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Thread: Fantasies of the Philosophers

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Illen A. Cluf View Post
    There are many other such misinterpretations of Nature:

    1. Meat transmuting into worms.
    2. Meat transmuting into flies.
    3. Gold growing in the teeth of skeletons in the grave.
    4. Water in a container transmuting into bugs.
    5. Thunder being caused by niter.
    6. Water transmuting into fish in new ponds of water.

    Season's Greetings!!

    Illen
    Oh yes, you guessed it and all those above mentioned transmutations are intepreted as the changes brought by the workings of the Spiritus Mundi! I was planning to include those errors too and if any of you have another examples this is the right place for it.
    Last edited by True Initiate; 12-25-2011 at 05:10 PM.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by True Puffer View Post
    Oh yes, you guessed it and all those above mentioned transmutations are intepreted as the changes brought by the workings of the Spiritus Mundi! I was planning to include those errors too and if any of you have another examples this is the right place for it.
    One more:

    7. Gold "regrowing" in mined cavities after 20-30 years! (This is often reported).

    Illen

  3. #13
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    So science has proven that "spontaneous generation" is impossible? If this is the case then science seems quite constricting on the power of the imagination and of our limitless human potential. How would we ever make new discoveries if everything of value was "proven" to be impossible??
    Still Searching.............

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nibiru View Post
    So science has proven that "spontaneous generation" is impossible? If this is the case then science seems quite constricting on the power of the imagination and of our limitless human potential. How would we ever make new discoveries if everything of value was "proven" to be impossible??
    "Spontaneous generation" in these specific circumstances has been demonstrated to be impossible by correct observation. There are still numerous possibilities for spontaneous generation that have not been disproven. If someone disagrees with what modern science has demonstrated, then it is up to that person to "disprove" it. Merely saying so, or "believing it" to be true is not enough. Remember, that alchemical transmutation has NEVER been scientifically proven in modern times. Thus it remains a myth or fantasy, just like the Loch Ness Monster, until someone can demonstrate that it really can occur as stated by the ancients.

    Illen

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Illen A. Cluf View Post
    "Spontaneous generation" in these specific circumstances has been demonstrated to be impossible by correct observation. There are still numerous possibilities for spontaneous generation that have not been disproven. If someone disagrees with what modern science has demonstrated, then it is up to that person to "disprove" it. Merely saying so, or "believing it" to be true is not enough. Remember, that alchemical transmutation has NEVER been scientifically proven in modern times. Thus it remains a myth or fantasy, just like the Loch Ness Monster, until someone can demonstrate that it really can occur as stated by the ancients.

    Illen
    Hi Illen,

    Fantasies, and perhaps to be gentle, unprovable hypotheses, abounded. I'm sure it is much wider that most would believe. There are the intentional fabricators who are working the big con in the style of the period., there are the not very careful observers who don't control for individual cells of life, for small eggs and even holes big enough for mice to get through. There is wishful thinking galore. There are jargos that developed that may not mean what one thinks. What does "daiseychain: mean? Does it have to do with flowers, group sex or hard disks or ??? So 500 years from now some books that tell exactly how to create the 21st century philosopher's stone mention the philosopher's daisychain as a key operation. So what are they talking about?

    I see this type of cpmplication in vitamins and food supplents all the time. There is not any really good testing of any variety for many things. When they are tested they are ofte tested inadequately. Sometimes they are tested to disprove something, so like with Mythbusters, if they can't get the claimed results with the claimed methods change the methods untol the desired result is reached. So vitamin C and the claims Linus Pauling made had to be disproved. He claimed that doses of Vit C around 16+ grams a day would prevent a lot of diseases. To test that they tried 500mg. 500MG of vit C doesn't prevent flus or colds. However, the question of whether 16,000mg can prevent flu or cold, Pauling's claim, s is untested to this day. I claim that 30mg a day of methylcobalamin (real active b12) injections in 3x10mg SC injections, can reverse certain types of CNS damage. Reserchers claim that 1mg per month of cyanocobalamin (inactive official b12) does't not reverse those symptoms of neuroloigcal damage. These are two entirerly different things. Just becauae somebody claims to doing "X" doesn't mean that they are actually doing so. They might just be faking it to collect a bar bet.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by III View Post
    Hi Illen,

    Fantasies, and perhaps to be gentle, unprovable hypotheses, abounded. I'm sure it is much wider that most would believe. There are the intentional fabricators who are working the big con in the style of the period., there are the not very careful observers who don't control for individual cells of life, for small eggs and even holes big enough for mice to get through. There is wishful thinking galore. There are jargos that developed that may not mean what one thinks. What does "daiseychain: mean? Does it have to do with flowers, group sex or hard disks or ??? So 500 years from now some books that tell exactly how to create the 21st century philosopher's stone mention the philosopher's daisychain as a key operation. So what are they talking about?

