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Thread: Aspects of Alchemy

  1. #271
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    Quote Originally Posted by elixirmixer View Post
    Does everyone realise that the standard Spagyric work is just a dumbed down, safer version of making the stone, except that the plant elixirs are actually specified, while the stone is not.

    Well that's how I see it anyway, and I'm really not sure how else to see it. I certainly do not attribute Spagyrics with old school big pharma. To me it is the foundation of the Holy Art. Not to be confused with experimental chemistry. Spagyrics philosophy exists in the same realms as our alchemical theories.

    Spagyrics is specifically the encapsulation and purification of the three principals, which are philosophical in nature, and one does not require any knowledge of chemistry at all to perform this art (although it is an obvious advantage)

    I am slightly offended, that you imply that spagyrics is a lowly form of medicine. Elixir Mixer is sad
    Look at the history of the word and you will see why it was applied to pharmaceutical "chymistry". It was coined by Paracelsus and adopted by his iatrochemical followers. The objective of these people was to make medicines, not the Philosophers' Stone and transmutation. Paracelsus himself even confessed in one of his authentic books that he had not made the Stone. To him "alchemy" was more about making medicines. So from the very beginning "spagyrics" was attached to medicine. This is in stark contrast to the literature of the alchemists, where the Stone and transmutation reigns as the ultimate goal. Compare typical alchemical works, like those of Ripley or Norton, for example, to those of Paracelsus (his authentic works) and his followers. There is barely any similitude at all.

    As for the plant "elixirs": they have nothing to do with the Philosophers' Stone. Totally different substances. It's almost like saying that aspirin is just a "dumbed down, safer version" of the Stone!!! Can aspirin or any so-called plant elixir change metals into silver and gold? Don't think so. People need to actually read more what the actual alchemists (not modern "New Age" gurus) say about the subject and how they clearly distinguished between their methods and objectives and those of "sophists", "puffers" and "vulgar chymists", with their multitude of processes and methods. Regarding medicinal objectives, the alchemists generally were only interested in the Philosophers' Stone and the remarkable therapeutic properties they attributed to it. All other medicines were considered inferior and not worth wasting much time and money on.

  2. #272
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    This is going a bit off topic so we may need a new thread ? or not.

    Using the materials required for the Great Work:

    1. The Agent
    2. The Patient

    Working these two upon each other we get the Alchemic Blackness = Putrefaction,
    and then continuing on through the many colors till it gives up the Quintessence
    after some time and many operations.

    To my understanding this is a (possibly the only) Alchemic Process.

    If this Process does not take place then there is no Alchemy happening, therefore
    there is no Alchemist doing the said Work.

  3. #273
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    I would love to ask you were is the putrefaction in the Dry Path exactly? In reduction of Regulus?
    Formerly known as True Puffer

  4. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by True Initiate View Post
    I would love to ask you were is the putrefaction in the Dry Path exactly? In reduction of Regulus?
    Being only a student/researcher of Alchemy I don't think that I'm sufficiently
    equipped to answer that question at the moment.

    But I will say that I view it (the terms wet and dry way) as a bit of a stumbling
    block to confuse rather than to clarify the ease of the work involved.

    This may sound like a bit of a naive opinion .... but that's ok for a student.

    It is most simple for the old maters to describe the Great Work in the deepest
    of convoluted and impenetrable jargon that we become totally lost in this maze
    if we do not have the eye to read their simple meaning.

  5. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by black View Post
    Being only a student/researcher of Alchemy I don't think that I'm sufficiently
    equipped to answer that question at the moment.

    But I will say that I view it (the terms wet and dry way) as a bit of a stumbling
    block to confuse rather than to clarify the ease of the work involved.

    This may sound like a bit of a naive opinion .... but that's ok for a student.

    It is most simple for the old maters to describe the Great Work in the deepest
    of convoluted and impenetrable jargon that we become totally lost in this maze
    if we do not have the eye to read their simple meaning.
    I felt a need to expand a little on the previous post.

    If the old masters can keep the multitude of would-be alchemists dancing to the many
    supposed tunes in their writings ... those many dancers will not have the time or the
    peace of mind to contemplate the true Alchemic symphony that is continually playing
    in the background of the Great Written works.

    We need to attune our Alchemic Senses of Sight, Hearing, Feeling and possibly
    other senses that transcend this physical reality so that we may also transcend from
    what we are now via the Great Work to a more evolved consciousness.

    And of cause all the other stuff as well ... gold, gold, silver, medicine, gold, long life,
    even more gold and possibly even immortality with infinite amounts of gold.

