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Thread: DMT is the Stone

  1. #51
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    Life is really about being a servant of God, not visions and experiences. Those things come, yes, but they should not be the goal. If they are your goal, all I can say is that you have taken many Gods instead of just one. You haven't broken the idols within yourself. In fact, by relying on these things, you are viewing them as your Gods. You completely forget that it is God who placed his Divine names in different plants and allowed them to induce the effects they do. At an even deeper level, it is God Himself who allows the plants to cause their effects. If He wanted, he would withdraw the effect from every single DMT you ever intended to smoke and you would no longer be able to use it. In fact, this is very easy - he could just cause something to go wrong with your health and your DMT path would be over. Who would you have then? Like Jonas and the whale, you would be forced to turn to God then.

    Alchemists say they follow nature but they don't practice what they preach. Nature is like the bee which God teaches directly from the "private face", as Ibn 'Arabi calls it. This is the path of the Sufis: sit with God and empty your heart of everything, then He will be seen as a reflection in your heart. Only those who follow this way are on the path of nature.

    Read the book Quest for the Red Sulphur and you will know what I am talking about. Also Degrees of the Soul by Shabrawi.

    Edit: A Turkish Sufi master's view on psychedelics:

    "Let me give just one example. A brother who was into New Age philosophy and whose nickname was ‘the Bud- dhist’ experimented with psychedelic drugs years ago. Whereupon the Master told him: ‘You picked up the phone, you got the message. Now hang up the phone and come here.’

    As soon as I heard about this, I was immediately re- minded of Alan Watts’ dictum: ‘When you get the message, you hang up the phone.’⁶ It is the last word on artificially in- duced altered states of consciousness. According to Watts, psychedelic substances (entheogens) are tools that provide a glimpse into genuine mystical insight, to be discarded and replaced by more methodical meditation techniques once that glimpse is obtained. Watts was speaking from di- rect experience, as well as incorporating other people’s ex- periences and the results of scientific research. The Master, on the other hand, never had any experience with psychedelics - he lived in a culture where these were totally unknown and nonexistent, not just physically but even con- ceptually. Yet his remark to our friend was dead on target, identical with expert opinion."

    Source: The Teachings of a Perfect Master by Henry Bayman
    Last edited by Tannur; 1 Week Ago at 06:57 PM.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    Life is really about being a servant of God, not visions and experiences. Those things come, yes, but they should not be the goal.
    Who said it was the goal? I always claim the visions are less important than the "other" things.

    If He wanted, he would...
    I personally don't view God as a "man".

    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    ...immediately re- minded of Alan Watts’ dictum...
    That "master" could be a stealing Watts bit also, since anyone interested in Easter philosophy would come across Watts. IMO Watts simply means that once you have a major psychedelic experience / insight you need not take any more until you are ready to move on to the next phase... it doesn't mean you have to replace it with something else. I would not consider Watts an authority on the psychedelic experience.

    What is your psychedelic experience?

    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.


  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awani View Post
    Who said it was the goal? I always claim the visions are less important than the "other" things.
    What are the other things for you?

    I can't claim to know much about psychedelics but the overall impression I get about people who do them is that it is just for the visions/spiritual experiences.


    Quote Originally Posted by Awani
    I personally don't view God as a "man".
    Me neither. I do believe He has a Will.

    Quote Originally Posted by Awani
    That "master" could be a stealing Watts bit also, since anyone interested in Easter philosophy would come across Watts. IMO Watts simply means that once you have a major psychedelic experience / insight you need not take any more until you are ready to move on to the next phase... it doesn't mean you have to replace it with something else. I would not consider Watts an authority on the psychedelic experience.

    What is your psychedelic experience?

    Reasonable opinion.

    What do you mean by phase and how do you measure which phase you are at? Are there living teachers who followed the same path as you successfully?

    My own psychedelic experience is zero. I was just speaking from a general perspective.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    What are the other things for you?