    I see this type of cpmplication in vitamins and food supplents all the time. There is not any really good testing of any variety for many things. When they are tested they are ofte tested inadequately. Sometimes they are tested to disprove something, so like with Mythbusters, if they can't get the claimed results with the claimed methods change the methods untol the desired result is reached. So vitamin C and the claims Linus Pauling made had to be disproved. He claimed that doses of Vit C around 16+ grams a day would prevent a lot of diseases. To test that they tried 500mg. 500MG of vit C doesn't prevent flus or colds. However, the question of whether 16,000mg can prevent flu or cold, Pauling's claim, s is untested to this day. I claim that 30mg a day of methylcobalamin (real active b12) injections in 3x10mg SC injections, can reverse certain types of CNS damage. Reserchers claim that 1mg per month of cyanocobalamin (inactive official b12) does't not reverse those symptoms of neuroloigcal damage. These are two entirely different things. Just because somebody claims to doing "X" doesn't mean that they are actually doing so. They might just be faking it to collect a bar bet.
    Hi III. I couldn't agree more with your response. However, if anyone in the scientific community makes a claim that is significant, almost for sure, there will be those who will test that claim. If they find it to be false, I'm sure they wouldn't hesitate to make a name for themselves by making a counter-claim. Unfortunately, this doesn't always happen because of the insane and incredibly biased way that scientific research is funded. Research is often funded by those very industries which stand most to gain by certain conclusions. Any scientist attempting to make a counter claim will often be approached by representatives of those industries and asked to drop the claim or risk having the funding dropped. This goes on all the time, and I could never understand why there is no public outcry against industry sponsorship of scientific research. But we live in a politically corrupt world which is quietly supported by the apathy of the population at large.

    So Truth is a very elusive pursuit. There is the Truth that the elitist heads of some of the biggest corporations (e.g. Drug Industry) want us to believe, and there is the Truth that the poor, threatened and under-sponsored researcher would like us to address.

    But there are other Truths that we can all discover for ourselves. But without sharing the results in some convincing way, they have little relevance for the rest of us, and only helps continue the mistrust of such claims.

    Illen

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nibiru View Post
    So science has proven that "spontaneous generation" is impossible?
    Nibiru, I don't know whether or not these experiments have been validated by others or not.
    I'm just posting the link on the outside chance it might be of interest to you or other members.

    The Origin of Life Experiments by Dr. Andrija Puharich

    http://www.amazon.com/Origin-Life-Ex...4856093&sr=1-3

    http://www.puharich.nl/Bio/Elf_Magne...r_and_mind.pdf
    _____________________________________________

    Polonius: Do you know me, my lord?
    Hamlet: Excellent well; you're a fishmonger.
    Polonius: Not I, my lord.
    Hamlet: Then I would you were so honest a man.
    Polonius: Honest, my lord!
    Hamlet: Ay, sir; to be honest, as this world goes, is to be one man picked out of ten thousand.
    Polonius: That's very true, my lord.
    Hamlet: [Reads] For if the sun breed maggots in a dead dog, being a god kissing carrion, — Have you a daughter?
    Polonius: I have, my lord.
    Hamlet: Let her not walk i' the sun: conception is a blessing: but not as your daughter may conceive; — friend, look to 't.
    Polonius: [Aside] How say you by that? Still harping on my daughter: — yet he knew me not at first; he said I was a fishmonger: he is far gone, far gone: and truly in my youth I suffered much extremity for love; very near this.

    [Hamlet, act II, scene ii]
    Last edited by Albion; 12-26-2011 at 01:59 AM.

  8. #18
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    Merry Christmas Illen, and fellow Seekers



    Quote Originally Posted by Illen A. Cluf View Post
    "Spontaneous generation" in these specific circumstances has been demonstrated to be impossible by correct observation. There are still numerous possibilities for spontaneous generation that have not been disproven. If someone disagrees with what modern science has demonstrated, then it is up to that person to "disprove" it. Merely saying so, or "believing it" to be true is not enough. Remember, that alchemical transmutation has NEVER been scientifically proven in modern times. Thus it remains a myth or fantasy, just like the Loch Ness Monster, until someone can demonstrate that it really can occur as stated by the ancients.