  6. #276
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    Quote Originally Posted by True Initiate View Post
    I would love to ask you were is the putrefaction in the Dry Path exactly? In reduction of Regulus?
    Are you sure there even is a "regulus" to begin with in the "Dry Path"? Unless by "regulus" you here mean "metal" in general and not just antimony regulus specifically. But all such reduction operations belong to ordinary chemistry, even though they can be used by the alchemist himself, they are not absolutely necessary, as one can easily procure perfectly fine metals like the metallurgical industry offers them to the public and not have to bother reducing or purifying them. Plus one can also have recourse to some of their compounds, some of which occur naturally (i.e. minerals/ores.) In fact, the anonymous visitor in Helvetius' account preferred them over using the metals directly:

    "Yet, in the mean while, I again and again requested information of him, whether this Philosophick Work, required great Charges in the preparing, and a very long Time. O my Friend, answered he, you very accurately affect to know all things, yet I will open this to you; The Charge is not great, nor is the Time long. But, as touching the matter of which our Arcanum is made, I would have you to know; there are only two Metals and Minerals, of which it is prepared. And because the Sulphur of Philosophers is more abundant in these Minerals, therefore it is made of them.

    Then I again asked him: What the Menstruum was, and whether the Operations were made in Glasses, or in Crucibles. He answered; The Menstruum is a Celestial Salt, or a Salt of Celestial Virtue, by the benefit of which, Philosophers only dissolve the Terrene Metallick Body, and in dissolving, the noble Elixir of Philosophers is produced."


    What one cannot obtain from ordinary chemistry is the secret solvent, since it knows JACK-SQUAT about its preparation. There is NO CHOICE here but to know about alchemy, which gravitates around the preparation and use of this special solvent. Ordinary chemistry cannot help here. Not even the more arcane "chymistry" can, as it also failed to discover this special solvent of the alchemists (but chymistry can still provide some peculiar "menstruums" that will have interesting effects on some metals.)

  7. #277
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    Logistical Note: Continued from HERE.

    Quote Originally Posted by JDP View Post
    Welcome to the perennial conundrum & contradiction of all those who actually take that whole "universal solvent" thing quite literally. Kunckel used to mock their beliefs by pointing out one pertinent fact: if this thing really dissolves "everything", then how can you possibly prepare it or store it? It would dissolve the vessels used for the purpose!
    Hence why the texts are most probably referring to a person's internal metal, the body being the one vessel.

    Alchemy, Transmutation of the Soul- The Great Work

    Base Metal into Gold: The Process of the Soul's Transmutation by Anne Baring: A highly recommended read.

    Ghislain


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    Last edited by Andro; 03-22-2018 at 12:30 PM. Reason: Posts moved & quote added for relevance and continuity.

  8. #278
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghislain View Post
    Hence why the texts are most probably referring to a person's internal metal, the body being the one vessel.

    Alchemy, Transmutation of the Soul- The Great Work

    Base Metal into Gold: The Process of the Soul's Transmutation by Anne Baring: A highly recommended read.

    Ghislain
    Or in fact something infinitely more plausible, logical and in accordance to the historical context in which the expression appeared than such modern misinterpretations of alchemy... I will let Fulcanelli explain it, since he did a very nice job at it:

    Thus it has been called the universal solvent, not because it is capable of dissolving all bodies in nature --- as many wrongly believe --- but because it can do everything in the small universe which the Great Work constitutes.

    The mistake many made was to take such a denomination as "universal solvent" totally literally. It obviously does not dissolve literally "everything", otherwise the subject would fall into impossible paradoxes like those Kunckel pointed out.

  9. #279
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    I would like to thank JDP, for without his comment...

    Quote Originally Posted by JDP View Post
    Welcome to the perennial conundrum & contradiction of all those who actually
    take that whole "universal solvent" thing quite literally. Kunckel used to mock their beliefs by
    pointing out one pertinent fact: if this thing really dissolves "everything", then how can you possibly
    prepare it or store it? It would dissolve the vessels used for the purpose!
    ...I would not have stumbled upon...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghislain View Post
    ...which I have just finished reading from beginning to end.

    The greatest alchemical text I have ever read.

    Synchronicity in action!

    Ghislain

  10. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghislain View Post
    I would like to thank JDP, for without his comment...



    ...I would not have stumbled upon...



    ...which I have just finished reading from beginning to end.

    The greatest alchemical text I have ever read.

    Synchronicity in action!

    Ghislain
    I don't know why, as my comment had nothing to do with such modern misinterpretations of alchemy. You should read my follow-up comment, which will put you back on the right track.

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