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Thread: 'One Matter' - Empiricism & Alchemy - Discerning Truth from Deception

  1. #181
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    What's ROI?

  2. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florius Frammel View Post
    What's ROI?
    Return On Investment

  3. #183
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    ..any supposed "Spiritus Mundi" that strangely enough nobody has ever seen or isolated. Get it through your heads, folks: "Spiritus Mundi" is nothing but a fossil theory. That's all there is to it.
    The same can be said for Dark Matter or Dark Energy (in terms of being seen or isolated).. There are individuals (some have participated in this forum at one point or another) who claim to have interacted with SM.
    Maybe "there are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio". There are those of us who have seen things which cannot be satisfactorily explained presently, but don't think the SM theory will ever go away completely.. as long as there is Consciousness to contend with.

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDP View Post
    Or in fact something infinitely more plausible, logical and in accordance to the historical context in which the expression appeared than such modern misinterpretations of alchemy... I will let Fulcanelli explain it, since he did a very nice job at it:

    Thus it has been called the universal solvent, not because it is capable of dissolving all bodies in nature --- as many wrongly believe --- but because it can do everything in the small universe which the Great Work constitutes.

    The mistake many made was to take such a denomination as "universal solvent" totally literally. It obviously does not dissolve literally "everything", otherwise the subject would fall into impossible paradoxes like those Kunckel pointed out.
    It is called the Universal Solvent because it is the Secret Solvent that does the work in all three kingdoms of reducing the starting material to its first matter, Water (liquifaction). One can obtain Ripley's Artificial Antimonial Compound the starting matter, from the plant kingdom or the animal kingdom. Sericon is obtained from the correct putrefaction of the Artificial Antimonial Compound. Proper distillation of the Sericon yields the secret solvent which consists in varying proportions of burnt wine: our blessed water, Sulfur: Fire, and Mercury: Air. The burnt wine is pyro-water. The Sulfur Fire is a ruby red oil pleasantly nutty in aroma that is soluble in burnt wine. Mercury is the armoniac Spirit that is fixed into the burnt wine along with the Fire. When all these kinsmen have been purified and joined to the pure Earth of Sericon one has the Vegetable Stone or medicine for man.

  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by z0 K View Post
    It is called the Universal Solvent because it is the Secret Solvent that does the work in all three kingdoms of reducing the starting material to its first matter, Water (liquifaction). One can obtain Ripley's Artificial Antimonial Compound the starting matter, from the plant kingdom or the animal kingdom. Sericon is obtained from the correct putrefaction of the Artificial Antimonial Compound. Proper distillation of the Sericon yields the secret solvent which consists in varying proportions of burnt wine: our blessed water, Sulfur: Fire, and Mercury: Air. The burnt wine is pyro-water. The Sulfur Fire is a ruby red oil pleasantly nutty in aroma that is soluble in burnt wine. Mercury is the armoniac Spirit that is fixed into the burnt wine along with the Fire. When all these kinsmen have been purified and joined to the pure Earth of Sericon one has the Vegetable Stone or medicine for man.
    He describes a composite made by the alchemist himself, by joining three separate distinct substances (which he arbitrarily calls "one Sulphur, and... two Mercuries".) If nature made this thing it would NOT be "artificial", it would be just another natural matter, plus he obviously could not possibly know how many substances were employed (by nature) to make it. Yet he is quite sure it is 3 substances. The only way you could possibly know this is if YOU are the one making this "artificial antimonial compound".

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDP View Post
    He describes a composite made by the alchemist himself, by joining three separate distinct substances (which he arbitrarily calls "one Sulphur, and... two Mercuries".)
    Of course the "compost" is made by the alchemist himself -- you cannot buy it; you have to make it yourself! That might not be possible if you cannot even attempt to explore the idea that three separate distinct substances can nevertheless be obtained from one thing which is found most everywhere on Earth. It is a Philosophical Principle that has been distorted into a dogma by organized religion: the Holy Trinity: Father, Son, Holy Spirit: hijacked from Body, Soul, Spirit, or Salt, Sulfur, Mercury.

    Embracing that Principle in the laboratory one can observe that what Ripley calls "one Sulfur, and... two Mercuries" is an arbitrary designation which he admits by clarifying that the whole thing is Mercury from beginning to end. All of the operations are carried out by Mercury on Mercury -- the vessels are secondary for the manipulation of the Elements. Manipulate the Elements in the one thing according to Ripley which I have observed as well and you will receive one Sulfur and two Mercuries: a description of the products from one thing: the starting matter.

    If nature made this thing it would NOT be "artificial", it would be just another natural matter,
    Nature makes everything. Anything man made is artificial: made by human art and craftwork out of natural things.

    plus he obviously could not possibly know how many substances were employed (by nature) to make it.
    Ripley obviously knew how many substances he obtained from the one thing Nature made and he by art and craftwork composted into Sericon.

    Yet he is quite sure it is 3 substances.
    Of course Ripley is quite sure it is 3 substances. It is the Three Philosophical Principles, the Holy Trinity, that Nature provides and alchemists transform by artifice.

