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Thread: Talisman Ritual

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axismundi000 View Post
    zoas23 apart from anything else I think it is just not practical to advise people what they should do or if they are 'ready'. There is so much info and technique freely available on line and in paperback print that it simply doesn't matter. The talisman outline I provided is available in numerous variations perhaps I was a little more usefully concise, nothing more. Similarly it doesn't really matter what you or I think about each other's praxis or preferred paradigm. If yours works for you zoas23 I am glad.

    If you haven't looked at Francis King's Alchemical Ritual in complete GD it's only two pages long, I would recommend having a read of it. Tell me what you think.
    Oh, that's simply my advice... I won't fly to Australia to stop ElixirMixer from doing whatever he wants to do. I am aware that what you have posted in easy to find online in 1,000 different websites.

    I've read your suggestion. It's certainly based on other ideas about the sixth chapter of the Sepher Yetzirah (short version) and the "dragon" ThLY and it's oppositions and the one thing that creates a balance. It's OK... though I would change a lot of things there. The best published source I know about the logic involved in the magical part of it would be the Sepher Yetzirah by Kaplan (I especially mean his comments about ThLY and what it is... and the relation it has with the nodes). It is a bit similar to some healing procedures which I have never seen published, but the theory is missing there (if you REALLY understand the magical theory that he is applying, then I should say that I would be surprised since it's 100% based on papers which I have never seen circulating in public and which are quite complex*).

    *I mean the qabalistic and alchemical interpretation of the hardest chapter of the Sepher Yetzirah, which isn't exactly "easy" to understand... The book by Kaplan goes quite far in that sense, though it's not the complete explanation, but it's a VERY good basis.

  2. #22
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    I'm not so certain the board-breaking analogy really works to make your point zoas23, as the way martial artists build up to that, is exactly that; a building up of the bones in the hand by reshaping the cartilage, caused from attempts at breaking the board, over and over and over. They hit it repeatedly, building up the hands until one day they are conditioned enough that they can strike the board and break it without breaking their hand.
    If we turn this to the magickal working; it would suggest that he should try it, and keep trying it until he finally gets it.

    I am a MOSTLY self-taught martial artist, because I never had the money to go to a dojo, and when I have had the money, I didn't have the time. (I live in a rural area, would have to find time off on the right days and make the long tiresome drive both ways...)
    I have done some "proper" martial art schooling. My preferred art is Japanese swordsmanship. I spent years watching kata videos on YouTube and copying (like you would in a dojo...) and I've actually done some kendo - and impressed the instructor by how quickly I caught on and how sharp my reactions were. If I had had the money for the armor I would have been sparring the instructor all the time as he so badly wanted to spar with me because of how good I had gotten myself without formal instruction. It is a rarity, but it can be done.

    I'll give an analogy myself: anyone can pull up videos and the newest information on the best way to do CPR. Anyone can go spend the money to take a class and get certified to do CPR. I went through a class and am certified to be an EMT. CPR was one of my favorite things in the class, and I was good at it.
    First time I worked an actual code, I relieved the bystander who was doing chest compressions. Do you know how different it is to do CPR to a dummy vs a real human? An artificial construct/theoretical prop, vs the real thing? The first time you feel the ribs break under your hands you will.
    I went through the schooling, and aced it. But the schooling is nothing like the real thing. I've learned more in the year I've actually been on the ambulance, actually doing and seeing and putting my hands to the work, than what the schools can possibly teach.

    Magick/alchemy is the same way. My 14th birthday was my "alchemy birthday" - all the money I got went into books, and I spent subsequent months pouring myself into them, and them into my head.
    When I actually put my hands to the work though... The books clicked, and I began learning so much more, beyond the pages. There is no better teacher than experience.
    Is it dangerous? Everything is. Any and everything could kill you at any moment. Pursue what you love, research it, and put your hands to the fire to be tested by it.

    Elixirmixer may very well have more to learn. The Art will be happy to school him if he lets it.

    Study, study until you can't study anymore. Take a deep breath, clear your mind, and then try it; go beyond studying and do it. Don't just be a student, be a practitioner.
    (If ya want.)



    ~Seth-Ra
    -Resident Sword Sorcerer
    One fatal tree there stands of knowledge called, forbidden them to taste. Knowledge forbidden? Suspicious. Reasonless. And why should their Lord envy them that? Can it be sin to know? Can it be death? And do they stand by ignorance, is that their happy state, the proof of their obedience and their faith?

