'.

The blue figures suggest that 'gold is on the inside or flip-side' (chromatic opposite). Whenever 'blue' is present so-too is the presence of gold or bright yellow, implied.

The 'blue' is apparent and 'the gold' is 'underneath'. Suggesting that (?) material expressions (blue) are the flip-side of the 'spiritual/causal' source (gold). Or, that any expression of existence has both a 'blue' (visible) and 'gold' (hidden/causal/invisible) component.

The metaphysical implication is that spirit (gold) when 'inverted' becomes 'matter' as represented by the color 'blue'.

In light of the axiom 'As Above, So Below' it seems that this 'gold/blue' dichotomy would also continue into the realm of physical alchemy, wherein, 'base metals' are possessed of an 'inner gold', as well. Then it seems to follow (connecting the dots) that to arrive at 'gold' then the base-metal requires a manipulation that is tantamount to an 'inversion', or a transmutation of its seeming (apparent) nature.

.

solomon levi
06-02-2009, 08:12 PM
I like that, PD.
I also like when we each know a different piece of a puzzle!

I just came back to mention that the little I do know of Indian
alchemy, as in bhasmas, involves dipping a heated coin or metal
into water or yoghurt or milk or something... that probably leaves
traces of the silver when silver coins were used. I've read people
would add silver coins to their beverages in the old days to receive
the benefits.

Seth-Ra
06-02-2009, 09:04 PM
I myself do that with all my rain water i get, applying and leaving gold and silver jewelry in it, and letting it sit in the sun then. (Especially if im sick, since silver is an antibacterial.)

And with it being that, could also explain why such "gods" would seem quite powerful, living long times, and not falling to illnesses. I would also speculate, similar to Play_Dough, that the "silver color" (blue) would also be an indicator to the spiritual side (hence why they are seen as "gods") but that are embodied in the physical (giving it then the royalty of "gold" = alchemical speaking, Spirit fixed to Matter.)

The Egyptian "gods" seem to be natural bodies (sun, moon, storms, etc..etc.) but giving these ideas, the Indian "gods" seem to be the alchemists that mastered the natural bodies. ;)

Dizardos
06-03-2009, 01:05 AM
No, in all honesty all this symbolism has nothing to do with the ingestion of silver, but that the first two pictures are derived from alchemy is a fact.

Look closely at the first picture of Harihara and observe what you see. What you see is the two alchemical principles intertwined. You see a hermaphrodite, the nature of man and woman, a crown (with a flower that signifies among other things its superiority) and a half moon, dual stripes, skin colors like water and fire, a tiger garment, a necklace made of small suns and whiteness with a red/green pattern on it of whom it is likely that the twelve green patterns represent the zodiac, a serpent around the neck of the woman, four arms with an object that represents that respective element, four armbands, four wristbands, the colors green (growth, fertility, safety, harmony) and red (energy, strength, desire, love), sitting on a petal, a throne. This is the alchemical sun and moon, gold and silver, man and woman, sulphur and mercury or any other names that suit you. Notice that both the man and woman carry elements on their person that belong to the opposite sex. It represents a perfect blending of their natures. The higher principle has taken up the lower. It represents perfection.

The spiritual alchemists appear closer to the truth than the practical alchemists if only they decide to make the intangible tangible. Words that I never would have expected myself to say, and yet here I do.

Aleilius
06-03-2009, 10:46 PM
I fully agree with Dizardos. A large part of our mythology evolves around the dogma of alchemy. From what I understand, the symbolism of many world mythologies (if not all) tends to hint & reference, more or less often, a certain process.

For instance, take a look at the Hindu Goddess Kali (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c5/Kali_Devi.jpg). What is being hinted at here? What is the Greek/Latin translation for potassium? Doesn't this seem quite familiar to al-kali? How about calyx (calx, kalix?)? The connection can even be made with chalice.