    The only way you could possibly know this is if YOU are the one making this "artificial antimonial compound".
    Obviously. By analogy if you want to bake bread you will have to make some dough first. Is dough made by Nature? Look high and low for Nature's dough? No! Dough is artificial.

  7. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by z0 K View Post
    Of course the "compost" is made by the alchemist himself -- you cannot buy it; you have to make it yourself! That might not be possible if you cannot even attempt to explore the idea that three separate distinct substances can nevertheless be obtained from one thing which is found most everywhere on Earth. It is a Philosophical Principle that has been distorted into a dogma by organized religion: the Holy Trinity: Father, Son, Holy Spirit: hijacked from Body, Soul, Spirit, or Salt, Sulfur, Mercury.

    Embracing that Principle in the laboratory one can observe that what Ripley calls "one Sulfur, and... two Mercuries" is an arbitrary designation which he admits by clarifying that the whole thing is Mercury from beginning to end. All of the operations are carried out by Mercury on Mercury -- the vessels are secondary for the manipulation of the Elements. Manipulate the Elements in the one thing according to Ripley which I have observed as well and you will receive one Sulfur and two Mercuries: a description of the products from one thing: the starting matter.
    Read carefully, he does not quite say that. He clearly says that it is these three DISTINCT STARTING substances that then BECOME ONE:

    This our Antimonial Compound is only to be revealed to the Children of Art, who firmly believe the constant truth thereof, and whom in all fraternal love and charity we say, that it is made of one Sulphur, and of two Mercuries, which otherwise by the wise Philosophers are called, the Sun, Moon, and Mercury, or as some of them will more plainly have it, Salt, Sulphur, and Mercury, which are the three several and distinct substances and bodies, although for the most part we term them but one Thing, because in the conclusion of our work they make but one Thing, that is our admirable Elixir, and they have alone original, and tend altogether but to one end. For if we had not in our Work a triune aspect of these Planets, and did not begin it with a Trinity, all would be lost labour and inutilous profile.

    That's why it is ARTIFICIAL: man makes it, not nature! That is also why Ripley can know how many substances compose it, which he obviously could not if nature had made this thing on its own. Let us take some other natural substance as an example. How could Ripley know how many substances nature employed to make, say, milk? He just could not know, he would never know because he could not be there watching inside a cow's metabolism to see what exactly is nature using to produce milk inside the cow. But he could know such a thing if milk was in fact made by man. On the other hand, Ripley could easily have known how many substances were employed in making an artificial substance like beer or ale, for example, which nature does not make on its own.

    Nature makes everything. Anything man made is artificial: made by human art and craftwork out of natural things.
    If we go by that, then nothing is "man-made" and everything is "natural". Even the waste of a chemical factory is "natural". George Carlin used to make a comedy routine out of that semantic nuance:



    Ripley obviously knew how many substances he obtained from the one thing Nature made and he by art and craftwork composted into Sericon.
    He is not talking about obtaining three things from one, but of making one out of three DISTINCT STARTING substances.

    Of course Ripley is quite sure it is 3 substances. It is the Three Philosophical Principles, the Holy Trinity, that Nature provides and alchemists transform by artifice.
    But nature provides these raw substances separately, not together as "one". Then the alchemist puts them together and makes them react in the appropriate manner and proportions. Nature itself cannot do any of this. It lacks the tools and the appropriate working conditions to carry out such operations. Without man's purposeful and conscious intervention it just would not happen.

    Obviously. By analogy if you want to bake bread you will have to make some dough first. Is dough made by Nature? Look high and low for Nature's dough? No! Dough is artificial.
    Obviously, because nature could not make flour, dough or bread on its own, even though it provides the raw matters to make them, but it itself cannot do it without man's intervention. So you are in fact agreeing with me: nature CANNOT make either the secret solvent or the Stone. Man's intervention is needed.

  8. #188
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    sure JDP you're right when you tell us that the solvent is made by the artist and that he must made

    but on what the secret solvent is made with antimony as it says Zo k
    I have many doubts unless it is a cover name for other mineral salts, etc. to create from the solvent a vegetable animal an atrop rubber from which the two wines are extracted and from them obtain the water of life or the dianic salmiacs

    sure JDP you're right when you tell us that the solvent made by the artist and made and I add that as we indicate the weindenfeld that must be done by the 3 kingdoms (as I said in other posts on this) and to understand the mechanism that implies solvent secret advice to read carefully its prodromus and the parts when they are joined the oleosun the acidum and aridum
    and this is how solvent is obtained as the weidenlfel says in his various writings and his misunderstood manuscripts circulating in his enturage
    and the same method that also makes the chain of humerus and also the dikinson understand etc is that the philosophical solvent is composed of 3 intersected elements of animal and mineral plants

    as weidenfeld would say the oleosun plant and or animal should be combined with acidum and an aridum and from it union with an artifice and elaboration we obtain a water that it will compose the solvent that will be extracted by the gum adrop create in the first water derivate and exstract it by the caos see about it its prodronus
    https://www.scribd.com/document/3416...ibri-Secundi-1


