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Thread: Making 'The Vegetable Stone'?

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    What does he do to the plant ash to make ORMUS out of it?
    There is a wide variety of "ormus"-making processes readily available online. Some of them involve corrosive spirits and caustic solutions (i.e. "pH swings").

    What Hogan does looks to me like a hybridization between (very) basic spagyria and some "ormus" precipitate. If that's all there is to it, consider me unimpressed

    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    And then how does he get the ormus to the black and then red stage? This is what he tells us but doesn't show us.
    I don't recall him mentioning "raising the stone" or any color-denoted evolution. Could you point to the time in the video where he does that?

  2. #52
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    Can you describe to us Andro how this hybridazation is done please. I only know of the salt water method where you treat it with NaOH to pH 10.78. Apparently he uses plant ash precipitate. The only time I did an experiment with plant ash precipitate was with HCl and NaOH. It was a failure indeed Do you by any chance know the method to get the ORMUS out of the plant ash precipitate? Raise an elixir and it turns into a blood red substance 34:44 to 35:01.

  3. #53
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    Regarding Hybridization: "Sulfur" (as plant oils) & "Mercury" (ethanol-related) are from basic-level Spagyria, while the "Salt" seems to be processed in a more "Ormus"-like fashion. There are people on this forum who are far more conversant with "Ormus" practices.

    Regarding the "Raising" and the "Red Lion": He only talks about it and shows some red stuff in a flask, so I can't really comment.

  4. #54
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    Do you suppose that the red stuff could really be the red lion as he describes it? I feel so distraught over this. I mean I've done tons of research inquired far and wide and no answer Just feeling frustrated. Thank you Andro

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    Do you suppose that the red stuff could really be the red lion as he describes it? I feel so distraught over this. I mean I've done tons of research inquired far and wide and no answer Just feeling frustrated. Thank you Andro
    I can't say what it is, but I can say what it is NOT: A reason to feel distraught & frustrated

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    Do you by any chance know the method to get the ORMUS out of the plant ash precipitate?
    You might have luck with performing an acid-to-base reaction, and then extract the “ormus” with a non-polar solvent, like naphtha, which when put into a freezer will precipitate out of the nonpolar solvent.

    I’ve not personally tried this on calcined plant matter, but it works rather well on fresh, ground root bark.


    As for the topic itself, I agree with z0 k. The ‘vegetable stone’ and the ‘philosophers stone’ are misleading concepts.
    I for one am leaning towards the idea that you first need the so-called “philosopher’s stone” in order to produce a “vegetable stone”

    For example. My sister wanted to be a librarian, and went to school for library sciences. After she graduated she applied for a job at a library. Turns out libraries only hire people who have actually worked in a library before. So in order to become a librarian you must first be a librarian. Lol
    Art is Nature in the flask; Nature is a vial thing.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    Do you suppose that the red stuff could really be the red lion as he describes it? I feel so distraught over this. I mean I've done tons of research inquired far and wide and no answer Just feeling frustrated. Thank you Andro
    I don't know what it is either.

    If you read Hollandus's Opera Vegetabilia, z0K's book or Golden Chain of Homer, there are multiple mentions of the Element of Fire in the Plant Quintessence. I find the Golden Chain of Homer descriptions easier to understand but Hollandus goes into alot of detail about the 4 Elements in the Plant Kingdom. The Quintessence mentioned in these books and the description of the Elements is different than what you would see in Bartlett's Real Alchemy or the PON course on making a plant stone.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    I feel so distraught over this.
    Get used to it. Such is the life of the Amature Alchemist.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiorionis View Post
    You might have luck with performing an acid-to-base reaction
    I believe Kiorionis could be right here. Im currently doing some experimentation on this aswell. While I agree with Andro, that this is a hybridization of ormus and basic spagyrics, I for one AM impressed, slightly. Im very interested to see how the results differ from regular tinctures. After all, its like a regular tincture, only coupled with superconductors such as Iridium and Gold. Sounds pretty cool to me. However, Tim Hogans boasting of red lion and caput Mortuum status is a bit ambitious. His process does not use true putrefaction and is therefore not a true alchemical process at all (unless of coarse putrefaction is one of the methods he says he cannot talk about) however, what I think is more likely is that he does repeated distillations of his product until this effects certain (unknown to me) changes in the salt and/or sulfur, which WOULD GREATLY start to impress me if its the case and is the reason I am endeavouring on this pursuit.

    If you expect to dissolve the "caput mortuum" and consider this to be true M-State, then it would make sense to be using Royal Water, since this would be capable of dissolving all of the precious metals that are held within the insoluble plant ashes. AKA, if you dont use royal water, then you wont be making any Gold M-State, obviously. You could then use the soluble salts of the plant ash to precipitate out the solution aka merging the soluble and insoluble salts in to one (quote: "Secret Salt of the Alchemist")
    Join me; on a voyage of stupidity, and self discovery: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=vccZSHroTG4

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by elixirmixer View Post
    However, Tim Hogans boasting of red lion and caput Mortuum status is a bit ambitious. His process does not use true putrefaction and is therefore not a true alchemical process at all (unless of coarse putrefaction is one of the methods he says he cannot talk about) however, what I think is more likely is that he does repeated distillations of his product until this effects certain (unknown to me) changes in the salt and/or sulfur, which WOULD GREATLY start to impress me if its the case and is the reason I am endeavouring on this pursuit.
    Repeated distillations, maybe. But another maybe could be that he repeats the whole process again (maceration, digestion, distillation, etc) as a sort of ‘second rotation’. I believe it’s ICH in ‘The Natural path’ who ascribes three rotations to the work. Maybe this is his definition of ‘raising the stone’, that it is raised in potency through each rotation? By doing it right I bet you’d get a change in quality (colour, consistency, etc) as well.
    Art is Nature in the flask; Nature is a vial thing.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiorionis View Post
    Repeated distillations, maybe. But another maybe could be that he repeats the whole process again (maceration, digestion, distillation, etc) as a sort of ‘second rotation’. I believe it’s ICH in ‘The Natural path’ who ascribes three rotations to the work. Maybe this is his definition of ‘raising the stone’, that it is raised in potency through each rotation? By doing it right I bet you’d get a change in quality (colour, consistency, etc) as well.
    Interesting, I hadnt thought of that, however it does make a lot of sense. Good suggestion Kiorionis.
    Join me; on a voyage of stupidity, and self discovery: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=vccZSHroTG4

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