    Illen
    Disproven to who? How does one prove something, by displaying the process in sequence leading to the desired results? If this is the case, then when does it become Truth or fact? Is it proven once I've shown it to you privately? If so, then once it has been "proven" to you is it still a myth for the rest of the population?? For something to be Truth must it be proven to everyone, a majority, or only a few?? If it must be proven to everyone, then nothing could ever be labeled as Truth or "proven". If I had found a cure for AIDS and the word had spread, this would be considered a myth to those who had heard the news. Now to those that had been cured it would be TRUTH/Proof, because it's in the pudding.. If this threads purpose is to discredit the potentially false methods with the honorable intention of saving the time and resources of mislead Seekers, then I'm all for it! On the other hand if it's purpose is to discredit all possible forms of "spontaneous generation", I would consider the concept a potential trap for any inspired Seeker of Truth...

    Everybody wishes magic were "real", but no one's willing to believe
    Last edited by Nibiru; 12-26-2011 at 05:29 AM.
    Still Searching.............

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albion View Post
    Nibiru, I don't know whether or not these experiments have been validated by others or not.
    I'm just posting the link on the outside chance it might be of interest to you or other members.
    Cool Albion, Thank You
    Still Searching.............

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nibiru View Post
    Merry Christmas Illen, and fellow Seekers
    Quote Originally Posted by Nibiru View Post

    Disproven to who? How does one prove something, by displaying the process in sequence leading to the desired results? If this is the case, then when does it become Truth or fact? Is it proven once I've shown it to you privately? If so, then once it has been "proven" to you is it still a myth for the rest of the population?? For something to be Truth must it be proven to everyone, a majority, or only a few?? If it must be proven to everyone, then nothing could ever be labeled as Truth or "proven". If I had found a cure for AIDS and the word had spread, this would be considered a myth to those who had heard the news. Now to those that had been cured it would be TRUTH/Proof, because it's in the pudding.. If this threads purpose is to discredit the potentially false methods with the honorable intention of saving the time and resources of mislead Seekers, then I'm all for it! On the other hand if it's purpose is to discredit all possible forms of "spontaneous generation", I would consider the concept a potential trap for any inspired Seeker of Truth...

    Everybody wishes magic were "real", but no one's willing to believe
    Hi Nibiru,

    And a merry christmas to you and the whole crew. What with divorces and spread out families my partner's family had their big get together last week and I had my kids and families over last night so it was just the two of us today, eating christmas dinner leftovers, which were very tasty. The whole "spontaneous generation" just looks like a distraction from evolving the being, no matter how it works out.


    Many people actually don't want to be healed from their long term chronic diseases. I can't tell you why except that for some reason they identify with it. People that have dealt 20 years building their identity around the disease makes it unlikely that they actually want to be cured. I have seen this over and over. Instead they build belief systems that tend to prevent them from doing the things that would actually heal them. They would rather take certain supplements and rightiously suffer "detox" from the riddence of certain hypothetical toxins, often mercury, in the body. They suffer this for years and tears and getting worse and worse. Sometimes it ends and sometimes people don't quite the cause of the "detox" until they can no longer take it. So far, with the cooperation of some people, 100% of those willing the try the "cure" for "detox". The cures indicate one or more of these three things.
    1. Lack of potassium induced by startup response to mb12/adb12/Metafolin
    2. Induced severe deficiency of methylfolate (Metafolin) caused by NAC, NAC plus other glutathione precursors including un-denatured whey and if continued more than two days begins to accumulate additional b12 deficiency symptoms
    3. Paradoxical methylfolate deficiency caused by inability for body to convert folic acid and/or folinic acid-vegetble food source folate (folinic acid) and if continued more than two weeks begins to accumulate additional b12 deficiency symptoms.
    The cure works with an 8mg dose of Metafolin to begin and some of the right brands of methylb12/adenosylb12 sublinguals, and continue with similar Metafolin & b12s doses as symptons fall off until adjusting the dose after all symptoms are gone. It works about 100% of timefor those trying it. All it takes is a willingness of people to put down their rightous sufferring in the name of the favored toxification hypothesis. Many won't try it because it isn't "proven" and because that would mean that their toxification hypotheisis is wrong. Puzzling disorders artract all sorts of hypotheses that turn out to be completely wrong with people terribly attached to their incorrect hypotheses. One person at a time can demonstrate that it appears to work for them. Thousands have demonstrated this and a few additional hypotheses about mb12/adb12/Metafolin. They have all had the predicted effects and many are in process of healing. Proof is an entirely different thing. Despite response being predictable at 85-100% of selected group based on responses to questions the right groups of people haven't relicated the test several times with official results and isn't "proven". Who is going to spend hundreds of millions of dollars to do the tests and repeat/verify when the substances used are OTC or prescription vitamins and no big profits in sight and will end the sale of billions and billions of dollars per year of certain phamaceuticals, which by the way are not "Detox" but rather what they were trying to cure when "detox" started.
    Last edited by III; 12-26-2011 at 08:09 PM.

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