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Thread: Physical Immortality... on THIS Earth?

  1. #41
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    I keep getting a continuous decline in faith in humanity, because all its current history is full of deception and wars.
    Stop watching the mainstream news. The world is full of brilliant loving moral people unfortunately they have no power and you wont hear about them.

    When man awakens from animalistic sleep, the first thing he realizes is that death IS real and absolute and something must be done about it.
    Death is unnatural. Ageing is a disease. An unpopular view.
    Its mankind's destiny to realise this and its inevitable as a species, we're gonna have to do it some time, assuming we are all still here.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kibric View Post
    Death is unnatural. Ageing is a disease. An unpopular view.
    Its mankind's destiny to realise this and its inevitable as a species, we're gonna have to do it some time, assuming we are all still here.
    Indeed, I totally agree with you on these points.

    I didn't mean to derail this thread. I simply think that most of modern ways of enlightenment (what an overused word) is actually a spiritual suicide. I also think that embracing the death is like embracing some lethal sickness and adoring it instead of actually seeking the ways to cure it.

  3. #43
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    I guess it comes down to what outlook one has. When my car breaks down I simply by a new one. The old car is dead, but my new one is alive. And guess what... I am still driving. That is what death is to me... so any concept of trying to make my old shitty car last longer sounds ridiculous... why waste that energy when a brand new porsche is waiting for me.

    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awani View Post
    I guess it comes down to what outlook one has. When my car breaks down I simply by a new one. The old car is dead, but my new one is alive. And guess what... I am still driving. That is what death is to me... so any concept of trying to make my old shitty car last longer sounds ridiculous... why waste that energy when a brand new porsche is waiting for me.

    Then... what about memories of old car or... memories of previous life?

    Only relatively few people have authentic memories of past lives, and those are usually those who had violent death or/and could probably be ascribed to specific secondary emanations of Genius of Earth.

    And even if you manage to remember the past life, in next life you won't remember neither this nor past life.

    So each time you begin anew, and most likely (because of big disproportional difference of poor vs rich) you will be poor, trading whole your life for some promises of good pension or to save for house when you are old, so you die never even getting to live life in your own house. Or just spend whole life in never fulfilling dreams about that. And spend many lives like that - always starting from scratch. Constantly losing all you had.

    If to go with your example and with western theory on reincarnations and add some more details. Imagine you have some car and you need to get on it from Spain to France. On your way there you get some incident which causes you to have amnesia and you with new car is back at Spain. You plan to get to some other country (probably even same France, but you are not sure, you don't remember where and why you need to drive), but the same incident repeats, you have new amnesia, new car and you are back in Spain. So you get new car each time, but no memory and all your goals are far beyond reach (or, even if you reach them, you get to enjoy their fruits only extremely short amount of time). And all of that is because of the repeating incident (correlating with death).

    I am not sure about you, but I personally find such situation with car being far beyond totally hopeless

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warmheart View Post
    Then... what about memories of old car or... memories of previous life?
    I try to remain in the present.

    Quote Originally Posted by Warmheart View Post
    If to go with your example and with western theory on reincarnations...
    I have not claimed that reincarnation is what happens... all I basically said is that death is birth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Warmheart View Post
    ...you will be poor... so you die never even getting to live life in your own house...
    Good. I remember one time in an ayahuasca ceremony I entered the life of someone starving to death in Africa. It was a horrible experience. The following day my sense of compassion and grace and gratitude was increased tenfold. From the omnipotent perspective of infinite consciousness a human being can only truly be poor in spirit, love, compassion, passion... IMO.

    Regarding reincarnation: yes it is "true" that you might not recall your past lives in your current body... but between bodies you do remember... and I have strong personal evidence that we might actually choose what life we will have. Why are we not all rich and famous Hollywood celebrites then? Because our eternal higher spirit does not place value on materialism, but on experience.

    On the flip side: if everything I say is 100 % true then if someone does not accept eternal and infinite consciousness then such individuals might pray that "if only I could die for real". He he he.

    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kibric View Post
    Death is unnatural. Ageing is a disease.
    That is correct.

    However physical human body is only a temporary mode of transportation or experience pod. If I play Super Mario Bros., and happen to die I turn off the console, and go make a sandwich. From the perspective of Mario I am an immortal God. And from the perspective of the higher self, or the Divine Mystery, I am Mario.

    And in the end Mario, I, you and the Divine Mystery are one and the same... a thought adrift in an infintie ocean of constant creation and consciousness.

