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Thread: Deathlessness

  1. #41
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    48
    Shaktipat is not Deekshai its similar but it not what you are thinking

    Can one attain Deekshai without contacting with any Guru?
    yes with many years practising Trāṭaka under various conditions
    but many go to a qualified Guru to receive it a lot quicker

    "With a techniques of Yoga like Pranayamam, VaasiYogam it will take lot of births for one to achieve Divinity. Only after extreme Yogas it is possible for one to achieve divine wisdom and after getting divine wisdom only one can get divine pleasure and divine bliss."
    this is saying you can get divine wisdom through Yoga techniques but it will take many births or extreme practise of them
    its not bashing it

    Yoga Sastram tells that the Kunadlini is in the end of spinal cord. We donot want that. TiruArutPrakasa Vallalar has clearly told that Pranayam or any other breathing practice will not lead one to to the Supreme Lord
    Yes the Gnana Deham state (union with the lord) brought on by Penance cannot be achieved by breathing practises alone
    focus on raising the Kundalini is not the Goal

    To be honest, this latter quote is totally messy and suspicious.
    using techniques to activate cryptochrome (magnetoreception)
    Changing the chemistry in the brain by training their eyes in different conditions
    using low level light environment and mirrors to increase the size of the retinas too pick up higher frequencies of light
    Very primitive indeed...
    check it out Tamil is the oldest civilization
    I've studied siddhas techniques, I know the effect they have on the brain and what equipment/conditions they use
    the techniques are not Primitive at all

    Worship any people who have seen him(lord). Fall on the feet of those person who were teaching this education."
    "“Did i shy to worship my Guru”
    “Did i forget to give Kaanikai(offerings) to my Guru”
    These were the words conveyed by vallalar in his book “ManuMurai Kanda Vaasakam”. So be humble and learn this education from the guru. Do divine donation."
    (worship to a Guru is not like worship to God its like paying homage)

    Their site has no texts on transcendental experience, on the nature of the things, nothing. It would be interesting to read more on those things, on the nature of Deekshai, etc
    yes only in person will you really get taught , there are various devotees with sites to Vallalaar some with more info than others
    Siddhas have been predominantly scripturless , trusting training and teaching in person
    before having to give my last hard-earned money as some required divine offering.
    you don't have to give them any money, you have the option to offer various fruits to them as an offering
    real Siddhas/Gurus will turn you away if you offer them money for their methods and training

    "Without donations no one can get divine wisdom."
    would be more Honest of you if you cited the whole thing
    So important thing for people like us who have learnt immortal education (saakaa kalvi) is to do penance and also give donations to the needy.
    In the world whomsoever it may be without penance no one can gain divine wisdom. Without donations no one can get divine wisdom. This is divine truth. The good quality/character of a person who does penance is charity/donation. This is considered as a qualification for a person who is doing penance. So Penance and Donation goes hand in hand.
    We should donate. We should become philanthropist. Donation is of various types. We can donate anything that we have.
    the translation is a bit off, though it is clearly saying giving to others
    and without the spirit of charity you will get no Divine Wisdom

    I have shown you why I think that those people are just some creepy sect
    you offered 6 points based on an opinion without any 1st hand experience
    the principles and teachings of Siddhas are not creepy at all
    Vallalar Principles
    Universal brotherhoodness
    Treating all souls are equal.
    Creating awareness to individual's self diciplines
    The God is one for all and worshipping Him as Vast Grace Light or ArutperunJothi
    No killing of animals
    No eating of flesh
    Jeeva Karunaya ; Showing mercy to hungry and feeding them.
    Just with clean heart tell me, do you yourself believe them? Do you have any actual transcendental experience from Deekshai or just something which can be explained by hypnosis, trance, impressionability or something like that? And I will be glad to read more of their books on the Universe, Nature, etc., what I have read so far has a lot of "water" (I am not sure about the proper English idiom here) and contradicts most of the Eastern teachings.
    yes what you experience from Deekshai is a transcendental experience
    Deekshai has a physical effect on the eyes (activation of cryptochrome), and Penance brings a very strong sensation in the eyes
    its not hypnosis or a trance it has very specific side effects

    again you need to go visit, talk and learn in person
    that's what all real Siddhas endorse over any written material
    that's really been the underlining point in this entire thread
    Last edited by Kibric; 6 Days Ago at 04:07 PM.