    I can't claim to know much about psychedelics but the overall impression I get about people who do them is that it is just for the visions/spiritual experiences.
    Aldous Huxley:

    'Below and beyond the conscious self lie vast ranges of subconscious activity, some worse than the ego and some better, some stupider and some, in certain respects, far more intelligent. At its fringes this subconscious self overlaps and merges with not-self, with the physic medium in which all selves bathe and through which they can directly communicate with one antoehr and with cosmic mind. And somewhere on the subconscious levels individual minds make contact energy and make contact not only merely in their own body, but also outside their own body.'
    -
    'By mortifying his self-regarding impulses, by setting up a witness to his thoughts and a little sentinel to keep an eye on the movements of his heart; a man can sharpen his perceptions to the point where he becomes aware of the messages coming up from the obscure depths of the mind - messages in the form of initiative knowledge, of direct commands, of symbollic dreams and fantasies'
    -
    'Conscious union with the Father [soul of the trinity] can only be hoped for where there has been union with the Son thru works and devotion [the flesh, material world of the trinity], and union with the Spirit in the alert passivity of contemplation [Mind of the trinity]'

    'If you wish to see It, have no fixed notions either for it or against it'

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    What are the other things for you?
    You will just have to come to terms with the fact that unless you take the plunge you'll never know.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    What do you mean by phase and how do you measure which phase you are at?
    If you don't put into practice what you learn the current "phase" isn't over.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    Are there living teachers who followed the same path as you successfully?
    The teacher is the plant... and yes it is alive.

    What is success?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    I can't claim to know much about psychedelics but the overall impression... My own psychedelic experience is zero. I was just speaking from a general perspective...
    Exactly. Which disqualifies your entire post, because if you had some experience you would probably know that nothing what you wrote makes sense (based on my own experiences), statements like:
    • If they are your goal, all I can say is that you have taken many Gods instead of just one.
    • You haven't broken the idols within yourself.
    • In fact, by relying on these things, you are viewing them as your Gods.
    • You completely forget that it is God who placed his Divine names in different plants and allowed them to induce the effects they do.
    • At an even deeper level, it is God Himself who allows the plants to cause their effects.
    • Alchemists say they follow nature but they don't practice what they preach.
    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.


  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by vigilance View Post
    Aldous Huxley:

    'Below and beyond the conscious self lie vast ranges of subconscious activity, some worse than the ego and some better, some stupider and some, in certain respects, far more intelligent. At its fringes this subconscious self overlaps and merges with not-self, with the physic medium in which all selves bathe and through which they can directly communicate with one antoehr and with cosmic mind. And somewhere on the subconscious levels individual minds make contact energy and make contact not only merely in their own body, but also outside their own body.'
    -
    'By mortifying his self-regarding impulses, by setting up a witness to his thoughts and a little sentinel to keep an eye on the movements of his heart; a man can sharpen his perceptions to the point where he becomes aware of the messages coming up from the obscure depths of the mind - messages in the form of initiative knowledge, of direct commands, of symbollic dreams and fantasies'
    -
    'Conscious union with the Father [soul of the trinity] can only be hoped for where there has been union with the Son thru works and devotion [the flesh, material world of the trinity], and union with the Spirit in the alert passivity of contemplation [Mind of the trinity]'

    'If you wish to see It, have no fixed notions either for it or against it'
    Interesting, thanks for these quotes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Awani View Post
    You will just have to come to terms with the fact that unless you take the plunge you'll never know.
    Happy to accept this.



    Quote Originally Posted by Awani
    If you don't put into practice what you learn the current "phase" isn't over.
    This is amazing and true.



    Quote Originally Posted by Awani
    The teacher is the plant... and yes it is alive.

    What is success?
    A very very rough definition of success for me is love. Loving people, animals, trees, inanimate objects. If you have love that you have developed through your "path" (whatever that may be), that is spiritual evolution.

    I haven't heard about plant teachers before. Interesting.