Kālī is the feminine of kāla "black, dark coloured" (per Panini 4.1.42). It appears as the name of a form of Durga in Mahabharata 4.195, and as the name of an evil female spirit in Harivamsa 11552.

The homonymous kāla "appointed time", which depending on context can mean "death", is distinct from kāla "black", but became associated through folk etymology.

Can we draw the same connection to the word alchemy (al-khem-y)? The Egyptian word for black is km. This is how we derive khem. Interestingly enough, the Romani word for black is kalo (m.), kali (f.), and kale (pl).

Excuse me while I make a connection to Christianity. This is the Hebrew word for Bethlehem: בּית לחם / bęyth lechem / bayth leh'-khem. It means house of bread. What's the Hebrew word for bread? It's לֶחֶם / lékhem. What about Galilee? It's also connected to kali, cali, qali, vali (loosly), and sali (loosly). via the phonetic cabala. Take a look at this information below:


According to the Bible, Solomon rewarded Hiram I for certain services by giving him the gift of an upland plain among the mountains of Naphtali. Hiram called it "the land of Cabul"

It's all tied together, and language is very important. Our silver is not vulgar silver!

Seth-Ra
06-03-2009, 11:16 PM
i both agree, and disagree with this.

I personally think that, though it may be allegorical and symbolic of the Pattern of Alchemy, it is also literal/physical. (and there is no reason why it shouldn't be.)

My ONLY problem with "spiritual" aspects of Alchemy is that all to often its only viewed as a mental/spiritual thing, and the physical isnt paid attention to.

I agree with both Aleilius and Dizardos, when i looked more at the pics, but id also point out, though it be symbolic, it must also be in some aspects at the least, literal/physical. If our pattern only worked on spiritual/mental planes, then it wouldnt be much use in everyday things, and would simply be a cult-type religion, but as it is, it is fact, because the Natural Realm / Physical Realm proves the Mental/Spiritual Realm(s).

So without further rambling ( :D ) I select "All of the Above & Below" ;)

Aleilius
06-03-2009, 11:32 PM
You're right Seth-Ra, it is physical, and it all relates to a certain path.


http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Proto-Semitic_*%CA%BEak%C4%81l-

Aramaic: אכל (from Proto-Semitic *ʾakāl-.)
1. to eat, to consume
---
Hebrew: אָכַל (akhál) (from Proto-Semitic *ʾakāl-. Cognate with Arabic أكل (’ákala).)
1. to eat
2. to consume, to use up
3. to devour, to eat up
---
Arabic: ء ك ل ( from Proto-Semitic *ʾakāl-.)
أكل (’ákala) (verb form)
1. to eat, to consume, to swallow, to devour
2. to destroy
3. to gnaw, to eat away, to corrode, to erode
4. to spend unlawfully
5. to enrich oneself, to feather one's nest

أكل (’akl) m. (noun form)
1. food
2. meal, repast
3. fodder, feed



The custom seems to have been widespread in the region[16], an example being the Babylonian practice of offering to their gods a number of different kinds of cakes/bread (akalu)[1]; the Hebrew term for the shewbread, Lehem haPanim (lehem = lekhem), is exactly translated by the Assyrian phrase akal pגnu, which refers to the Babylonian cake/bread offerings[1]. In the Israelite case, a number of biblical scholars connect the use of shewbread directly to the ancient cult of the Ark of the Covenant, the Ark being seen as the home of the deity, and the bread being an offering of food, ready for consumption whenever the deity chose to make an appearance[18].


From Yiddish חלה, from Hebrew חַלּהָ.
challah
1. A traditional braided bread eaten by Ashkenazi Jews on the Sabbath


A friend once mentioned our Stone was a Wheat Stone!

solomon levi
06-04-2009, 12:30 AM
Wheat... same pronunciation in french: huit - the number 8.

