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  1. #1

    golden water experiment

    Just grazing through the board, I noticed some persons aren't talked about, and curious as to why, so excuse my barging the subject. I'm sure you all know ***'s publications for making the stone from urine and dew salt. (I like the first process for its simplicity and readily-available ingredients; better to have a stone that can be multipled with things easily had from one's own cistern.) As for dew, some say its salt is a federally regulated commodity.

    I started the golden water process last year, letting it ferment in plastic jugs for a year before, separating the dregs with repeated cohobations, distillations and filtering, but I just couldn't seem to get the crystals to form. Some residue formed on the flask that just wouldn't wash off, then learned that was Helmont's salt I'd apparently missed capturing; well it should be in the product. Anyway, I added some nitric acid, that seemed to get the crystals forming, the first were sort of cheesey, I tried collecting and drying at low heat in an oven and they just disappeared. I figured it was a failure and was ready to throw the left-over orange colored fluid away but thought heck, why not just leave it alone and see what happens. So it's sitting in an open plastic bowl in my basement which is just above freezing, and more crystals have formed on the surface. I think I'll just let all the moisture evaporate. I'd be afraid to cook them with gold for the obvious risks, but I dipped a finger just to taste the solution, salty initially but sweet later. I had to lie down, I could feel it dredging my liver and other things, I thought wow, there's really something to this alchemy stuff, beyond the mere motions we go through. Anyway I've collected several 5 gal jugs of ammoniated water with a couple cups of the crude salt, waiting for the confidence and insight to know exactly how to proceed. There are several directions a person can go to process the crude salt, I've more carbaloys fermenting just in case I muck up. Has anyone here had any success following ***'s instructions?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by thrival View Post
    As for dew, some say its salt is a federally regulated commodity.
    If you're referring to Ammonium Nitrate (NH4NO3), it can be used as a fertilizer but also for explosives, so I wouldn't be surprised if it's regulated.

    Quote Originally Posted by thrival View Post
    I'm sure you all know ***'s publications for making the stone from urine
    Are you referring to 'The Mystery of Urine', taken from 'Potpurri Alchemia' in the RAMS collection?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Androgynus View Post
    Are you referring to 'The Mystery of Urine', taken from 'Potpurri Alchemia' in the RAMS collection?
    Hi Androgynus,
    It seems to me that he's talking about N D C's Covenant of Silence document.

    Illen

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    Quote Originally Posted by Illen A. Cluf View Post
    It seems to me that he's talking about N D C's Covenant of Silence document.
    Yes, mostly containing recipes that are basically copy/paste jobs from various authors.
    To his credit, in most cases he did mention the actual authors/sources of the published methods.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Thrival,

    Which one of the urine methods (re-published by ***) are you referring to?

    What do you consider 'Helmont's Salt' to be?

    Also, adding Nitric Acid to assist with the crystal formation sounds interesting... I don't recall this addition being mentioned in the text...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Androgynus View Post
    Yes, mostly containing recipes that are basically copy/paste jobs from various authors.
    To his credit, in most cases he did mention the actual authors/sources of the published methods.
    .
    Most of his more important recipes were taken directly from the RAMS publications. Another was taken directly from Manly Hall's Secret Teachings of All Times.

    In my opinion, his recipes were of a chemical or archemical nature, rather than alchemical. Thus he could only have made a vegetable or pseudo Stone at best.

    Illen

  6. #6
    Wow, lots to answer.

    Yes I was following the "Covenant of Silence" instructions also found in the RAMS Digital Library. I would not accuse him of making a pseudo-stone, not if it does the job. There's more than one stone or one path.