  2. #42
    Perhaps you are right, but there is little actual information about their teaching around (and whatever there is, is quite suspicious).

    I want to believe that they are real masters of their kind, but so far they sound suspiciously similar to fake ones (for the reasons I listed and for some others). Hence I also ask you - do you yourself honestly believe them? Or do you have some seeds of doubt? Do they have something actually extraordinary to back-up their claims - some very deep knowledge of this world, of the Divine, etc.? What makes you believe that what they say is true and not just side-effects of stimulation of Ajna? Do you have some fear that 20-30 years later you might realize that all this Deekshai deathless thing is just nonsence and that your body has greatly aged, and that even practicing some Yoga would do more good physically than Penance?

    Just visiting them isn't exactly an easy task. I need to feed 3 people outside of me, one of them is totally helpless, so it isn't trivial for me just to drop everything for a couple of weeks to visit some people in distant land. And I became very pragmatical and skeptical over years, because there are tons of fake teachings and charlatans who only know how to fill their purse with your money, or who totally live in some imaginary world where they are like gods but can barely treat any half-serious disease. So for now my option is to learn some Tamil and read the Deathless' books to get better idea on what they are about. Do they have more information about their teaching and practices available to read on Tamil language?

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    48
    Perhaps you are right, but there is little actual information about their teaching around (and whatever there is, is quite suspicious).
    I want to believe that they are real masters of their kind, but so far they sound suspiciously similar to fake ones (for the reasons I listed and for some others).
    you are incredibly cynical, not everything is a cult
    I saw popular Holy men wearing gold watches, so i decided any master who wears a gold watch was not for me
    i found there are real masters but they're entirely disinterested in civilization. They don't like money or wear gold watches
    they will ask you to eat nuts and berries, bury yourself in dirt and bathe your self in the sun. Go back to a simpler nature

    Hence I also ask you - do you yourself honestly believe them? Or do you have some seeds of doubt? Do they have something actually extraordinary to back-up their claims - some very deep knowledge of this world, of the Divine, etc.?
    yes I honestly know it, when you experience something and you know it, you've done it, it happened to you
    what others believe doesn't matter

    What makes you believe that what they say is true and not just side-effects of stimulation of Ajna?
    a good question. Vallalar's teachings is that the soul is in the middle of your head, and is a light (Jothi)
    The light shines out of the Left Eye (Moon) and the Right Eye (Sun), the ajna associated as being the seat of the soul (light)
    Penance physically changes the eye's then the body, when you practise it you can measure the changes to your own body
    after intense Penance the persons eyes shine, the eyes are bright
    Sadai Swamigal

    a famous Siddha Thangal Mouna

    Do you have some fear that 20-30 years later you might realize that all this Deekshai deathless thing is just nonsence and that your body has greatly aged, and that even practicing some Yoga would do more good physically than Penance?
    no, i can measure the effects on my own body and you can see it on others who practise Penance too
    you are in no way limited from practising other stuff as well

    Just visiting them isn't exactly an easy task. I need to feed 3 people outside of me, one of them is totally helpless, so it isn't trivial for me just to drop everything for a couple of weeks to visit some people in distant land. And I became very pragmatical and skeptical over years, because there are tons of fake teachings and charlatans who only know how to fill their purse with your money, or who totally live in some imaginary world where they are like gods but can barely treat any half-serious disease
    it is exactly what you need to really find something unbelievable
    there are a lot of charlatans who make us bitter but studying Siddhas reveals some special things

