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Thread: What exactly is “Immortality” and/or “Eternal Life”?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awani View Post
    "Those who say they will die first and then rise are in error. If they do not first receive the resurrection while they live, when they die they will receive nothing.” - Gospel of Philip

    So it is not only possible. The point is that if you do not rise in life, how can you rise in death?



    Whilst I do not reject the concept nor claim it impossible, I do however mistrust its usage. No one on this Earth can claim knowledge of the afterlife (well they can, but I would be doubtful... although I could not be certain such claims were incorrect as I have no experience myself). We can only have models, but based on my own research and experience and long nights thinking about it my conclusion is that The Death is not something one should miss out on. If you are ready you won't need to bother with too much bardo-bureaucracy anyway. And if you are not ready then you will not be able to achieve any hack anyway. So in this sense it is moot.

    However if you imply that this hack projects the individual to some "other" realm that cannot ever be reached by the normal avenues (even if you are "ready" to leave Samsara) then I guess it could have a purpose. But without knowing (which we cannot) the true state of affairs, there is a great risk one would end up in limbo. So I would be careful playing with such a hack.

    This brings to mind another topic that works as a good allegory. There is a tendency these days - and it has been discussed here in the forums as well - to brew ayahuasca without the Purge (vomit) effect. This is done to make it a more comfortable experience, but what I personally am astonished regarding this, is the lack of understanding regarding the validity of the Purge itself. The Purge, when drinking ayahuasca, is the peak moment often of the evening. The Purge is the great cleanser of the body and soul. The Purge is the great teacher. The Purge is ayahuasca, in fact ayahuasca is sometimes called La Purga.

    So with Death... death is a purge. Why would you want to avoid this experience?

    -----------------

    My philosophy has always been that the meaning of life is death. Without death there is no meaning, which means that immortality gives life less meaning. On the grand perspective we are all immortal anyway, but if I am talking about this physical Earth body then we are not... and we should not even strive to be. The great thing about Breaking Bad is that it has an ending, the worst thing about Coronation Street or some other never ending TV series is that it NEVER ends. I think the beauty lies in the brief moment we are here.

    Also I don't think there is any memory erasure. Here are a few allegories to explain how I see it.

    When we wake up from a dream we remember the dream, but when we go to bed again the next night and dream again we usually don't - in this new dream - remember that other dream we had. Sometimes when I read a book I begin thinking about some other book I read, and this always results in me having to re-read a few pages because I did not pay attention.

    Once I wake up from my dream I can remember all my dreams. Once I stop reading my book I can remember all books.

    Its not really about avoiding death, but escaping the cycle of reincarnation.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glauber View Post
    Its not really about avoiding death, but escaping the cycle of reincarnation.
    That was what I was talking about. You cannot "escape" Samsara. You can of course be liberated from it. But what was suggested earlier - if I understand it - was the concept of becoming liberated "without" physical death. This was what I said was dangerous.

    Don’t let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.


  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awani View Post
    That was what I was talking about. You cannot "escape" Samsara. You can of course be liberated from it. But what was suggested earlier - if I understand it - was the concept of becoming liberated "without" physical death. This was what I said was dangerous.
    The whole point I was making is that (a sort of) death IS necessary for attaining "immortality in time", as Glauber referred to it (if one is so inclined, it is not the only available path). But there are more ways to "die" than the prevalent manner we are accustomed to. Maybe what I mean can be understood or at least inferred by attentively reading my previous posts on this thread. Death as we know it is the default option, because we have not yet found more "friction-less" ways to change. Death is essentially "life in search of change". Death is the "opposite" of Birth, and they both only pertain to form/geometry/structural integrity/persona/identity/etc. Life, however, has NO opposite.

  4. #24
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andro View Post
    Life, however, has NO opposite.
    Yes it does, perhaps not in English. That is just word play. When you "see" life you can also "see" its opposite.

    Don’t let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.


  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awani View Post
    Yes it does, perhaps not in English.
    No it doesn't

    Quote Originally Posted by Awani View Post
    That is just word play.
    No it isn't

    Life/Awareness/Being has no beginning, no end and no opposite. It is UN-created and UN-destructible.

    It's the very essence of Non-Duality, especially for those who are directly acquainted with this state.

    But yes, we don't have the appropriate linguistic tools to properly convey such concepts, so verbal approximations will have to suffice.

  7. #27
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    The opposite of UN-destructible is IN-destructible. The opposite of "no beginning" is "a beginning". You can always find an opposite. And even if you cannot I don't think that would reveal anything.

    Don’t let the delusion of reality confuse you regarding the reality of the illusion.


  8. #28
    What is all-encompassing indeed can have no opposite.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Sternbach View Post
    What is all-encompassing indeed can have no opposite.
    I agree with this. Whats divine can only be between opposites.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Glauber View Post
    I agree with this. Whats divine can only be between opposites.
    Right. It is the origin and final destination of the latter. The wand between the two serpents of the caducaeus.

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