    I probably erred in processing, I just never feel I'm doing it right. Basically is a distillation of urine and separation of the ammoniated water from it's crude red salt, the latter calcined/dried at low heat, then cohobated with the distilled portion for a week or two, then repeated distillations; the third time a salt is supposed to form in the distillation tube, but in my case was using nylon pneumatic line as my cooling coil which is opaque. The distillation flask developed a fog etched into the glass, I take this to be Helmon't salt. After the third distillation/cohobation I tried filtering and evaporating to get the skin that's supposed to form, but it wouldn't, so I added some nitric acid. That got crystals started but like I said, small and kind of cheesy. I put the coffee filter holding them in a low temp oven, the filter became a mess and was more or less destroyed, the crystal goo unrecoverable. What was left in the liquid is pale orange, the crystals forming look like surface bubbles in a sense. Something else about mere tasting them, a few images passed through my brain while resting, extremely vivid, beautiful colors, not unlike what I tend to experience taking B-12 before bed. I thought wow, if a brain could work like that all the time, would be pretty awesome.

    And this gets me to thinking.

    Glauber is very thorough and detailed in the theory behind alchemy, he mentions how the ancients could get their starting material from anything because the subject is in everything, (but some materials are better than others, of course.)

    I know some of you guys have been working with salt, repeated heating and dryings. Have you thought of doing that with nitre?

    Also, forgetting alchemy for the moment, but dealing with modern nutrition: consider the Krebs cycle, or organic acids found in the body, or mineral deficiencies we are all suffering, whether we know it or not, due to glyco-phosphate (Round-Up) weed-killer, that works by sequestering nutrients in the soil, which affects crops too, while the weeds seem to've found a genetic work-around. I read that crops have 50% less nutrition than 40 years ago, due to modern farming practices. We're all slowly starving to death. Any kind of sex life accelerates nutrient loss, substances made in abundance while young; (I could write a book on that but others already have.)

    I believe it was Helmont who disagreed with the philosophers of his day, that there was one universal medicine, but that health could be had by personal, selective diet (since not everyone suffers from the same deficiencies or excesses.) Prof. Arnold Ehret set the record for fasting, advocated a low-phlegm, high mineral salt diet, personally prescribed for every patient. His system follows Hippocrates' work, who I believe Jesus probably had access to (written around 500 B.C) in the Alexandrian library. (Graduating from Hippocrates' school required a 40 day fast.) Now obviously no one goes on a 40 day fast cold-turkey, it takes practice, a knowledge-base, valid theory. So I think this becoming a "son of God" is a process that apart from fasting, entails intelligent diet along with ingesting alchemical substances.

    Uh, I guess I wandered from my original subject.

    If you have the RAMS library, check out what Glauber has to say on the animal stone.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Androgynus View Post
    What do you consider 'Helmont's Salt' to be?
    Fact that it etches glass-- ammonium silicate?

    Quote Originally Posted by Androgynus View Post
    Also, adding Nitric Acid to assist with the crystal formation sounds interesting... I don't recall this addition being mentioned in the text...
    Well obviously it's not, I'd have tried nitre but that would contaminate with the potassium salt, which still might work. But now I've got something that could be very unsafe to mix with gold under heat and confined spaces, ...or not.
    Last edited by Andro; 02-04-2013 at 02:46 AM. Reason: It's much clearer using quotation brackets to tell the quotes from the main text :)

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    hi thrival,

    Quote Originally Posted by thrival View Post
    (I like the first process for its simplicity and readily-available ingredients; better to have a stone that can be multipled with things easily had from one's own cistern.)
    Also interested in knowing what process you're talking about. Are you referring to any of these? (link to gw stone and alkahest)


    Quote Originally Posted by thrival View Post
    I tried collecting and drying at low heat in an oven and they just disappeared. I figured it was a failure and was ready to throw the left-over orange colored fluid away but thought heck, why not just leave it alone and see what happens. So it's sitting in an open plastic bowl in my basement which is just above freezing, and more crystals have formed on the surface.
    I'm curious to know why this happened.. the forming of more crystals part.
    Last edited by Kiorionis; 02-03-2013 at 09:40 PM.
    Art is Nature in the flask; Nature is a vial thing.

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    Thoughts on N.D.C's Covenant Of Silence?

    Just finished reading it.Has pretty interesting stuff inside.Has anyone had any experiences with it?

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    Can anyone inform me what alchemical text, if any, is the origin source of GW work? And if not, what text, if any, is the main "go to" source?

    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.


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