Okay, don't get me started on phonetic cabala! :D

I believe I follow, comprehend and agree with what Diz and Ale (Ooops! more phonetics!) are saying. But I also feel quite certain that the bhasma method produces something similar to colloidal preparations, and that this was an actual physical appearance as well for some, perhaps prized or admired.
Then it's also possible that these were real life entities that came from some other star system, and that could have something to do with their color. The Vedas and Gita are not without their stories of flying ships and advanced weapons of mass destruction.

Aleilius
06-04-2009, 12:45 AM
Some users of silver preparations would've most definitely turned blue due to argyria. I'm sure this would've seemed supernatural at the time, but today we see it as a medical alteration.



Then it's also possible that these were real life entities that came from some other star system, and that could have something to do with their color. The Vedas and Gita are not without their stories of flying ships and advanced weapons of mass destruction.
Fulcanelli mentioned the alchemists knew of nuclear weapons, and he also mentioned they've been used on us before.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulcanelli
Walter Lang reports that Fulcanelli contacted Jacques Bergier (Яков Михайлович Бергёр) to warn French atomic physicist André Hellbronner of man's impending use of nuclear weapons. According to Fulcanelli, nuclear weapons had been used before against humanity, being the Abyss pandemonium as noted much later by Dr. Albert Einstein on the front page of the New York Post after the detonation of the first Hydrogen bomb in the early 50s (October 31, 1952). Dr. Hellbronner and Chevillon among others were assassinated by the Gestapo towards the end of World War II.[13]

Andro
12-28-2010, 05:46 PM
A friend once mentioned our Stone was a Wheat Stone!

Wheat is associated with the Virgo archetype (virgin birth, etc...)

An empty womb manifests/gives birth to Embodied Light WITHOUT physical penetration :)

Aleilius
12-29-2010, 03:28 PM
Wheat is associated with the Virgo archetype (virgin birth, etc...)

An empty womb manifests/gives birth to Embodied Light WITHOUT physical penetration :)
The Virgin Mary giving birth to Jesus relates to Mercury giving birth to the Sun.

Andro
12-29-2010, 04:43 PM
The Virgin Mary giving birth to Jesus relates to Mercury giving birth to the Sun.

Yes, but that would be a later development. I could sum it up by relating it to an empty un-penetrated womb, physically manifesting Mercury, which in turn gives (virgin) birth to the Sun (Sulfur/Philosophical Gold).

It is only later in life that Oedipus marries Jocasta, his Mother Mercury.

To use biblical allegory (the way I see it), 'Baby Besus' is not yet 'The Christ'. This comes at a later stage.

solomon levi
12-29-2010, 06:40 PM
Yes, there's many ways to adapt it.
I would say that according to the wording - "Mary" and "Chrystos", for the main it refers to
mercury and gold. But the template also fits something coming out of nothing,
or light/Christ/Sol coming out of the darkness/great sea/Prima Materia.

I would say the virgin penetrates itself if we're talking about origins: 1/1=2. or 1/1=3 :)
And the virgin is also a harlot.

Joshua
01-05-2011, 09:44 AM
Robert Fludds philosophical key dealt with wheat. Does anyone have this text to share? Or the gist to share?

solomon levi
01-05-2011, 02:31 PM
I don't. Just wanted to say if we're going to focus on wheat, I think the ergot/LSD association must be considered:

http://scarab.msu.montana.edu/Disease/DiseaseGuidehtml/Img0015.jpg

It has become more and more apparent to me that religion/mystical experience was "discovered" by primitives in various
times and regions by accidentally stumbling across peculiar herbs with entheogenic properties and then sharing this knowledge,
creating "cults", mystery schools, etc, the ingestion of soma, kykeon, amrita, witches' brews, elixirs, etc...
the inner circle or esoteric being given only to initiates - those who partake; the outer circle or exoteric becoming religion of the masses,
beliefs, morals and dogma, etc.
I don't see alchemy as outside of this, but rather an elaboration of it and an extension into other kingdoms as well, with more emphasis on
the mineral stone, and the Universal stone. One can't help but notice the similarities between alkaloid extraction and ormus and spagyria.