    So for now my option is to learn some Tamil and read the Deathless' books to get better idea on what they are about. Do they have more information about their teaching and practices available to read on Tamil language?
    a lot of the information you are looking for is in Tamil
    it is because of the language barrier and the availability to the western world
    that it is hard to get an in-depth knowledge of Vallalar teachings/practises/poems

    the below links has the names of books written by Vallalaar in Tamil
    a lot of the links are dead, so tracking down the books is a bit difficult but not impossible
    https://groups.google.com/forum/#!to...ps/mTvtV3Af6SU
    http://vallalargroupsmessages.blogsp...lar-books.html

    this links contains e-books
    http://vallalarmission.org/vallalar-e-books/





    Last edited by Kibric; 4 Days Ago at 01:32 AM.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Kibric View Post
    you are incredibly cynical, not everything is a cult
    Yes, I probably am
    I saw popular Holy men wearing gold watches, so i decided any master who wears a gold watch was not for me
    i found there are real masters but they're entirely disinterested in civilization. They don't like money or wear gold watches
    they will ask you to eat nuts and berries, bury yourself in dirt and bathe your self in the sun. Go back to a simpler nature
    I think that both extremes are wrong - aiming for all riches of this world and totally isolating yourself from this world. When people start dealing with absolute Black and White in this multi-colored world, I am starting to feel very uneasy if not frightened.
    no, i can measure the effects on my own body and you can see it on others who practise Penance too
    you are in no way limited from practising other stuff as well
    I am sincerely interested in the way how you measure those effects. What exactly are the effects, and how they can be seen on others?
    the below links has the names of books written by Vallalaar in Tamil
    a lot of the links are dead, so tracking down the books is a bit difficult but not impossible
    https://groups.google.com/forum/#!to...ps/mTvtV3Af6SU
    http://vallalargroupsmessages.blogsp...lar-books.html

    this links contains e-books
    http://vallalarmission.org/vallalar-e-books/
    Thank you, I will look and read them. I did read some of them already, but... they didn't really make me excited. As in example with colors, when I read various Eastern sacred texts - they are so multi-colored, with many colors not even existing in this world. But what I've read from Deathless books so far is so White, that it feels totally lifeless. I will keep reading them, because I hope I am wrong, but so far books contain a lot of things about "abortions are wrong", "eating animal flesh is wrong", "killing mosquitos is wrong", "doubting sacred teaching is wrong", and many other highly controversial moralities with little actual knowledge and practice. So far it is very off-putting, but I will keep reading and trying to persuade myself that I am wrong and just need to do more research.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    US. Missouri.
    Posts
    132
    The light of the eye and the light if the ear are also known as the vital sustaining life force.

    I mean, I can make my eyes shine at will via projecting my life force through them.

    The same way I do that also allows me to experience reality with my mind.
    Keeping this on does have interesting effect. 2 weeks is probably my max sustained time.

    Giving someone shaltipat is difficult.
    It takes extreme focus.
    I have only done it once, it was an accident.
    I peered into someone. They met my gaze and challenged me.
    The majority of my being was in my eyes at this point.
    The ended up breathing in deep, siezed up, fell directly back into a wall. An instantly started dreaming for about 15 seconds before waking up in a daze. It was simply a result of many suppressed things leaving all at once.

    I apologized as it was not my intent. Shaltipat through the eyes is the highest form of transmission. Most is done through touch.
    Meat eating. Alcohole. Drugs. None of these matter in the face
    Of rejuvenating vitality. At most they will break your discipline. Thus breaking your ability to cultivate. Like an alluring women breaking your celibacy. Yet if a women break your celibacy, you were never on the immortal path to begin with.
    Any man who practices correctly, 2 months into practice he will have all desire burnt up. If this isn't true, then what is he doing?

    I read through an have no idea the practice you speak of.
    Yet through opening my subtle body. I can project light through my easily. It follows my attention. It is Like a spirit. Part of my but separate. At will i can alter my mind like a drug. The more I use it, the stronger it gets.

    Right and wrong do not exist at some point. These only exist to those who have not overcome. An overcoming means cultivation of life.
    Liberation is a part of immortal path. Liberation is not liberation from the world, it is liberation from yourself. For it is you who experiences.

    Fire consumes all, all that remains is the flame. The flame remains untarnished.
    Formerly known as Avaar186.

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