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Thread: Is it ?

  1. #1
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    Is it ?

    Some say
    Then Calcine the Earth black and dry, in Furnace of Reverberation, until it become very fine white Calx.
    Then mingle with this white Calx the fiery Water, and distil it with a strong Fire all as before, and Calcine the Earth again
    Others say throw away the faeces " never in a thousand years could it happen "
    ( become a very fine white calx )

    Or use the thick black Oil from calcining, tiil it turns white

    Some tell that all that is needed is the Oil, shut up by itself.
    " Separate the " superfluous ".
    " To drip it's water back onto the salt and melt it gently. "

    To imbibe, wash , dry, compact and fish the air.

    " Study of the texts is what's needed "
    " Don't look to the books, the authors are deceitful "
    " Never in 400 years could someone understand Villanova "


    Do you shut the Oil up by itself ?
    Do you calcine the earth till it turns white ? and mix it with the Oil ?
    Do both ?
    One fold vessel or two ?
    " A concave base is best to collect the salt "
    One fire or two ?
    " Two fires aren't really needed if you just tip your vessel to the side "
    Do i leave it by itself ?
    " all that is really needed is for them to be left with each other "
    or
    " A new earth is needed for the Oil as the old one is useless "
    " Redness of a poppyseed ? and you fire is to hot "
    " The red earth the caput mortum ? is the best to be used "

    maybe
    " It's the really mixing of two waters "
    " Its a regeneration of the matter from its soul "


    Some poor fellow saying " It was 37 years before i knew how to treat the matter ".
    " Some young fellow making it at 22 ".

    Is it ?
    How really ?
    You all say different things.
    You all say you are telling the truth.
    If i had it how would i know what to do with it, when each of you professes you are correct.
    How deep is this game.
    Am i to spend my years playing it.
    This Art took so many years from so many of you with very few successes.
    How can i rationalise a pursuit of it based on incoherent teachings from all of you.

    Is it a fools dream ?.

  2. #2
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    These are all very important questions and conclusions imo.

    There used to be an often used phrase here: "trust no one", which sounds a bit sad. But it's too easy and can often be quite dangerous to follow some kind of (good or bad) guru, so I guess in this sense it's true, even when the alleged guru has no bad intentions in his mind.

    On the other hand we can look back at some thousand years of culture and knowledge.
    No one can tell me that one has to do or find out all on your own. For example a lot of people tend to say "this painting looks like Dali", or "this song sounds like the Beatles", "you are nothing but a cheap copycat!"

    If you for example had to discover the harmonic sound system of pythagoras first, or the modern technique of perspective you would need a whole life for.

    This way of avoiding being a copycat with all means and being forced to being creative in producing something unique and really new is imo in most, if not all cases, leading to a stagnation or creative freeze.

    We are standing on the shoulders of giants. Find them, copy them, develop something new upon them, or let it be.

    You can do what you want:


  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kibric View Post
    Some say


    Others say throw away the faeces " never in a thousand years could it happen "
    ( become a very fine white calx )

    Or use the thick black Oil from calcining, tiil it turns white

    Some tell that all that is needed is the Oil, shut up by itself.
    " Separate the " superfluous ".
    " To drip it's water back onto the salt and melt it gently. "

    To imbibe, wash , dry, compact and fish the air.

    " Study of the texts is what's needed "
    " Don't look to the books, the authors are deceitful "
    " Never in 400 years could someone understand Villanova "


    Do you shut the Oil up by itself ?
    Do you calcine the earth till it turns white ? and mix it with the Oil ?
    Do both ?
    One fold vessel or two ?
    " A concave base is best to collect the salt "
    One fire or two ?
    " Two fires aren't really needed if you just tip your vessel to the side "
    Do i leave it by itself ?
    " all that is really needed is for them to be left with each other "
    or
    " A new earth is needed for the Oil as the old one is useless "
    " Redness of a poppyseed ? and you fire is to hot "
    " The red earth the caput mortum ? is the best to be used "

    maybe
    " It's the really mixing of two waters "
    " Its a regeneration of the matter from its soul "


    Some poor fellow saying " It was 37 years before i knew how to treat the matter ".
    " Some young fellow making it at 22 ".

    Is it ?
    How really ?
    You all say different things.
    You all say you are telling the truth.
    If i had it how would i know what to do with it, when each of you professes you are correct.
    How deep is this game.
    Am i to spend my years playing it.
    This Art took so many years from so many of you with very few successes.
    How can i rationalise a pursuit of it based on incoherent teachings from all of you.

    Is it a fools dream ?.
    What it boils down to: nobody who has discovered it will ever be inclined to be 100% clear when it comes to making the Stone. Why? Simple: self-interest, self-advantage, self-gain. Anyone who tells you otherwise, and that it's "really" because "God doesn't want me to reveal it", "Even if I told you everything clearly, God would still not let you succeed", "God has not given me permission to", "It is Divinely Ordained", "The Bearded Man in the Sky will unleash his Wrath upon me if I do", blah, blah, blah, is giving you 100% pure BALONEY excuses. None of the alchemists had the faintest idea if this hypothetical "God" they babble so much about even really exists, just like the rest of the world doesn't have the faintest idea or the slightest proof about this either, so you can be quite sure they are inventing BALONEY excuses to sound really "swell" and impress the ignorant, superstitious and/or uncritical with such grandiloquent claims: "we have a direct pipeline to the Almighty Himself! And He has told us that He doesn't want little worthless worms like you to have the Stone. Really, He said so, we heard it loud & clear inside our heads! Now be good little boys & girls and continue devoting yourselves to being ignorant, superstitious, uncritical peasants and continue toiling and breaking your backs to produce food and other goods for us! It is what God wants! Seriously, He said so... inside our heads! You know, like the insane guy who killed John Lennon, yeah, just like that!" The cold, hard fact is that none of them wanted to give for free what it had cost them so much to attain and from which they were deriving personal advantage.