    In the beginning there was nothing. All was darkness. There was nothing at all. Only the mother. She was Aluna. She was pure thought. Without form. She began to think. The mother conceived the world in the darkness. She conceived us as ideas. As we think out a house before we begin to make it real. She spun the thread. Spinning us all in the story. Creating us in thought. And then came the light. And the world was real. - Kogi people creation story
    IMO.

    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.

  7. #47
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    even if you manage to remember the past life, in next life you won't remember neither this nor past life.
    This is really the crux of spiritual immortality. The preservation of your current consciousness. The body being an illusion and the desire to keep it
    comes from its attachment to your consciousness. We do not want reincarnation we're not supposed to endlessly forget,
    Lao Tzu from the below quote taught how your consciousness could pick up other bodies. Multiple bodies.
    The focus on physical immortality is largely to convert this body that is an illusion as a means of becoming deathless.
    If the consciousness can preserve itself it can pick up another body or bodies, not only that but also use water fire air earth as a body
    it is immortal. The end stages in practises based on physical immortality are the same. An immortal consciousness.
    However physical human body is only a temporary mode of transportation or experience pod
    My favourite quote from Lao Tzu that encompasses your view.
    " All that has the breath of life, all that possesses bodily
    form, is mere Illusion. The point at which
    creation begins, the change effected by the Dual
    Principles — these are called respectively Life
    and Death. That which underlies the manifold
    workings of Destiny is called Evolution ; that
    which produces and transforms bodily substance
    is called Illusion. The Creator's ingenuity is
    mysterious, His operations secret and profound.
    In truth, He is inexhaustible and eternal.

    The " Creator," of course, is Tao ; but how widely the
    conception of Tao differs from that of a personal God may
    be seen from the commentator's note : " How should the
    Creator possess a conscious mind ? It is His spontaneity
    that constitutes the mystery. Essential matter unites with
    extensive energy to become a bodily substance, which follows
    the line of evolution and passes away, but does not, on that
    account, relapse into nothingness."

    The ingenuity of that which causes material
    form is patent to the eye, and its workings are
    shallow. Therefore it arises anon, and anon it
    is destroyed.' Only one who knows that Life
    is really Illusion, and that Death is really
    Evolution, can begin to learn magic from me.
    You and I are both illusions. How are we,
    then, to make a study of the subject ? "

    " If a person wishes to make a study of illusion, in spite of
    the fact that his own body is an illusion, we are reduced to
    the absurdity of an illusion studying an illusion."
    https://archive.org/stream/taoisttea...zrich_djvu.txt
    Last edited by Kibric; 05-22-2018 at 05:05 PM.

  8. #48
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    If a person wishes to make a study of illusion, in spite of
    the fact that his own body is an illusion, we are reduced to
    the absurdity of an illusion studying an illusion.
    Good quote.

    Donít let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.

  9. #49
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    Give me the eternal life, and I will know that to do with the treacherous death...

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kibric View Post
    My favourite quote from Lao Tzu that encompasses your view.
    Interesting quote, though it is strange to see it coming from you as we less or more share some general ideas about immortality. So there is an old Eastern legend. I am telling it from memory, so might miss some details.

    Once, Shiva was telling Parvati exactly the same words, that matter is illusion, world is illusion, everything is illusion. Parvati (who is, basically in crude words, Nature herself) became upset and told Shiva: "So if everything about me is illusion, you can live without me, I will see how long you will last".

    And so Parvati left the world and everything started to wither and die, there was no food and there was hunger all around. Wise Men started to call Parvati to come back as nothing can live without her. And so Parvati heard their callings, and at the edge of the world appeared some tavern, whose mistress was Annapurna (name means full of food).


    The world being illusion is an extremely modern view, which appeared only around 2 thousands years ago if not less. And it got huge popularity mostly amidst western people. And it is also western people who invented "Maya = illusion" in its crudest sense.
    Quote Originally Posted by Awani
    Regarding reincarnation: yes it is "true" that you might not recall your past lives in your current body... but between bodies you do remember... and I have strong personal evidence that we might actually choose what life we will have. Why are we not all rich and famous Hollywood celebrites then? Because our eternal higher spirit does not place value on materialism, but on experience.
    Then why would someone choose a life in the desert without water and roof over the head, constantly suffering from thirst and creepy insectoids? Why would someone choose a life as a son of beggar, living on street, needed not by anyone and begging to survive? When you see some 10-years old kid and you see he is so hungry and can't stand on his legs because they turned into bones with some skin over them? How can someone enjoy it as experience? I think there is a big flaw in theory about "people can choose their future life". How do those people fit this theory? (I'd put a smile, but it isn't something to smile about)

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