    KUNKEL AND ITS EXPRESS ON THE PHILOSOPHERAL SOLVENT?


    does anyone have kunkel writings that deepen his research on the spiritus wines and acidum? can give here some reference of his texts titles lin of the pdf etc in English or French and that they treat his experiments on the solvent philosophical but that we are not perostampati German in gothic in particular I am looking for epistola contra spirus wines sine acid
    ----------------------------------------------------


    certo JDP hai ragione quando ci dici che il solvente composto dall'artista e fa fatto e che lui deve fare questo

    ma su che il solvente segreto si faccia con antimonio come dice Zo K
    ho molte perplessita a meno che non sia un nome di copertura per alri sali minerali etc per creare dal solvente inziale animale vegetale una gomma atrop da cui estratte i due vini e da essi ottenere l'acqua di vita o li salmiac di diana si

    certo JDP hai ragione quando ci dici che il solvente composto dall'artista e fa fatto e aggiungo che come ci indica il weindenfeld che va fatto dai 3 regni (come ho detto in altri post su cio ) e per capire il meccanismo che sottointende il solvente segreto consiglio di leggere con attenzione suo prodromus e le parti quando vanno uniti l'oleosun l'acidum e aridum
    ed è cosi che si ottiene il solvente come dice il weidenlfel nei suoi vari scritti e suoi misconosciuti manoscritti che circolavano nel suo enturage
    ed lo stesso metodo che fa capire anche la catena d'omero e anche il dikinson etc è che il solvente filosofale è composto da 3 elementi intersecati vegetale animale e minerale

    come direbbe weidenfeld l'oleosun pianta e o animale va unito ad acidum e a un aridum e da essa unione con un artifici ed elaborazione si ottiene un acqua che essa comporrà il solvente che sara estratto dalla gomma adrop che si è formata dalla acqua derivata ed estratta dal caos iniziale see about it il suo prodronus
    https://www.scribd.com/document/3416...ibri-Secundi-1


    KUNKEL ED SUOI ESPRIMENTI SUL SOLVENTE FILOSOFALE ?

    qualcuno ha degli scritti di kunkel che approfondiscono le sue ricerche sullo spiritus vini e acidum ? puo dare qui qualche riferimento di suoi testi titoli lin dei pdf etc in inglese o francese e che trattino i suoi esperimenti sul solvente filosofale ma che non siamo perostampati tedesco in gotico in particolare sto cercando epistola contra spirus vini sine acido

  9. #189
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    I know I seem to change my train of thought more often than I change my socks, but that's because I don't own many pairs of socks.

    The spagyric thing quoted from me above by JDP was a juvenile comment made some time before I understood what alchemy was (and was not)

    Now I see Alchemy as basically a mix between Andros hermit driven principles; followed by JDP's no cock and bull mix of compounds, with just a touch of Leo Regulus's "Can do" attitude.

    I have to disagree with "The agent and patient" Mr Black; simply because it does seem that the odds are overwhelmingly in JDPs favour of the stone having multiple constituency. I am talking here only about THE stone, and none of its lesser friends. I personally believe Black that you could start with the agent and patient and through putrefaction and other steps end up with something quite amazing. Its my personal view that imbibing any salt with the spirit is going to create something very useful. However... It seems that in regards to the philosophers stone we are looking at potentially 4 different solutes, and the secret solvent. (5 things)

    These would be;

    Sol (a salt)
    Luna (a salt)
    Our saltpetre (you guessed it)
    Our Sea salt, Virgin Earth, Central Salt ect.

    I am confused about the difference between our saltpetre and our sea salt. I'm not sure which one Andros was referring to when he refers to central salt.

    I am co fused mainly because Our Saltpetre; in the schemata illustrated Great Work (the Italian text) it depicts Our Saltpetre as being extracted from "the ocean" which could easily designate it as "our sea salt, or central salt" however, we know quite well that it is in fact not the sea SALT since it is in fact NITRE and not salt!? Paradoxical, I think that "our saltpetre" is extracted from the "ocean" and is used throughout the entire process, when the central salt or philosophically prepared NaCl to be specific, is only used to purify the mercury and to create the green lion. (Which I still dont know fuck all about).

    Womans work and child's play? They must have had really really smart women and kids back then....

    There is no sulphur or mercury to worry about right now. The Sulphur is made via the left over body of the putrefaction going through a dry distillation so its not exactly a starting matter. (At least not in our preparatory stages)
    Last edited by elixirmixer; 03-23-2018 at 11:04 AM. Reason: Spelling, grammer & other stupidity
    Join me; on a voyage of stupidity, and self discovery: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=vccZSHroTG4

  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by elixirmixer View Post
    I'm not sure which one Andros was referring to when he refers to central salt.
    It's Andro, not "Andros".

    Either spell my name right, or don't mention it at all

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