  4. #4
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    Well thats how the cookie crumbles. I cant even get basic responses with low grade alchemy such as Tartar Salts!! No one is giving anythong away cheap these days.

    Literally NO one is willing to talk to be about this 'permenant water' or 'boiled dew'.

    No one has EVER told me what their starting matter is. EVER! It is an incredibly frustrating game to play. I still openly share; even though only a handful actually appreciate it. But what can you do?

    Either deal with it, give up alchemy all together; or... run an anti-secrets campaign and try to sway the masses (which ive tried before using guilt-trip psycology but it didnt work)
    Join me; on a voyage of stupidity, and self discovery: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=vccZSHroTG4

  5. #5
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    @Florius
    No one can tell me that one has to do or find out all on your own
    I agree, alchemy seems to be a solitary endeavour. Very rare ? are collaborations.

    @JDP
    The cold, hard fact is that none of them wanted to give for free what it had cost them so much to attain and from which they were deriving personal advantage
    Yep it certainly seems that way, even though they bang on about the selfless nature of the work.
    Its the maze of contradictions from different authors all proclaiming to know the truth that really got my goat.
    Why write anything at all...

    @Elixir
    Literally NO one is willing to talk to be about this 'permenant water' or 'boiled dew'.
    No one has EVER told me what their starting matter is. EVER! It is an incredibly frustrating game to play. I still openly share; even though only a handful actually appreciate it. But what can you do?
    I share in private with those who are trustworthy. I don't mind sharing my work as long as my trust isn't abused.
    If you spent years of your life for something, you want to know whoever you share it with won't tell others or use your work as they're own.

  6. #6
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    @ Kibric

    Yep it certainly seems that way, even though they bang on about the selfless nature of the work.
    Its the maze of contradictions from different authors all proclaiming to know the truth that really got my goat.
    Why write anything at all...

    Possibly the maze of contradictions is only in your perception of what
    they wrote ... between "Alchemists" there may be no contradictions at all.

    When the Paradoxes that we find in Alchemic writings cease to exist it is then
    that we are gaining a true understanding of the Great Work.

    Perhaps the more affinity we have with The Force the more the easier this
    understanding will come to us of this Sacred/Divine Work ........
    This is what some of the Ancient Masters have suggested.

    Some members might say Baloney ............

    Other members might say that as the Baloney meter goes up true understanding
    goes DOWN.

    Just some thoughts for the day.

  7. #7
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    Yes it is very confusing. It is hard to know which is the proper Prima Materia to start with? Then there are all the elaborate Philosophical Processes which follow?
    Last edited by Seraphim; 4 Weeks Ago at 03:07 AM.

  8. #8
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    There is also the possibility to gain pleasure from just doing "something" in the lab. The journey itself can be a reward.

    There are a lot of paths, ways and viewpoints not only in this forums, but in a lot of books as well. But I guess that's part of the problem.

    Of course it depends a lot on the question why you are doing alchemy. And if you know the reason, it won't change very easily.

    "Don't search for the castle of the grail, it must find you."
    But that doesn't mean doing nothing at all will lead you to a goal.

  9. #9
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    @ Kibric

    I agree. Trust is a must in this game. Zoas shared some revealing secrets with me a couple years ago which ive always kept close to the chest out of respect for his generosity. There is a lot of work, time, heartache and anguish that goes into Our Work; and its not fair to just trump it around for free, it does undermine the significant effort that we as alchemists have committed ourselves too.

    I DO however believe that spagyrics and high spagyrics and other easy diy medicines should be advertised more openly; and that humanity should be receiving a benefit from our works in some way.

    Volatized Salts are supposedly very effective, potent medicines that can even reduce the size of tumors ect... and this is something everyone should learn how to prepare in highschool chemistry (IMO).

    With love.
    Join me; on a voyage of stupidity, and self discovery: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=vccZSHroTG4

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by elixirmixer View Post

    Volatized Salts are supposedly very effective, potent medicines that can even reduce the size of tumors ect... and this is something everyone should learn how to prepare in highschool chemistry (IMO).

    With love.
    As soon as the usefulness is empirically proven and there is no risk in accidentally poisoning or endangering young inexperienced people, maybe. Ingesting stuff in a school lab is always a danger. There are other experiments going on in those always reused flasks you know?

    But chemistry won't go the long spagyrical way anyway, but use the readily available volatile salts in the first place instead. Their health effects however are well researched.

    As well as official spagyrical remedies BTW. They found no significant effect beyond the placebo. On the other hand that's the case with quite some other medicines of the canonical science.

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