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seth-Ra View Post
    My preferred art is Japanese swordsmanship.

    ~Seth-Ra
    -Resident Sword Sorcerer
    I practice Aikido, we should probably get together sometime
    Art is Nature in the flask; Nature is a vial thing.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiorionis View Post
    I practice Aikido, we should probably get together sometime
    Absolutely!

    PM me about it.
    One fatal tree there stands of knowledge called, forbidden them to taste. Knowledge forbidden? Suspicious. Reasonless. And why should their Lord envy them that? Can it be sin to know? Can it be death? And do they stand by ignorance, is that their happy state, the proof of their obedience and their faith?

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seth-Ra View Post
    Absolutely!

    PM me about it.
    Done.
    Art is Nature in the flask; Nature is a vial thing.

  6. #26
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    So Zoas23, or anyone else, what would be the correct starting point.

    For instance, in alchemy, it is usually encouraged to start with procuring the Seven Basics and then maybe a Ens Melissa and finally the Minus Opus or Vegetable Stone, before moving on to more advanced procedures.

    Is there a similar Jacobs Ladder toward practical theurgical magic? Is there a difference, between these types of rituals and what they call 'High Magic' or Theurgy?

    I am on a similar path to Axis it seems, in that, ?he/she? has been learning hermeticism and has naturally progressed from ritual magic into alchemy. I have began my works in Alchemy, but for the sake of mastering the hermetic umbrella, am deeply interested in ritual magic.

    I'm a practical person, which is why i probably migrated towards alchemy before kabalistic studies, and that is just the thing, i have struggled to find practical application for this type of work.

    If Axis is making the same metallic oils as which I am interested in, and also making, and is ?he/she? has a special ritual that they believe will make a difference and help them grow, then I want in.

    I'm interested on peoples opinions of how I should progress, and I may start practising some pent. hex. middle pillar stuff as a warm up to perform these talisman magics.

    It is warned against in the bible, but maybe a slap in the face from an Angel is what I need
    Last edited by elixirmixer; 11-19-2016 at 03:42 AM. Reason: spelling
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  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by elixirmixer View Post
    For instance, in alchemy, it is usually encouraged to start with procuring the Seven Basics and then maybe a Ens Melissa and finally the Minus Opus or Vegetable Stone, before moving on to more advanced procedures.
    From what I understand, these are all spagyric preparations. Not alchemical preparations.

    But that I'd as far as my understanding goes.
    Art is Nature in the flask; Nature is a vial thing.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiorionis View Post
    From what I understand, these are all spagyric preparations. Not alchemical preparations.

    But that I'd as far as my understanding goes.
    This is true, but spagyrics is usually learnt in the beginning of learning alchemy isn't it? And if then, spagyrics is combines with practical ritualistic magic, it can then become quite alchemical.
    Join me; on a voyage of stupidity, and self discovery: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=vccZSHroTG4

  9. #29
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    And if then, spagyrics is combines with practical ritualistic magic, it can then become quite alchemical.
    I would say it becomes "high spagyrics" at that point. In my own mind, 'alchemy' is very specific
    Art is Nature in the flask; Nature is a vial thing.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by elixirmixer View Post
    So Zoas23, or anyone else, what would be the correct starting point.

    For instance, in alchemy, it is usually encouraged to start with procuring the Seven Basics and then maybe a Ens Melissa and finally the Minus Opus or Vegetable Stone, before moving on to more advanced procedures.

    Is there a similar Jacobs Ladder toward practical theurgical magic? Is there a difference, between these types of rituals and what they call 'High Magic' or Theurgy?
    The starting point should be working with yourself. Creating a strong "armor".

    The difference between this and very advances practices is not as BIG as you imagine, the main difference is that advanced practices involve working with very unbalanced forces and they also involve something that I would call a "controlled psychosis". Maybe you've heard the famous phrase by Dalí: "the only difference between a madman and me is that I am not mad"...

    So you need to create a strong "armor" first...

    And forget the idea of a "High Magic"... the most simple and basic rituals are as powerful as the most advanced ones. Never look down or underestimate the power of the "simple" and "basic" rituals.... they are the true core, the "prima materia" of magic. The comparison between "basic spagyrics" and "Alchemy" is not truly accurate in this case (well, that's my opinion).

    You know, after YEARS of practice and advancing to the most mind-blowing ceremonies, you may find yourself one day returning to the first things you did and saying: "Oh wow! EVERYTHING was already there".

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