    Quote Originally Posted by Awani
    Exactly. Which disqualifies your entire post, because if you had some experience you would probably know that nothing what you wrote makes sense (based on my own experiences), statements like:
    • If they are your goal, all I can say is that you have taken many Gods instead of just one.
    • You haven't broken the idols within yourself.
    • In fact, by relying on these things, you are viewing them as your Gods.
    • You completely forget that it is God who placed his Divine names in different plants and allowed them to induce the effects they do.
    • At an even deeper level, it is God Himself who allows the plants to cause their effects.
    • Alchemists say they follow nature but they don't practice what they preach.
    Please ignore that post.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    A very very rough definition of success for me is love. Loving people, animals, trees, inanimate objects. If you have love that you have developed through your "path" (whatever that may be), that is spiritual evolution.
    Well then I have had what you call "success", but I see no end goal. I also place the bar pretty high for myself so I don't consider myself anywhere near "completion" of any sort. But compared to my former self it cannot be compared.

    Ayahuasca changed my life 100%. If reincarnation is true I am certain I skipped a few thanks to that particular Plant Teacher. LOL.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tannur View Post
    I haven't heard about plant teachers before. Interesting.
    Nature is a teacher, and if you form a direct relationship with a plant it will teach you... but there are certain plants that are easier or more suitable to do this with.

    ------------------------------------------

    One thing I'd like to point out - based on my own experience - is that the psychedelic session itself is one thing, but whatever one may experience in that session doesn't end with the "medicine" leaving your body... it remains... for years... for life... I am still processing experiences I had many years ago. So it is not necessary to do it again and again, not until past experiences have been fully integrated. I can return to those "ceremonies" with certain non-psychedelic methods... re-visit them... and continue to learn.

    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.


  8. #58
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    Does anyone remember deoxy.org? The 1996 version was pretty trippy. I've read Moshka, but didn't really get into any of the more modern psychonauts, like the guys from the 60s. But that deoxy site had some stuff from Leary that I latched on at the time. I never took that any further though. Is there anything there? Or is it like Watts?

    I've done shrooms here and there when I was younger. And LSD. I had a sheet of pretty weak LSD for Canada Day one summer. You needed 2 or 3 hits to get off. I didn't feel right about selling it and just gave it out. I had about 35 left, and I decided to put one or two in a glass of water and sip it throughout the day. Microdosing they call it! I was just using it up. I wonder if anything happened. lol. I remember feeling someone calm and relaxed from it. But maybe nothing at all. I haven't done anything... Probably since then. I've been scared to trip as I got older. Worried I'd focus on negative things.

    But I used to love acid, when everyone had left, and I was just left alone to lie around and think.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by vigilance View Post
    I've been scared to trip as I got older. Worried I'd focus on negative things.
    Have you ever considered that there are "negative" things that you avoid looking at? Perhaps you need another trip down the rabbit hole.

    With the right set and setting you'll be fine, perhaps not during the experience but after. The "hard ones" are the best ones. Anyone that thinks I use psychedelics for fun need to splash some cold water in their face.

    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.


  10. #60
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    but i mean actual physical things. A mole that may have changed? does this molar need to be refilled again, etc. I don't remember anything like that ever happening. But since I'm worried about, its almost a certain I'd focus on it.

    Im not against tripping again. I'm not a visual person. I've never seen things on shrooms or lsd. The only time I ever saw something was from a concussion when I was pretty young. They tell me I said I was seeing Mr. Roarke from fantasy island. Oops. I thought I saw the nice old lady from across the road at our door one evening.. it was dark so it had to be winter. It turns out she had died earlier that day though.

    We went to see Pulp Fiction at a matinee show. our group was the only ones there. Before movie started, it looked like the curtain was breathing. But Uma Thurman really did draw that box in the air. I really wasnt sure until I saw it again. We did the same thing for Natural Born Killers. But that movie just has trippy visuals. It was kind of intense for being on acid.. But I don't think there were any hallucinations. I can't hold a very vivid image in my mind.

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